Controls Everything?

[SikherOfTheNaam]

Vaaheguroo Jee Kaa Khaalsaa Vaaheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!

Dear Sangat jee,

I have had countless conversations over this subject and if you like to please air your views on the topic. Maharaj controls everything from the way the wind blows to when we are born. However, the question i would like to aks does God give us free will? For example: -

This is a bit drastic but say a guy is a serial killer. Due to his deeds he becomes reincarnated over and over again suffering pain and being further and further away from our father, the creator, the lord - Vaaheguroo :WW: Some could say "oh but God controls everything so you couldn't help but do those actions". However, some could counter argue and say "But God gave us the choice". I really don't know how to make a landing on this, if God has given us free will he knows what were going to the bad actions because he has planned everything and he knows everything before time, now and in the future. One could say we are being punished unfairly due to the fact we can't help commit these evil deeds because even if we have free will God has planned what we are going to do.

I know it is soo wrong to quesiton Vaaheguroo intentions and that he is soo amazing we will never understand him fully but i am really struggling to answer this question. By no means am I quesitoning God and Sikhi at all - its just i was asked this question a long time ago and i would like some guidance into how to find an answer.

I am truly sorry if i offend anyone - this was no my intention and daas is only learning.

Take care,

Khalsa123

[Singhballer]

This is a tricky subject to which i have no knowlege of. :s

So i guess i just wasted this.... can anyone answer to this?

[Ramneet Singh]

very very good question, me and a singh were talking about something similar, and he brought up the idea of us being given free will, but we didnt rly go into detail, should b interesting to see what more knowlegable peoples have to say about thiss.

[Khalsa4ever]

Waheguroo jee ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo jee kee Fateh!

Both. Its all God's will... The underlying laws of God remain constant in either case... If the guy (lets say) stabs the guy, either he lives, or he dies. Either he is injuried slightly, or a lot. He doesn't turn into a frog.

God's will that the universe operates on gives us the realm of possibility of what CAN happen and what CANNOT happen. Beyond that, we make the choice which of those possibilities that we want to entertain, and THAT is our karma.

Waheguroo jee ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo jee kee Fateh!

[TejiKaur]

Gurufateh ji

we all think we have free will but in reality we are all bound. It is a scientific law that each action has a stimulas. Some of our actions are controlled by worldly love lust anger greed or ego (in other words maya), Maya although is in Gods control . At the heart of everything is God so yes God controls all.

When we surrender to God and accept his will than we are free. When we merge with God and our actions are bound by Gods love alone than we are free. Then we forget ego and lust and wordly love. Then we overcome fear of death. When we bow to Gods hukam we are truly free.

pls forgive anything i said wrong ji

bull chuk maff karna ji

waheguru ji ka khalsa

waheguru ji ki fateh

[lakhvir]

waheguruji ka khalsa. waheguruji ki fateh.

pyareo, it's all HUKAM and if you concentrate on japji sahib's mention of HUKAM, it will explain everything – that we know nothing of HUKAM because of our ego, as we want to try and comprehend how HE works. HUKAM is what we live in but what it is, no one can expound. even with a thousand tongues, we cannot even attempt to describe HIS WAYS. when we learn to do what guru ji has commanded us to do – which is the biggest HUKAM in gurbani – is to JAP. that is the introductory message of both japji sahib and of guru granth sahib ji. in the first part of the mool mantar, guru nanak dev ji describes the attributes of WAHEGURU and then instructs us further to JAP (meditate). then the rest of gurbani flows through our being.

it is natural to ask and ponder over what is happening around the world and 99.99% is out of our grasp to understand. we need to thus, give in and submit to the guru and ask HIM to guide us through this incomprehensible and treacherous world-ocean. the world is standing on HUKAM and NAAM alone – the trees stand their ground for centuries, the mountains stay grounded for centures, leaves of trees green and grey and wither, life forms come to birth and pass through death – over and over and over and over – all in HUKAM. nothing is in our control – not even our own breath. if our very breath cannot be understood, we cannot even begin to understand this 'cosmic drama' which guru gobind singh ji describes. even he proclaimed that he has merely come to witness the drama of this world, meditate on HIM and return back to his TRUE HOME.

if you read japji sahib, word for word and focus on them, all your questions will be answered. just focus on the words and then close your eyes and reflect on what the guru has said and witness what happens to you. it's indescribable. this will take time, so try a pauri at a time and sit through with a learned parent, friend or gyani and when HIS GRACE showers on you, your ego (to comprehend HIS WAYS) will disappear and then HUKAM will come to be recognised.

let's follow that example. when we do just the basic – to let the guru worry about what and how this world works, we are relieved of our burden and we can spend more time on focussing on the HUKAM to JAP.

JJ – Just JAP.

waheguruji ka khalsa. waheguruji ki fateh.

[The_Perfect_Student]

I believe that God is always sending messages to us in our brain but most of the times we just listen to our own EGO and follow our own EGO instead of God's message.

Imagine you go tommorrow to kill someone, before you try kill him 100% you will get inner call saying that "Dont do that" that is message from God telling you not to do it, now you can not do it and you will be happy and on other hand you could just follow your own ego and kill him. So i think God gives us a choice.

Its just with any deed, if youre about to do something bad, God inside will always try and stop you by making you feel that its not the right thing but we can ignore his mssage and follow our ego which will obviously lead us to destruction.

What we do are controlled by him, if we dont do simran then that it is under his control but we got most poweful tool which is prayer. I have experienced it myself, i dont do simran or anything. then i pray to God ask him to please make me do simran and after few hours or the next day i end up doing little bit simran trust me it works. Praying to God does wonders, try it. the more you dedicate yourself to guru, do good deeds opposite to your panj chors by practicing, truth, charity, helping others, treating evryone equally the more you will start to realise the Powerful God who is sitting within you. The further we away from light (under deep dark scum of maya) the more we under the influence of our panj chors. and the more we get closer to the truth within us by practing truthful deeds the more we start to realise God and follow him instead of our panj chors

sorry if you have said anything wrong, this is just my personal beliefs

bhul chuk maff

dust of your feet

[1978]

i memba once i was going to a rainsabhi in a coach, and a singh smaked another singh round the hed, and i goes why did u do that? he sed oh well guroo controls everything he made me! i thort EH, its not like that at all , wer on a path, the path to mahraj and on that path there are many ditches, sumtyms we cant see them, but god has gave us a light, the light is guru ji, now we can eaither use the light and walk around the ditch, and save oursleves or we can walk into the ditch, i.e do puteh kam, even tho we know the ditch was there

[THE WARRIOR]

Life, creation and death continues regardless to this you are Attached. So yes to this part of your life you have no control. The five elements, the body is just a loan it eventually just returns to what it was constructed from. During the Loan period it helps to build up a bit of internal interest, this fundamentally is all "you" and all you have left once you drop the physical body.

So to simply put it the loan is controlled, the interest is "yours", it helps to have a smart banker (Guru)

There is no God in heaven plotting the ups and downs of your life, or controlling you via bluetooth etc…. this only happens in Greek mythology.

[SikherOfTheNaam]

Vaaheguroo Jee Kaa Khaalsaa Vaaheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!

Many thanks for the replies but i am still confused. God must control every aspect of our lives - he controls when we breathe etc - everything! If he do have free will to follow our own egos etc. as many people have stated this denies Gods attributes - doesn't it mean you are saying God isn't perfect, the knower and controller of everything? If you say we have free will to do what we want then this makes God unperfect has he doesn't know everything and thus doesn't know everything because you say its up to us? - Theb you coulsd say oh yeah but God controls our free will - but then we don't have free will do we because he controls it. God must control everything- even our future lifetimes that we don't even know of yet - everything is written. It makes me wonder why we are seperated for life times - beaten, scolded, mutalated by jumdooth when we can't even control our own deeds. Also - i was told there are some souls in the world that'll never reach God? How can this be so?! If God controls us on our actions - he's denying us to ever meet him and join sachkhand and be free from the 5 evils etc- so they have been created for fun?! - Why create something just to never meet you - isn't that cruel?

I am soo sorry if i have offended anyone - as this wasn't my intention. - This has really shook me to the foundations.

Many thanks,

VJKK VJKF!