Jatha- Is It Just Like Caste?

[Laadli Fauj]

taksals

nihang dals

deras

all these can be considered jathas

[V]

not really

jus like warring tribes

caste implies order and social hierarchy

jatha bashing is jus feudal warfare, not caste at all

At first I agreed with you. But now that I've thought about it, I think it has become very much like caste, where (generally) an AKJ marries and AKJ and not a taksali (never heard of it, may'be does happen...but I'm ignorant about that...)

Although not hierarchy in a clear way, I believe it does exist in the mind of a lot of people (not all) who belong to a certain jatha - Our jatha is the oldest. Our jatha is the strictest in rehit. Our jatha is this that and the other.

[Bored]

can i be guru gobind singh ji's khalsa and not be apart of a jatha?

[rupinder singh]

can i be guru gobind singh ji's khalsa and not be apart of a jatha?

Hmmmm. That's a tough one! Nowadays people assess your sikhi on where you took amrit and who gave you amrit. If people asked who you took amrit from how many of us would actually say Guru Gobind Singh Ji's Panj Pyaray and how many would say AKJ or Taksaal or Sant XXXX Singh?? I am sure most people will automatically answer with the latter.

We can focus too much on being part of "the jatha" and become almost cult like in our thinking.

[Prem]

Good question.

My thought is that it might sometimes initiate divisions that cause prejudice or bigotry, but it is different from the stupid backward caste system because jathas are based on intellectual / theological disagreements, rather than an intrinsic system of hierarchy, in which no matter who you are as an indvidual, you are condemned to a stupid dividing of humanity simply because of what 'caste' you supposedly belong to.

So put it this way. You can leave and join a jatha. But you cannot 'choose' to leave or join a caste, because the backwardness of Indian society and culture will always view you in the context of caste.

On the other hand, both castes and jathas can dissolve into tribalism, and that is wrong. Especially when followers of one jatha believe they are superior to non-members of their jatha.

It's at that point that the idiotic intolerance of caste can begin to affect their thinking. I am speaking about things like refusing to eat food not cooked by members of their jatha. This is a basic stupidity of the caste system, something that Sikhi was created to destroy, in which the langar is for everyone and represents the rejection of that kind of inhuman and racist logic.

So caste and jatha are two different things. But jatha divisions can echo the stupidity of caste divisions sometimes.

[Bored]

i would like some more input towards my questions above....it seems apne blame other alot for the problems sikhi faces but it looks like apne are the problem to start with.

[KEERPA]

I feel the word 'jatha' in sikhi means a group of gursikhs collectively working to perform a certain task. So there is nuthing wrong in having jathas in the panth.

I second that.

can i be guru gobind singh ji's khalsa and not be apart of a jatha?

yes

I believe a jatha is sorta like a revolution to the problems people are facing from within. Each decade the problems are different. for example lets say in 1890 people thought the huge modern day problem was Sikhs were allowing muslims and hindus worship in the GuruGhar because they were persecuted by both their religious communities for being friends with Sikhs or poor people would only use the Langarhall but were wicked people thinking they could eat for free and never donate or do seva or anything to helpout with the services they expected etc. and now a days our problems are some Sikhs cutting their hair and nonGurSikhs running and ruining the Gurdwara. but the twist is, back in the day Sikhs were very very persecuted and all the haircutters ran the Gurdwaras while the GurSikhs had to hide in the forests, we say non Amritdharis should run the Gurdwaras (which is true from modern hukamnama but not at that time because that time had different problems, as in life or death of a Sikh for only 5 rupees) Times change and so do the problems. Jathas will also have morphing and changing ways and habits.

Khalsa Panth is the Sikh "Jatha" of world religions because we think ours and others have theirs yet we are all the same but slightly different, so I think Sikhi is a form of jatha to the world. We arent trying to make you ours we are sharing our views with whoever wants to accept it, just as a jatha should operate.

I also dont think jatha makes you lets say hate on others out of your jatha its the responsibility of the individual Sikh to understand not to do that, if you blame a jatha then youre just a robot anyway.