Lets Not Blame Sikh Leaders

[Big_Tera]

Alot of people have made the comparison on how the Islamic faith is doing so well in terms of numbers and people keeping to their faith. And other religions are going the opposite way.

But that has alot to do with Islam being a compulsory religion in Islamic nations. In muslim countries people have to adhere to the shariah law and their faith in their laws. hence is it any wonder people are practicing Islam more, This is what is keeping Islam going. If it was not for their strict laws and rules in practicing the Islamic faith. Their religion would be under threat also. infact how many muslims would there be if it wasnt for the fact that they take over countries and turn them into Islamic ones and everyone has to follow Islamic ways or the highway?

Take for example Pakistan it is a muslim country every part of life is governed by Islam. So is it any wonder these people stick and practice their faith more then other secular countries. the fact is their is nothing special about Islam. Its the fact that they have made it the law to follow Islam. people dont have a natural fondness for Islam in which they practice it. its the fact that its pushed down peoples throats.

If there were no Islamic countries would Islam survive?

lets not blame our leaders to much. We do not have any Sikh countries as a base to spread the faith. To keep Sikhism going we need to address the Islamic threat of taking over the world. All non muslims need to unite against the Islam fanatics who want to impose their faith on others. They will try to do this wherever they go. be it uk, canada, america india. The real threat is Islam. These people wish to oppress other religions.

[MisterrSingh]

Is Islam encouraging Punjabi people to pour alcohol down their throats? Is Islam instructing us to abort female foetuses? Are they forcing us to splinter off into ever-increasing sects that push us further from Guru Sahib whilst simultaneously elevating business men masquerading as spiritual leaders into prominent positions of the faith? Is Islam responsible for the Punjabi obsession with wealth accumulation at the expense of all other pursuits? Do they force us to waste thousands of pounds / dollars on lavish weddings that barely last a year? Are they responsible for the rise of promiscuity amongst Punjabi youngsters back home and overseas? Has Islam forced its way into my home and stopped me from picking up a gutka and reciting Gurbani?

I've gone on record detailing my distaste for Islam, but this topic is incredible... in all the wrong ways.

BTW, whilst the Islamic threat is genuine in certain respects (NOT in the way the OP has managed to create a mangled link between the struggling Sikh faith and Islamic plans of aggressive expansion), the world is being distracted with this red herring that Islam is out to get us. The REAL threat is the curtailing of our individual freedoms by an ever increasing interfering state; the growing disparity between the rich and the poor; the difficulties in finding jobs for the average man in the western world when industries are being ported to developing countries in order to save on wages, etc. These are the issues that should worry us and give us sleepless nights. Stop reading the red-tops and the broadsheets and watching sensationalistic news reports. They're performing an insidious sleight of hand on your brain and most can't even see what's going on.

If our faith in our Guru was concrete, no Muslim would ever be capable of touching us. The problem is us.

[buddasingh]

Mister Singh bro always wise. Warriors insight with sarbat da bhalla and personal responsibility. Great post to contemplate.

[Big_Tera]

Is Islam encouraging Punjabi people to pour alcohol down their throats? Is Islam instructing us to abort female foetuses? Are they forcing us to splinter off into ever-increasing sects that push us further from Guru Sahib whilst simultaneously elevating business men masquerading as spiritual leaders into prominent positions of the faith? Is Islam responsible for the Punjabi obsession with wealth accumulation at the expense of all other pursuits? Do they force us to waste thousands of pounds / dollars on lavish weddings that barely last a year? Are they responsible for the rise of promiscuity amongst Punjabi youngsters back home and overseas? Has Islam forced its way into my home and stopped me from picking up a gutka and reciting Gurbani?

I've gone on record detailing my distaste for Islam, but this topic is incredible... in all the wrong ways.

BTW, whilst the Islamic threat is genuine in certain respects (NOT in the way the OP has managed to create a mangled link between the struggling Sikh faith and Islamic plans of aggressive expansion), the world is being distracted with this red herring that Islam is out to get us. The REAL threat is the curtailing of our individual freedoms by an ever increasing interfering state; the growing disparity between the rich and the poor; the difficulties in finding jobs for the average man in the western world when industries are being ported to developing countries in order to save on wages, etc. These are the issues that should worry us and give us sleepless nights. Stop reading the red-tops and the broadsheets and watching sensationalistic news reports. They're performing an insidious sleight of hand on your brain and most can't even see what's going on.

If our faith in our Guru was concrete, no Muslim would ever be capable of touching us. The problem is us.

I think you have completely got the wrong idea I was addressing and made your own conclusion on what I was saying instead. Of course problems such as alcohol consumption and and sects ect all that you have mentioned have obviously nothing to do with Islam. I for one never said it was and it would be ludricou to come to such an idea. But on a side note drugs that are coming into Punjab. I would not be surprised if they were coming across the border from Pakistan and not from India itself.

Now lets get back to my main point of the thread.

This is that Islam is doing so well in terms of practicing muslims is because their are vast numbers of Islamic countries. The reason other religions have declined is because there are not many Religious countries. Alot of people say how Islam is growing so fast and why they adhere to their religion more. My answer is that it is due to the Islamic nations which support the religion and oppress others.

Whats rights do non muslims have in Islamic countries?

P.s I am not mangling anything. anything mangling is in your own head not mine.

Muslims have it easy compared to other religions because their religion is ingrained in their laws so it is alot easier for them to follow heir religion in their islamic countries.

[MisterrSingh]

P.s I am not mangling anything. anything mangling is in your own head not mine.

You don't even know what arguments you're trying to make. You're just throwing stuff at a wall and hoping some of it sticks. There's absolutely no coherence and logic in your opinions that can be followed from A to B by any sane person.

You're jumping from issues of Sikh autonomy, to levels of religious adherence, to the subject of Islamist expansionism.

Islam is a political movement masquerading as a religion. That's all that needs to be said about why it's in such "great" shape. What it can't achieve through social and political means, it forces through via the fear of destruction and hellfire at the hands of its bloodthirsty followers and eventual wrath of their "God."

There's NOTHING to learn from Muslims on how to improve our situation. Controlling followers through deceit and fear is not an example to be emulated. How many of these godless 5ulleh do you envisage entering Sachkhand? How many? Because ultimately that's what being a person of God should be about: reuniting with the One. Everything else, as distracting and as important as it may seem to us in the hullabaloo of human existence, is irrelevant.

[Big_Tera]

You don't even know what arguments you're trying to make. You're just throwing stuff at a wall and hoping some of it sticks. There's absolutely no coherence and logic in your opinions that can be followed from A to B by any sane person.

You're jumping from issues of Sikh autonomy, to levels of religious adherence, to the subject of Islamist expansionism.

Islam is a political movement masquerading as a religion. That's all that needs to be said about why it's in such "great" shape. What it can't achieve through social and political means, it forces through via the fear of destruction and hellfire at the hands of its bloodthirsty followers and eventual wrath of their "God."

There's NOTHING to learn from Muslims on how to improve our situation. Controlling followers through deceit and fear is not an example to be emulated. How many of these godless 5ulleh do you envisage entering Sachkhand? How many? Because ultimately that's what being a person of God should be about: reuniting with the One. Everything else, as distracting and as important as it may seem to us in the hullabaloo of human existence, is irrelevant.

Its quite simple what I am saying. I am talking about why Islam is doing so well in terms of people practicing the religion. Its not rocket science. The only person who is jumping from topic to topic is you by claiming I am blaming Muslims for Sikh issues. go figure.

You also say Islam is not a real threat. Tell that to non muslims in pakistan and many other muslims countries. At how they are suffering and being oppressed. But I guess thats all a conpiracy by the newspapers and media and all we need to worry about is how india oppresses religions instead. Islam is against all religions not just Sikhism.

They will soon try and turn UK into a muslim country. Wake up and smell the coffee.

[MisterrSingh]

I've covered all your arguments in both posts of mine. I can't spell it out for you.

[Kira]

Address the Islamic threat? How exactly is Islam going around stopping people learning about Sikhism? Pretty sure there isn't a squad of muslims going around Hounslow on the look out for a poor Sikh with a Gotka out?

It's far too easy to persuade someone to your side once you simply realize the fact their disorganized, lack knowledge and aren't practicing. Sorry but the responsibility for the state of the Panth lies in the leaders and the Sikh nation alike. No one's stopping Sikhs in the west practicing. Certainly not any Muslim.

MisterSingh Pretty much summed it up rightly.

[Big_Tera]

I've covered all your arguments in both posts of mine. I can't spell it out for you.

You basically had nothing to say. and now Kira has come to do some brown nosing.

[Big_Tera]

Address the Islamic threat? How exactly is Islam going around stopping people learning about Sikhism? Pretty sure there isn't a squad of muslims going around Hounslow on the look out for a poor Sikh with a Gotka out?

It's far too easy to persuade someone to your side once you simply realize the fact their disorganized, lack knowledge and aren't practicing. Sorry but the responsibility for the state of the Panth lies in the leaders and the Sikh nation alike. No one's stopping Sikhs in the west practicing. Certainly not any Muslim.

MisterSingh Pretty much summed it up rightly.

''How exactly is Islam going around stopping people learning about Sikhism''

Go to a Muslim country like afganistan and ask why Sikhs want to leave. Do you think its because they dont like the weather? or ask Christians in Nigeria. the list goes on. what planet on you living on?

Every religion is being oppressed by Islamic fanatics. I stand by what I said. but if you beg to differ that is your prerogative.

The topic title may be a bit misleading I understand. But my point is that Sikhs or just about every non muslim religion is not doing aswell in Islam is because of the factors I have mentioned above. Hence our leaders cant be blamed entirely. Because Islam has an unfair advantage over other religions.