Proper Way To Sing Shabad

[Artmental]

Waheguru Ji ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji ke Fateh

If anyone can help would be most appreciated until I start proper classes

When singing a shabad are you supposed to treat the Thuk where it says 'Rahaa-O' as the main part of the shabad, therefore repeat it (like a chorus)

I ask this as I have noticed that many popular kirtanee such as Bhai Harjinder Singh etc do not do this and use the first/second Thuk as main part (chorus)

Some help would be appreciated

Pull Chuk maaf

[Gurmat Sangeet]

Waheguru Ji ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji ke Fateh

If anyone can help would be most appreciated until I start proper classes

When singing a shabad are you supposed to treat the Thuk where it says 'Rahaa-O' as the main part of the shabad, therefore repeat it (like a chorus)

I ask this as I have noticed that many popular kirtanee such as Bhai Harjinder Singh etc do not do this and use the first/second Thuk as main part (chorus)

Some help would be appreciated

Pull Chuk maaf

The Rahao tukh is the mukh ang of the Shabad and its imperative that it is used as the chorus. Also we should if not must sing the shabad in the same raag it is written in.

[Artmental]

Thankyou

I already know that most Kirtanee singh shabads in an incorrect format so trying not to follow from their example

Could you please point me to some websites/places in the midlands where proper raag Kirtan can be learnt using a Vaja - I know it is better to use Taanti saaj and will move on that later

Or if it can be learnt using a website please let me know

Thanks

[chatanga]

depends on where in tha midlands u r.

in woilverhmapton you can learn from my main man, Ustaad Jujhar Singh at Nanaksar Thath Penn Rd Wolverhampton, on Fridays from 7-8pm. Tis a really good class to begin your lessons. He also has spare instruments for you to start off with.

However i beg you not to learn vaja. Go strate to tanti saaj. Tanti saaj requires a lot of effort and time. So dont waste your time learning vaja if your aim/ambition is to go onto tanti saaj.

Tanti saaj is the instruments that Guru used to do kirtan. Plus it sounds much better than vaja.

any other info u need pm me.

[Degh-Tegh-Fathe]

depends on where in tha midlands u r.

in woilverhmapton you can learn from my main man, Ustaad Jujhar Singh at Nanaksar Thath Penn Rd Wolverhampton, on Fridays from 7-8pm. Tis a really good class to begin your lessons. He also has spare instruments for you to start off with.

However i beg you not to learn vaja. Go strate to tanti saaj. Tanti saaj requires a lot of effort and time. So dont waste your time learning vaja if your aim/ambition is to go onto tanti saaj.

Tanti saaj is the instruments that Guru used to do kirtan. Plus it sounds much better than vaja.

any other info u need pm me.

I think its a bit off to say not to waste ur time on vaja....if you sing gurbani with a vaja then your NOT wasting your time.....one of my bros loves raag and also has is learning how to play tanti saaj but use's vaja more because he says it allows him to focus more on the bani. umm yeaah

[ghorandhar]

Gurmat Sangeet Veer jee is right about doing kirtan in the rahoo and raag. Doing kirtan in nirdharat raag is really coming back into our gurughar and its really good you want to learn this.

I feel that the key to kirtan can be listening to as many Raagis (who do kirtan in Raag) as you can. There are thousands of recordings online.

Its important to have an ustad, however Its also good to buy books and read what people write about the theory. You will find difference of opinion in some raags. As you advance you can start practicing the notations in the books. The following website is good because the recordings are based of Principle Dyal Singh and Bhai Avtar singh jees books, so when you practice you can hear what the bandish sounds like. http://www.gurmatsangeetproject.com/

I learnt baja first and still play it. Its taking me time to practice tanti saaj and to be honest I still do kirtan with baja at guru ghar because I feel I need alot more practice. If you first learn vaja the postive thing will be that you will learn shabads and raags quicker, you can later put these raags onto your tanti saaz with practice. If you can dedicate time, learn both baja and tanti saaz.

[chatanga]

raag cant be done 100% on vaja. But my point is that if artmental wanta to learns eventually how to play a stringed instrument then it best to strate on to it.

[ghorandhar]

Its really good you want to learn kirtan in nirdharat raags. I think this is really coming back into Sikhi.

Veer jee I learnt kirtan on the vaja at first, It helped me progress quickly and im learning tanti saaz aswell. If you learn on the vaja first, I found that you learn the bandish and rhythm quicker. I find it easy to put bandishs onto my diruba. It might be best to try both out and see what you like.

[ramkali]

Waheguru!

To read that you would like to learn Nirdharat Raag has really made my day! Personally, I think that the most important thing is to sing the Bani correctly as prescribed. Your main instrument is your voice, that is where your emotion should come from. The reason why taanti saaj are used is because of their ability to mimic the voice. A cry, a sigh, a boom; all can be expressed on a stringed instrument, whereas a vaja cannot do this because its just one note played at a time.

Learning vaja first is ok because you learn sur-gian, but please be warned that to play on a vaja for too long will limit your singing ability as there is a danger that you will sing notes in a restricted manner as the vaja keys. And this is important for a Ragi because raag is all about expression and your voice needs to express your mood well. A Dilruba/sarangi is freedom. It assists your voice rather than leading it. And the sooner you begin your journey on Dilruba, the sooner you will find your way with it. You're warriors, so don't fear Guru's instruments, pick up your saaj and master it!

[ramkali]

Gurmat Sangeet Veer jee is right about doing kirtan in the rahoo and raag. Doing kirtan in nirdharat raag is really coming back into our gurughar and its really good you want to learn this.

I feel that the key to kirtan can be listening to as many Raagis (who do kirtan in Raag) as you can. There are thousands of recordings online.

Its important to have an ustad, however Its also good to buy books and read what people write about the theory. You will find difference of opinion in some raags. As you advance you can start practicing the notations in the books. The following website is good because the recordings are based of Principle Dyal Singh and Bhai Avtar singh jees books, so when you practice you can hear what the bandish sounds like. http://www.gurmatsangeetproject.com/ ...

I would like to add one more thing to this...

I think this suggestion about using the books and listening to the recordings of these great masters is very important, but please please please please do your own research and check out whether the shabad that they are singing is meant to be sung in the raag that they have chosen to sing in. Just go to your Guru and read the title of the shabad, and it will tell you the raag of the shabad, the author, whether it is partaal or a chhunt, etc. If it is being sung as it has been written by Guru, then carry on, if not, keep searching to find something recorded in title raag. The impact that this will have on your mind is phenomenal. To sing only the shabads that the Gurus selected for you...its a blessing!