Moneh-Amritdhari Interactions: Give Your Opinions

[Guest Singhnee]

I used to be a moni. However, having been Amritdhari for just a few years now, it's increasingly difficult to understand how to interact with non-Amritdharis in a way which they which to be interacted with.

Often times Amritdharis will be wrongly judged as being unfriendly or judgemental because they do not go out of their way to smile at or speak to non-Amritdharis, for example. There is a lot of pressure here, and a lot of misunderstanding.

I can't remember how I perceived things before I was Amritdhari. So I'm calling on non-Amritdharis here; generally, what are your expectations of Gursikhs? Do you want or expect them to come over to you and have a friendly conversation, and about what? Or are you happy that people do their own thing without looking your way?

Really just trying to bridge this gap for myself. It's important to be as inviting as possible.

[Guest Anongram101]

I used to be a moni. However, having been Amritdhari for just a few years now, it's increasingly difficult to understand how to interact with non-Amritdharis in a way which they which to be interacted with.

Often times Amritdharis will be wrongly judged as being unfriendly or judgemental because they do not go out of their way to smile at or speak to non-Amritdharis, for example. There is a lot of pressure here, and a lot of misunderstanding.

I can't remember how I perceived things before I was Amritdhari. So I'm calling on non-Amritdharis here; generally, what are your expectations of Gursikhs? Do you want or expect them to come over to you and have a friendly conversation, and about what? Or are you happy that people do their own thing without looking your way?

Really just trying to bridge this gap for myself. It's important to be as inviting as possible.

Well its going to be difficult, since mona will have a different value system.

1. To have a drink, and to enjoy a nice meal (99% of the time non-veg) with friends & family. We are strongly encouraged to avoid the company of meat eaters and consumers of alcohol.

2. To have a drink and a meal in different venues with friends & family. Whereas you/we will feel guilty about this, even if we are having a 100% veg meal with a softdrink, since we are doing the company of manmukhs/nirguru's etc in a non-religious venue i.e. restaurant, conference

3. To engage in sporting/physical activites that your/our bana may obstruct i.e. swimming, skiing

4. To make the effort to be sociable with a variety of people, which includes smiling, and taking an interest in the other person, without pre-judging. A true modern day Gursikh, does pre-judge a person as a mona.

5. To be well balanced, moderate, kind, yet focused on career/life aspirations - without needing a crutch of religion, this view is shared by many mona. Mona will consider it a mark of distinction to be successful in life, based on their self believe. You/we call this manmukhi.

So its very difficult, most social conversations revolve around 1) food & drink in different venues 2) Holidays, where people go to the beach, swimming pool etc. 3) About other people, i.e. other mona 4) About life/career aspirations.

The only thing you could talk about is relationships, but I strongly recommend you do not do this, as this quickly descends into light sexual banter.

Best thing to do is to carry on as you are, you have nothing in common with mona.

Declaration: I am almost 10 years amritdari, and until recently was thinking about cutting my kesh, and becoming a mona. But after seeking help on this forum, I have strongly reconsidered (Thanks ms514). One of the reasons i felt that way was, I felt cut off from 99.999% of humanity.

So I say to you, keep doing what your doing. It will be impossible for you to please both worlds, fellow sikhs, and mona (sikh & non-sikh).

[simran345]

I used to be a moni. However, having been Amritdhari for just a few years now, it's increasingly difficult to understand how to interact with non-Amritdharis in a way which they which to be interacted with.

Often times Amritdharis will be wrongly judged as being unfriendly or judgemental because they do not go out of their way to smile at or speak to non-Amritdharis, for example. There is a lot of pressure here, and a lot of misunderstanding.

I can't remember how I perceived things before I was Amritdhari. So I'm calling on non-Amritdharis here; generally, what are your expectations of Gursikhs? Do you want or expect them to come over to you and have a friendly conversation, and about what? Or are you happy that people do their own thing without looking your way?

Really just trying to bridge this gap for myself. It's important to be as inviting as possible.

Hmm, don't get me wrong penji but it sounds like ur trying too hard and to justify yourself that now you are an Amritdhari you have to please others to judge u are nice or a caring person.

Just be yourself, think logically, why are u going to go up to people you don't know for no reason? If there becomes situations where u have eye or face contact on passing just smile if u want if they look at u.

Carry on communicating with the people you already know eg: family friends etc circles. What's wrong with smiling? We don't expect nothing but just some understanding as we are human too. Obviously u don't need to go into wrong social places, clubs pubs etc. but I personally feel because one is Amritdhari everything just doesn't stop. Your emotions bhavna will still be there. So u will get happiness sadness anger joy still. Just because one is mona or moni or jo v hai, doesn't mean they drink do all wrong things etc. you are lucky you have been given the daat of becoming Amritdhari, so just be tension free and love all. You will learn as u go along ur journey, things don't change overnight. Just focus on naam and Akal purukh, and if u see your friends just be normal, say hi hello ask about them n wats goin on, their welfare, but don't talk about the wrong stuff. And they will also ask your welfare too, and be happy and proud that they have a friend with pure soul as u. Nimrata is the keyword.

Don't force yourself to be something you can't. Like our Gurus saw God in all, Hanji rehat maryada ch reho but God is everywhere and that's wat Sikhi teaches us. Equality and to treat all with same love. You never know your attributes guhn may help somebody else too and they may want to become Amritdhari too one day. You know a lot of moneh look at Amritdharis n think woww this person is a great soul and wish they too were. And they too want to experience their company. I used to have Some friends, before takin Amrit they were so nice and helpful and like brothers n sisters. But once they started changing they were completely different. It is gud the took Amrit, but they were like totally different, didn't feel no care or love from them at all. They would only sit with Amritdharis or money they selected. And that was so hurtful, being cut off n made to feel so low. They had no nimrata, it was always abt them n become so noisy n loud and direct with accusations. So in end I just left coz if ur gonna do that n treat people like dirt that's not wise either. Bit of courtesy makes ones day n gives others hope too. Just don't let ahankar get to you so that it harms others. Leave it to God. And don't judge people or say to them ur bad not doin this that BLA bla, as that will push them away from God. The only way they will want to learn or get nearer to the daat u got is from ur reflections and being in some contact with u. Even it's just greetings or being genuinely concerned, coz u come in contact with moneh all life, be it teachers doctors nurses business people, the world is full of different people. Think insaniyat humanity that's wat our Gurus did to spread the Sikhi

Maf karo je Kuch galt likea hove. Just my own personal opnion ji.

[ms514]

VAHEGURU JI KA KHALSA, VAHEGURU JI KI FATEH

Sounds about normal. Think about it: your lifestyle is different, your day to day life is different, your focus is different, your priorities are different. There is not much in common you would have with others who do not share the same outlook in life. Interacting with those interested in the same priorities, regardless of mona/amritdhari would be easy - you have common grounds to speak on. Otherwise, it is as if you are interacting with another culture or lifestyle that you are not interested in.

Nothing to get too worried about. It is also a sign that you are progressing towards a more Gurmat centered life. As simran345 said above, Gurbani says:

ਆਸਾ ਮਹਲਾ ੫ ॥

Aasaa Mehalaa 5 ||

Aasaa, Fifth Mehl:

ਸਾਚਿ ਨਾਮਿ ਮੇਰਾ ਮਨੁ ਲਾਗਾ ॥

Saach Naam Maeraa Man Laagaa ||

My mind is attached to the True Name.

ਲੋਗਨ ਸਿਉ ਮੇਰਾ ਠਾਠਾ ਬਾਗਾ ॥੧॥

Logan Sio Maeraa Thaathaa Baagaa ||1||

My dealings with other people are only superficial. ||1||

ਬਾਹਰਿ ਸੂਤੁ ਸਗਲ ਸਿਉ ਮਉਲਾ ॥

Baahar Sooth Sagal Sio Moulaa ||

Outwardly, I am on good terms with all;

ਅਲਿਪਤੁ ਰਹਉ ਜੈਸੇ ਜਲ ਮਹਿ ਕਉਲਾ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥

Alipath Reho Jaisae Jal Mehi Koulaa ||1|| Rehaao ||

But I remain detached, like the lotus upon the water. ||1||Pause||

ਮੁਖ ਕੀ ਬਾਤ ਸਗਲ ਸਿਉ ਕਰਤਾ ॥

Mukh Kee Baath Sagal Sio Karathaa ||

By word of mouth, I talk with everyone;

ਜੀਅ ਸੰਗਿ ਪ੍ਰਭੁ ਅਪੁਨਾ ਧਰਤਾ ॥੨॥

Jeea Sang Prabh Apunaa Dhharathaa ||2||

But I keep God clasped to my heart. ||2||

ਦੀਸਿ ਆਵਤ ਹੈ ਬਹੁਤੁ ਭੀਹਾਲਾ ॥

Dhees Aavath Hai Bahuth Bheehaalaa ||

I may appear utterly terrible,

ਸਗਲ ਚਰਨ ਕੀ ਇਹੁ ਮਨੁ ਰਾਲਾ ॥੩॥

Sagal Charan Kee Eihu Man Raalaa ||3||

But my mind is the dust of all men's feet.

ਨਾਨਕ ਜਨਿ ਗੁਰੁ ਪੂਰਾ ਪਾਇਆ ॥

Naanak Jan Gur Pooraa Paaeiaa ||

Servant Nanak has found the Perfect Guru.

Ang 384, Sahib Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji.

[Guest GuptSewa]

Vaheguroo Ji,

When I was coming into Sikhi, I found that interacting with Amritdharis was at times like trying to get blood out of a stone. I found some to be exclusive, not friendly, not welcoming or embracing when all I wanted was the Sangat of Gursikhs to aid me on my journey.

You have to remember that we're representing the Dharam. So when people look or want to interact with us, it's Sikhi they was to interact with. Alot of the time, it can be quite daunting for non-GurSikhs, and a smile or the latter making nice conversation (about anything) with the person is a really nice thing to do.

Even now, I see GurSikhs have an almost exclusive, superiority vibe about them, when all non-Sikhs want to do is have their Sangat. How do we expect to break down barriers if we look unapproachable?

It's important to be as inviting as possible

So to sum up, my expectations of GurSikhs is higher. Because they represent something higher..

My 2 cents.

[Guest Jacfsing2]

I used to be a moni. However, having been Amritdhari for just a few years now, it's increasingly difficult to understand how to interact with non-Amritdharis in a way which they which to be interacted with.

Often times Amritdharis will be wrongly judged as being unfriendly or judgemental because they do not go out of their way to smile at or speak to non-Amritdharis, for example. There is a lot of pressure here, and a lot of misunderstanding.

I can't remember how I perceived things before I was Amritdhari. So I'm calling on non-Amritdharis here; generally, what are your expectations of Gursikhs? Do you want or expect them to come over to you and have a friendly conversation, and about what? Or are you happy that people do their own thing without looking your way?

Really just trying to bridge this gap for myself. It's important to be as inviting as possible.

Just be your normal self, but realize that you have a standard to live by as you represent the Guru now, not just to other Sikhs or monas, but to all people,(in the same way fake babas are shown through their followers), and that ultimately means the hardest thing as an Amritdhari is to treat a mona as a human being rather than someone who likes sinning. The stereotype of Amritdhari is mostly true, (especially if you are AKJ-no offense to Bhai Randhir Singh), http://www.sikh24.com/2013/10/09/top-10-reasons-sikh-children-become-apostate/#.VL7VUDAo7qA

Read #8 and #9, an example is the whole Akal Takht fight in the summer of 2014, the event was shown with all "leaders" as Amritdhari and as crazy mad people who enjoy playing with swords. That event has created a massive distrust in the Khalsa and Amrit Sanchars have dropped in a lot of places and non-Sikhs (who would've became Sikhs) decided they didn't want to join this path(Amritdhari) because of a few people misrepresenting the Khalsa.

Just imagine how great it would be to know that you were someone's inspiration to take Amrit, that your life and conduct was able to give someone Mukti and save them from millions of lives. More important know how depressed you would feel that it was YOUR misconduct that led someone to not take Amrit or that YOUR bad actions stopped potential non-Sikhs from ever reaching the Guru. (It's not about you, it's about Guru Sahib).

The person in this video became a Sikh,(Amritdhari), because a Mona decided to do some extra Sewa.

I don't know the exact line from Bhai Gurdas Di Vaaran, but there is a line that says 1 Sikh equals a Sikh, 2 Sikhs equal Sangat, and 5 Sikhs equal Guru Sahib, so you represent the Guru everywhere.

[Guest amritchela]

most amritdharies are too chamallio

they get chip on shoulder in seeing monas

when i was mona i never saw difference but would always have inner respect for any turban sikh

now i have my pagh and even i look down at paghwaley with cut beards.............I know that's bad...but it make me realise i have chip on shoulder after taking amrit along with the singhs i hang around with

I have made comment to them a few time that we being judgemental and brahmanfying by talking down to others

but they just laugh and say i'm not a pakha sikh yet

dont know why god test me like this

makes me feel sad many times

I was never judgemental when i was mona. just had respect for any brothers with kara-brothers with turban even if cut beard-but alway gave more respect to pakha full beard amritdhari singh. respect cuz he took the extra gurus step with confidence-

But I didnt realise that he probably been judgemental to me

nowadays I try not to display my kirpan or make it obvious i'm amritdhari.

everyone can see me as a sikh from my pagh but they don't have to think i'm better sikh because i'm displaying my amrit

[Guest Jacfsing2]

most amritdharies are too chamallio

they get chip on shoulder in seeing monas

when i was mona i never saw difference but would always have inner respect for any turban sikh

now i have my pagh and even i look down at paghwaley with cut beards.............I know that's bad...but it make me realise i have chip on shoulder after taking amrit along with the singhs i hang around with

I have made comment to them a few time that we being judgemental and brahmanfying by talking down to others

but they just laugh and say i'm not a pakha sikh yet

dont know why god test me like this

makes me feel sad many times

I was never judgemental when i was mona. just had respect for any brothers with kara-brothers with turban even if cut beard-but alway gave more respect to pakha full beard amritdhari singh. respect cuz he took the extra gurus step with confidence-

But I didnt realise that he probably been judgemental to me

nowadays I try not to display my kirpan or make it obvious i'm amritdhari.

everyone can see me as a sikh from my pagh but they don't have to think i'm better sikh because i'm displaying my amrit

I know what you mean, that's not the Amrit making you like that. What makes you think this way is that you have something someone else doesn't have, it's why rich people look down on poor people. I hope Vaheguru blesses you with humility.

[jkvlondon]

I know what you mean, that's not the Amrit making you like that. What makes you think this way is that you have something someone else doesn't have, it's why rich people look down on poor people. I hope Vaheguru blesses you with humility.

It sounds a bit like the old joke about the most anti-smoking person in a room is the recent quitter , they become supervigilent and superintolerant kind of 'if I can quit why can't you'. For me, I had amrit when a kid so I always felt junior to everyone and that helped a lot to keep me from spouting off , mind you the temptations are there still...I was superlucky to have good sangat of chardikala Gursikhs who were friends with Mum and Dad, and I learned so much about how Gursikh should be full of love for everyone, nobody's perfect we are all learning.

Of course you keep your rehit, avoid jhoot etc but do it discreetly , no big hoo ha or show , kind of in the style 'tum ko tumra khoob hum ko humra khoob'

[Truth5]

I know what you mean, that's not the Amrit making you like that. What makes you think this way is that you have something someone else doesn't have, it's why rich people look down on poor people. I hope Vaheguru blesses you with humility]

It's trishna-Ego of seva and religiousness. Alot of kirtan jathas get this when they become successful- my father had it Alot sometimes when he sang kirtan.

I'd say this along with inner rehat is the biggest test for amritdharis. Do u think the dress is enough so abandon actual inner rehat, the slaying of the 5 thieves, or realise that the outer garb is supposed to be symbolic of what u are within?

Looking down on others is ego- a theif. If u were not amritshak before, then have compassion for people who choose to live life the way u used to- it's only by Gods grace that u became amritshak anyway.

Count your blessings instead of flaunting them/looking down on those who dont have them.

Guru Nank- the most Beautiful Guru to have ever have lived called himself a lowly worm- so who is Anyone- least of all someone who claims to be His Chela, to think theyre higher than him?

Everything is Him- even fools serve Him- are Him dressed up in costume learning as He wills them to learn. Thats why we always bow at the feet of All- Humility- accepting oneself as Nothing is what keeps us detached.