Gurdwara In Nwfp Pakistan Being Used As A Library

[sikhanswers]

- Sai Mian Mir Guru Arjan Dev Crossed Friend and also the individual who was given the honour to lay down foundations of Siri Harmander sahib

Sai Mian Mir was a saint something not allowed in Islam. These circumcised demons behaved like animals when Pakistan was made in 1947. A train comming from Lyallpur had severly mutilated bodies of Sikhs and Hindus, and there was a uproar and led to more killing.

[Kaljug Singh]

Gurfateh Ji

It`s really sad when people start stereotyping whole communities.

It's really sad when people ignore what is happening to Gurdwaras across Pakistan to make some inane wishy-washy politically correct post about how "we are all one".

We are not here to merely protect Sikhs but "Sarbat dah bhalla",

It's odd that so many people here believe that this precludes protecting ourselves first rather than allowing others to destroy us, because to defend ourselves and Sikh interests might hurt someone's feelings which would not be in line with their interpretation of "sarbat da bhalla".

Note the Love Muslim Brothers had with the Gurus throughout History

- Bhai Mardana Guru Nanak Dev Ji companion through preaching Sikhism 80 thousand miles radius

- Sai Mian Mir Guru Arjan Dev Crossed Friend and also the individual who was given the honour to lay down foundations of Siri Harmander sahib

- Guni Khan & Nabhi khan, who helped tenth Master escape the clutches of mogul Soldiers in the saka of chamkaur so guru Ji could go on and give strength to the khalsa

There are also many more examples,

And there were hundreds of thousands more examples of Muslim soldiers in the times of our Gurus who were just as bloodthirsty and hate-filled towards Sikhs as their current Muslim incarnations in Pakistan and beyond, but I guess we should pretend that they don't exist and hope that they leave us alone.

God Bless

K.

[West London Singh]

what 50% are you bangin on about? I have just given the official population statistics for Jalandhar Division. Hard sums ka bacha! Maybe this is too hard for you. Panjab was divided totally on population figures alone. If Jalandhar or any other district had majority muslim population they would have been awarded to Pakistan. Amritsar was only just saved at 51% non-muslim.

I'm sorry Chatanga. I should have realised from your name that you are Japanese. I took it for granted that you were Punjabi....although I should've known better. I should've guessed you were not when you said this :

Jalandhar Division Muslim population pre-partition was 34.53 %. Each of the districts in the Jalandhar Division(Ludhiana,Ferozepor,Jalandhar,Hoshiarpur, and Kangra)

Because you see, Chatanga brother, when us Punjabis talk about Jalandhar jilla (district) we are talking about the doaba area which now includes the modern day districts of Nawanshayr and Paghwara, but if you were Punjabi you would have known how ludicrous it would have been to include the malwai Ludhiana and even Ferozpur in any talk of the Jalandhar district. :rolleyes: But not to worry my brother. You were not to know and its great to see someone from Japan taking a keen interest in Sikhism and Punjab. Slowly, you'll learn that it is only in the last 2 decades that the Sikhs from doaba (Jalandhar) have crossed the Sutlej and contemplated marrying the Sikhs from malwa (Ludhiana) despite the two being only a few miles apart. The cultural and linguistic differences between the two areas are extreme. Added to that, on the southern side of the Sutlej in Ludhiana and malwa towards Ferozpur is the area that was not part of the Sikh Kingdom but was instead part of the Sikh principalities. As such, it was always a Sikh stronghold and its muslim population was tiny compared to the massive Jullundri musalman (muslims from jalandhar) population. The area in rural Jalandhar is just littered with important muslim relics. Its the area where Nasrat fateh Ali Khan was born and not to mention successive Pakistani Prime Ministers, including General Zia. If you were to visit rural Faisalabad and Sahiwal districts in pakistan you'd get a good idea of just how many of the Pakistanis there originate from Jalandhar district. That district in Pakistan is practically the only district in Pakistan which contains villages named after the villages they left in Jalandhar jilla. Names such as Dosanjh....Lallian...Goraya etc. Also, the only district in pakistan that contains muslims with the same surnames normally only found among doaba Jalandhar jatt sikhs. Names such as Chokkar, dosanjh, lalli, etc.

Anyway, like I said I think its wonderfull that someone like you is at least showing an interest. All things considered I think you've done quite well so please don't feel bad about making silly little mistakes such as including Ludhiana and Ferozpur in your 'Jalandhar' District list.

[chatanga]

All things considered I think you've done quite well so please don't feel bad about making silly little mistakes such as including Ludhiana and Ferozpur in your 'Jalandhar' District list.

Thank you Bhaji, for your kind remarks. Reading your post I can see why Sikhs are generally regarded as thickos by many.

My dear Singh, for the administrative ease of panjab(remember it was a lot bigger back then) it was divided inot 5 administrative regions called divisions.

The divisions of panjab were as follows:

Jalandhar, (which covered the DISTRICTS of Jalandhar, Ludhiana, Ferozepur, Kangra and Hoshiarpur)

Lahore(gurdaspur, amritsar, gujranwala, gujrat , sialkot etc)

Multan(multan, bahawalpur, lyallpur, montgomeryetc)

Rawalpindi(rawalpindi, hazara, mingora etc)

Ambala(rohtak,gurgaon,simla,hissar etc)

So you see my dear educated brother, Jalandhar is a district, as is Ludhiana but both were part of the Jalandhar Division. Re-read my post again. I have never said that Ludhiana was part of Doaba. You did that silly little part all by yourself.

i re-write:

Jalandhar Division Muslim population pre-partition was 34.53 %. Each of the districts in the Jalandhar Division(Ludhiana,Ferozepor,Jalandhar,Hoshiarpur, and Kangra) had non-muslim majority, which is why it stayed seperate from Pakistan.

[West London Singh]

:rolleyes: Chatanga, you are one very strange and highly strung individual. It takes a seriously unbalanced individual to get uptight about the news that Jalandhar jilla was muslim dominated pre-1947.

Look......I originally called it Jalandhar district. You didn't understand that a Punjabi Sikh means DISTRICT when he says District but went off on one about DIVISIONS :rolleyes:

I then called it Jalandhar Jilla so you might understand we are talking about the district and NOT some division or whatever you wish to take this conversation to.

Then, thinking maybe you find the doaba dialect difficult to undertstand I said Jalandhar Zilla, so you may at least be able to comprehend standard majha Punjabi....and understand we are talking about the DISTRICT and not some 'division' or another.

Again...nothing. :sad:

Of course I know you're not Japanese. I was just trying to be nice to you because I couldn't believe there could be any Punjabi Sikh stupid enough to repeatedly include malwai areas in any talk about Jalandhar DISTRICT.

Yes, I agree the first letter is the same so that may have thrown you. And then you find the second letter is also the same so it must have played havoc with your thought process. But look...pay attention now Chatanga...the 3rd letter is different. Look : diStrict.....diVision. Can you see now Chatanga ? Can you see now where you made a bit of a boo boo ? :wacko:

[Jai Tegang!]

West London Singh,

Take it easy buddy, show some respect for your fellow brother.

[chatanga]

w l singh, dont strain your brain cell on what i am. If you cannot understand that there is a difference between the (pre-47) administrative unit called Jalandhar Division, and the District of Jalandhar, then what fault is that of mine?

sure i am strange, but i aint thick. work on it bro. but slowly. dont want that brain cell to overheat do you. might call me an Indian next.

your stupidity reminds me of how thick our leaders were in 1947.

[inderking]

I am no historian, but what I do know from Sikh history, and the Histroy of Punjab and India. I would have thought there was a low percentage of Muslims in Punjab and India, therefore the Muslim religion and culture etc is alien to Punjab and India, the Muslims in Pakistan and India are larglely decendents of a largely hindu population that was forcefully converted to Islam, where largley Hindu famlies converted , Hindu women were forcefully married and raped by the Muslim mughul invaders to become baby making machines, the aim of the Mughuls was to cause mass genocide of the Hindu people and change it to a Islamic country. These people that are Muslim and live in Punjab and India and call themselves punjabi should leave and go back to Saudi Arabia where there rapist grandfathers came from, West Punjab was stolen from the Sikhs, in no way are Muslim true Punjabi's, the Mughul empire was trying its best to destroy Punjab, why do muslims even call themselves Punjabi ! They deny where there ancestory has come from, and how their ancestors where forcefully converted to Islam " They are truly a <banned word filter activated> race" , a race created from hate with no roots and no true birth.

I know what I have stated is strong, but is this not fact if not please state otherwise.

Some questions I have.

what was the population of muslim is in Punjab and India pre mughul-empire.?

why did the Mughuls TRY and invade India was it mere expansion , enslavement, forced religious conversion ?

[chatanga]

Some questions I have.

what was the population of muslim is in Punjab and India pre mughul-empire.?

why did the Mughuls TRY and invade India was it mere expansion , enslavement, forced religious conversion ?

the population of muslims in panjab in 1947 was approx 53%, and all over india about 26%. This was taken from the figures in the 1941 consensus.

the moghals/urks initially came for booty, but as time went on looked to bring the land and people under their control. their reason for islamifying india was to reduce the opposition to their rule, as muslims would be less antagonistic towards muslim rule than the hindus.

[inderking]

does anyone know what the population of muslims was in punjab and india pre-mughul empire not in 1947