Are You Prepared For Sacrifice?

[Guest punjab]

I see most of the forum members are very young people ,some even as young as 13,and it is very heartening to note this.

Ive even seen many members using big usernames like Khalistan,Khalistan Zindabad,Khalsaforce and others.

I have seen all that happened in 1984 and afterwards and gone through all those situations.

No offence to any one it is just out of curiousity that I ask how many members are actually prepared to die ,god forbid, if such a situation like the one in 1984 and afterwards does arise again ?

Say this truthfully from the bottom of your hearts .How many of you are actually prepared to come to Punjab and fight for Sikh rights or Khalsa Raj ?

As Sant ji used to say without giving our heads Khalsa Raj is not possible.

It is very easy to sit behind a computer and write big and catchy slogans about Khalistan or Khalsa Raj or Human Rights.

We are in the heart of everything ie in Punjab so would like to know your viewponts.

[Long live the khalsa 0]

Hopefully one day with maharajs blessings

[MAX 3]

I pray that such a day will never come.

I pray that human beings will stop killing other human beings.

I pray that 'Khalistanis' realise that Khalistan needs to be the very world in which we inhabit - a land of democracy, secularism and tolerance - and must be made through virtuous deeds, not through an over-zealous desire to pick up a sword when the Tenth Master clearly stated that it is the very last resort when "all other means have been extinguished".

In today's world, we have infinitely more "means" than Guru Gobind Singh Ji, his contemporaries and successors ever had.

[Lionchild 4]

I pray that human beings will stop killing other human beings.

that wont be happening in the forseable future.. but at least we can prevent or stop anymore suffuring from happening!

[er_gurjot 0]

sat sri akal

it has been pretty long someone has initiated this topic again.....R V READY TO SACRIFICE OURSELF!!

sir u r very correct in ur views about slogans.....similar to ur views i ask dat why v always think of bloodshed??? why KHALISTAN all d times...why not do something for our quam here in india or wherever v r?? is d voilence unavoidable????

in my views the durty politicians of state r necessary of plight of our quam....i don point towards gandhi . indra an all ....they were not our people....m pointing to=wards OUR SO CALLED SIKH POLITICIANS....bout whom i don think its important to name..u kno dem well....so why not cleanse them first???

IS AK47 AN ANSWER TO ALL PROBLEMS????take a lesson from kashmir...somaliya....sierra leone....LTTE..an many more.THINK OF PEACE...BE UNITED ...AND THE WORLD IS URS

BHUL CHUK MAF

WAHWGURU JI KA KHALSA

WAHEGURU JI KI FATEH

[Guest]

Considering the vast majority of Sikhs are unable to live for Sikhi (keep strict Amrit Vela Rehat, Simran and Bani all day, as well as outer Rehat) when/if the time comes (and I am sure many people will attempt to convince themselves otherwise) they most certainly will not be able to die for Sikhi.

[ParnaamShaheedaNu 2]

We need to live for Sikhi

before we think of dying for Sikhi

We need to know the value of every drip of amrit naam, kirpa, every sweet bakshish of the Guru's pyari rehat, our history, our mahaan shaheeds, our beant beant beant Guru sahibs, our spiritual Father & Mother

dying just seems like an easy way out

but it wasn't, it isn't, shaheeds were ripped into peices and killed in the most brutal ways.

If you have no rehat, you wont be able to handle that

If you do have rehat, you're lightening the load of this Earth

[Guest]

Pyare jio ,

Im the one who started this topic.

I for one would never wish violence to return in my motherland,Punjab but what if it is thrust upon us?

er gurjot ,you and I are both in Punjab ,do you want to say that all those thousands who were picked up by police and army ,amritdhari and non amritdhari and then killed in fake encounters all wanted violence or bloodshed?

Those innocent woman,children raped or killed by army,police all wanted violence or blood shed ?

All those innocent Sikhs killed in november,1984 in delhi,kanpur,bokaro and many places in India wanted violence?

Or is it that you are saying that fake encounters,extra judicial killings did not take place ?

Can you deny the fact that RSS and other kattarr hindu organisations are meddling in the internal religious affairs of Sikhs and trying to prove that Sikhs and their Gurus are hindus through all their non sense propoganda?

A Khalsa or a true Sikh will never watch silently people being oppressed and their basic human rights being suppressed.

Perhaps you are living in a city or you are too young to understand all that happened in villages of Punjab in the 1980/90's .

Try to understand and find out what actually happened .You may be too young to understand as the new generation of sikhs have been hinduised or indianised .It is not their fault .All this is happening in a slow and systematic way.

Suppose somewhere in Punjab you have 2 stages at some place .On one stage there is some girl dancing and on the other stage some people are talking about the truth.Where will the gathering be more ?

I bet where the girl is dancing.But why ?Because in today's punjab young sikhs are slaves of the media .What they are shown daily they believe only that is true .We can say Bollywood culture.We are slaves of this culture .

Im not anti hindu but has any hindu raised any voice against the atrocities commited by punjab police or their Cats and dogs on innocent Sikhs ?Here Im talking about innocent sikhs apart from the resistance fighters.

Cats and dogs of Punjab Police went about looting,killing,raping and blamed some crimes on the resistance fighters though they were actually men of PP in plain clothes.

Kee zameer mar chuki aa tuhadi sab dee ?

Even peaceful demonstrations and crying for human rights is not possible in Punjab.

Just raise the slogan of Khalistan or Sikh Raj ,you are either arrested or killed.

Khalistan zindabad or Raj Karega Khalsa is like truth will triumph or as it is said in India Satyamev Jayate.

And truth will ultimately triumph.

Even High court has said raising Khalistan slogans is no crime.

Whenever you come across some Punjab police person for let's say a traffic offence or checking dont you try avoid argument or bribe your way thru to avoid being taken to police station.

Corruption and bribery is also a sort slavery .

Though you may be free physically temporarily .Are you truly free mentally ?

Ask yourself this question seriously.

Yes that is true the so called Sikh leaders like Badal have betrayed us and who votes from them ?

Sorry if Ive hurt someone but truth is truth .

[Lion(LK)King 0]

I agree with max toa certain extent. When people speak of Khalistan the question of weapons, ammunition voilence comes up.

We justify it using the famous quote of Guru Gobind Singh Ji -

When ALL other means of negotiation fails, it is righteous to raise the sword.

Today, are we ready to use ALL other means? Remember ALL is a very huge word. It's not, using 1 resort, 2 resort, 5 resorts. It's when ALL other means of nefotiations fail.

I'm not saying you should take off your Kirpan (that would be stupid), but remember that it is ONLY ot be used when all other means fail.Instead of picking up the weapons (today).... Why don't everyone claimign to struggle for Khalistan approcuh their local MPs, European parilaiments, human rights activits fighting for self-determiniation. These people are true Sikhs. Those juming on weapons as their first resort are not.

I know I will be jumped at for reminding everyone that weapons is not the firs, second or third resort. Do what some oter sisters and brothers are doing - fight for human rights first, self-determination, diplomatically.

Bhull Chukk Maaf

[Guest PunjabSingh]

Yes,diplomacy and fight for human rights is a must .

Nobody is in favour of violence .

But what if violence is thrust upon us ,then ?

Not all people including women,children and old were in favour of violence when they were picked up by Punjab Police,Army from their homes and then tortured,raped and killed in police stations and fields across Punjab.

Young people were killed in fake encounters.

Were all the unarmed Sikhs killed in 1984 in Delhi,Haryana,Kanpur etc in favour of violence or bloodshed ?

But now is the time to strenghten the hands of parties like Shiromani Akali Dal(Amritsar) who did suffer a lot during the Sikh struggle and who are at present campaigning for Sikh Raj through peaceful and democratic means for the time being .

[KFI 0]

Whatever you people said, i agree to some things and i dont agree to others.

The people who are ready to give their life for sikhi will, the sikhs who cannot bear any zulum against their sikhi brothers, sisters will do something. Yes, it is always easy to talk about this stuff on the internet, to say I will do this, I will kill him for doing that, this, etc. But, let us not forget there are many people on this forum and in sikhism that are ready to give qurbani for the panth. We should not say Its good if deep in our hearts we dont agree, we should simply say we dont agree to these people and stick with it, but we should also not degrade the people that think its right and are ready to sacrifice their lives for the sikh panth.

The well known quote "It is righteous to raise the sword.."

Well, it's been 22 years since 84, What justice has been done? What means are still left? What has the government done so far? What rights and compensation was given to families of 84?

The extent of the Hell india had caused to sikh citizens in india can never be described but dont make the mistake to disagree with the people who take the pains of sisters who were raped in the middle of the street, mothers who were gang-raped in the street with their own family watching, the pain of these people are taken straight in the hearts of these sikhs who are willing to give their wonderful and rich sikhi jeevans for their sake and the sake of fallen sikhs in the panth in the past and now.

Lastly, there is no point to make such threads or questions because the people who want to do something, will eventually do it when the time comes. For all the people who talk, they will continue to talk, all the people who argue and say bad things about khalistan and things not being possible, etc will do what they are destined to do by Akal Purkh, but the ones who are told something else by Akal Purkh will continue to do it, and will continue to make Khalistan and continue to help awake and rise sikhs

The spiritual warriors are ready and the weapons are loaded, they are in await of panth's slave and sevadar Sant-Sipahi Baba Sant Jarnail Singh Ji Khalsa Bhindranwale to give them the go sign.

KHALISTAN ZINDABAD

[Guest punjab]

The spiritual warriors are ready and the weapons are loaded, they are in await of panth's slave and sevadar Sant-Sipahi Baba Sant Jarnail Singh Ji Khalsa Bhindranwale to give them the go sign.

KHALISTAN ZINDABAD

Sant ji is not Shaheed ?

By the way what does KFI mean ? Just curious to know .

Raj Karega Khalsa !!

[Lion(LK)King 0]

Yes,diplomacy and fight for human rights is a must .

Nobody is in favour of violence .

But what if violence is thrust upon us ,then ?

Is it today?

I can understand (not saying I disagree or agree) that they did it 22 years ago. But is violence being thrust upon you today?

Not all people including women,children and old were in favour of violence when they were picked up by Punjab Police,Army from their homes and then tortured,raped and killed in police stations and fields across Punjab.

Young people were killed in fake encounters.

Were all the unarmed Sikhs killed in 1984 in Delhi,Haryana,Kanpur etc in favour of violence or bloodshed ?

Yes, these are all huamn rights abuses thast people from Punjab have had to go through. What are you doing about it, except sitting on a chair behind the screen? Have you joined any Human Rights Group (theres loads, ENSAAF, IHMR, SHRG, Citizens for Democracy, the list goes on..)?

I agree, what was going on was wrong. It is still happening to an extent, I agree - but is it happening to everyday citizens today? If your answer is yes, I suggest you go to Punjab and check it out for yourself. I'm not saying its all solved and sorted. THere is much space for improvement, and encounters still take place but predominantly towards those who do raise the sword.

But now is the time to strenghten the hands of parties like Shiromani Akali Dal(Amritsar) who did suffer a lot during the Sikh struggle and who are at present campaigning for Sikh Raj through peaceful and democratic means for the time being .

Whatever you prioritize bro, as long as you refrain from raising the sword for fun.

1984 was 22 years ago. What happend was horrible. We will never forget what happened, and what happened the subsequent ten years. THose memories have pierced every Sikhs' heart. That still, my dear brother, does not give you any right to raise the sword today, because Sikhs are NOT being persecuted in Punjab today to such an extent as they were 10 years ago.

The people who are ready to give their life for sikhi will, the sikhs who cannot bear any zulum against their sikhi brothers, sisters will do something. Yes, it is always easy to talk about this stuff on the internet, to say I will do this, I will kill him for doing that, this, etc. But, let us not forget there are many people on this forum and in sikhism that are ready to give qurbani for the panth. We should not say Its good if deep in our hearts we dont agree, we should simply say we dont agree to these people and stick with it, but we should also not degrade the people that think its right and are ready to sacrifice their lives for the sikh panth.

Do you want to do qurbani for Panth? Don't take an Ak47 and start shooting people, instead join some human Rights group. I assure you, you will get enough juttiya from only fighting for human rights.

You do not have to quick up shastar to become a shaheed. Become a Shaheed by serving people.

The well known quote "It is righteous to raise the sword.."

Well, it's been 22 years since 84, What justice has been done? What means are still left? What has the government done so far? What rights and compensation was given to families of 84?

Go to European pariliament like many Sikhs are doing. Fight for human Rights. make money and server the sons and daughters of the Shaheeds of 1984.

The extent of the Hell india had caused to sikh citizens in india can never be described but dont make the mistake to disagree with the people who take the pains of sisters who were raped in the middle of the street, mothers who were gang-raped in the street with their own family watching, the pain of these people are taken straight in the hearts of these sikhs who are willing to give their wonderful and rich sikhi jeevans for their sake and the sake of fallen sikhs in the panth in the past and now.

I'm not saying anything whether i agree or disagree with anything. I simply disagree with raising the sword as the resort for the struggle. Just look at Gurdwara reform movement, the mahants shot the Akalis trying to rescue the Gurdware - did they give up?

Did the Akalis give up after tens of thousands fo them being arrested against Indira Bibi's emergency?

As they used to say:

Jo kosh vi karna Shant mey tang de naal karna. Where is this shant mey?

Are you following the ideals of the people you follow?

You do not need to wait for anybody. That wait will be very long.

Do what you got to do, and fight for justice, sef-determination in a peaceful manner. We have already seen how the government of india has tried to interfere in the European Parliament meeting with Sikhs, and trying to prevent Sikhs from gathering at trafalger square last year.

Sikhs are itching GOi in the eyes every time they're protesting peacefully. Everytime Sikhs act like **** and blow stuff up to show their anger, they're laughing their heads off.

Bhull Chukk Maaf

[Guest PunjabSingh]

I agree, what was going on was wrong. It is still happening to an extent, I agree - but is it happening to everyday citizens today? If your answer is yes, I suggest you go to Punjab and check it out for yourself. I'm not saying its all solved and sorted. THere is much space for improvement, and encounters still take place but predominantly towards those who do raise the sword.

For your kind info Im in Punjab but you seem to be outside.

[Guest]

Those who know KFI, know what it is, those who dont, will soon know in the future