You Don’T Count, If You’Re Not Counted; Answer “Sikh” In The 2011 Census (England And Wales) And Be Counted

[11Gurus1Jot]

We should be acknowledged by our actions, not by numbers written on a piece of paper. Writing "Sikh" on paper doesn't make one a Sikh. We should be known by the fruits of our actions! If nobody knows us, then are we doing anygood? Forget political correctness and statistics, im talking about coming from the level of a human being! Language that human beings understand. Compassion, Love!

Harjeet, this is about every Sikh standing up and being counted. Do you want Sikhs to have the rights that can be obtained via the Census 2011? A Yes or No should be included in your answer!!!

I think, you, or anyone else, who tells anybody that they are a Sikh, should fill in the Census form, as a Sikh. Otherwise, people will say, "you only call yourself a Sikh when it suits you i.e. to attach yourself to the great history of the Gurus and Gursikhs (like we all do), but then, on the one occasion when you needed to stand up and be counted you deliberately backed out.

Another way of putting it, is, should you ever say, or give, the impression, to anyone, that your are a Sikh, if you didn't want to put it on the Census Form, when it was the real time for you to call yourself a Sikh?

At the end of the day, it's up to you, do what you think would please Guru Ji, if, you want to please Guru Ji.

The way I see it is, if we Sikhs DO tick the following boxes i.e.......

• Tick Q16E as other, and then write Sikh
• and at Q20 tick Sikh

Then there is big difference to the rights we will receive, as Sikhs, if we do get ourselves recognised as an ethinic group. If there wasn't a difference, then there would not be an enthic group section on the form, there would only be a religious section!!!

The definition I have seen for Ethnic is "cultural: denoting or deriving from or distinctive of the ways of living built up by a group of people"

We are all constantly told that Sikhi is not just a religion but also a way of life - True? So if we did not mark ourselves as a separate Ethnic group on the Census Form, then wouldn't that make us liers??????? Because, as Sikhs, we are not supposed to tell lies!!! And that's why we have to state Sikh on the Census Form!

[Singh559]

In usa what was the issue about?

In uk its not about being recognised as sikh. Religion option as sikh has been in census before and even option for sikh as a religion is in this decades census, the issue is about ethnicity, so say in usa your religion is sikh but would they say your ethnicity is sikh or indian. In uk they already have a sikh box for religion as before only thing is the religion box is optional. Ethnicity is compulsory so instead of being classed as a nation i.e british asian indian we want british asian other then write in sikh. Then we are classed as a different group. As per uk law we sikhs like jews are distinct ethnic peoples unlike anyother religion.

It was for ethnicity im pretty sure

[Harjeet]

Harjeet, this is about every Sikh standing up and being counted. Do you want Sikhs to have the rights that can be obtained via the Census 2011? A Yes or No should be included in your answer!!!

I think, you, or anyone else, who tells anybody that they are a Sikh, should fill in the Census form, as a Sikh. Otherwise, people will say, "you only call yourself a Sikh when it suits you i.e. to attach yourself to the great history of the Gurus and Gursikhs (like we all do), but then, on the one occasion when you needed to stand up and be counted you deliberately backed out.

Another way of putting it, is, should you ever say, or give, the impression, to anyone, that your are a Sikh, if you didn't want to put it on the Census Form, when it was the real time for you to call yourself a Sikh?

At the end of the day, it's up to you, do what you think would please Guru Ji, if, you want to please Guru Ji.

The way I see it is, if we Sikhs DO tick the following boxes i.e.......

• Tick Q16E as other, and then write Sikh
• and at Q20 tick Sikh

Then there is big difference to the rights we will receive, as Sikhs, if we do get ourselves recognised as an ethinic group. If there wasn't a difference, then there would not be an enthic group section on the form, there would only be a religious section!!!

The definition I have seen for Ethnic is "cultural: denoting or deriving from or distinctive of the ways of living built up by a group of people"

We are all constantly told that Sikhi is not just a religion but also a way of life - True? So if we did not mark ourselves as a separate Ethnic group on the Census Form, then wouldn't that make us liers??????? Because, as Sikhs, we are not supposed to tell lies!!! And that's why we have to state Sikh on the Census Form!

The census has been done for me now anyway.

But the thing is, the census is not what you believe it is.

If it was about standing up and being counted, then why did we wait 10 years to stand up? Why didn't we do it before? Why did we wait? All of a sudden the census comes out, and now you want to be counted? If we as a "nation" really cared about our rights, we would all unite, and march right down into downing street and demand our rights. But we have no unity. The census is just a pathetic excuse to pretend like we are doing something. But it is too little, too late!

We won't gain anything positive from the census, it is not what you think it is. I know you are trying to help people and think it is for the good. But you have been misinformed.

A US arms manufacturer, known as lockheed martin, who create the many weapons, that end up being used to kill innocent people. This group, will be authorizing the census. Why? Whats the bigger agenda they have?

You have been told the census is confidential. But then why do they put your information up on public directory websites for everyone to see? Just go to www.192.com. You can just type your name in, and it will find your address and number. All the people who live at your house etc. There are tons of websites like these, their information is imported from the census!

The census is really just a reminder of our slavery and dependency towards the government! We can't help ourselves out, so we need the government to do it for us! And then we wonder why Sikh's don't have their own nation.

You see some of the things i know, if I were to say, would sound totally absurb to you, but if you knew these things, then you too would automatically have disgust towards things like the census. If you knew that the way these Governments and banking system really operates, well it was has all been engineered this way thousands of years ago, to keep us dumbed down, and keep us in a state of fear, and keep us in a state of dependency on the state. You see we are so reliant on them, if they decided to switch off our electricity, we would be screwed, because we have lost our own power to take care of ourselves. Because we have let ourselves become dependent to people, who have no love for the Guru.

If you knew things such as that the government puts poison in our water, in the form of sodium fluoride, depleted uranium and many others, they put barium and aluminum in the jet fuel, so that aeroplanes leave chemtrails in the sky, that poison our crops and the atmosphere. They engineered things like the world wars, terrorist attacks like 9/11, its all been designed, to keep us more in fear, so that we can be manipulated more. They funded the rise of people like hitler. All the terrible things going on in this world, can be traced back to this occult. If you were really aware of whats going on in this world, you too would not want any part with the census.

Look imagine if you had to complete a census form for someone like Hitler, or the emperor Aurangzeb, you would know that there would be a sick twist behind it. But heres the thing the people behind our governments, and world leaders ARE EVEN WORSE than someone like Hitler. They are the ones behind it all. If you were aware of this, of how evil they really are, and that they actually worship the devil, you too wouldn't want to complete their stupid forms either. Its not for our benefit, its to help them plan their next moves, towards their "new world order"

Thats what i meant by the Sikh's shall be known by their actions. Because we shall not be a statistic. The whole world will come to know who the Skhs are, because through God, we are going to restore peace and justice to this world! I can't take it anymore. Thank God for pain, because it wakes us up from our sleep, and causes us to act. We need a revolution, we need to take the power back.

Why aren't there any Sikh leaders? Why are we taking orders from people who don't know anything about the Guru? If it doesn't help us spiritually it doesn't help us at all. Because materialism does not go with us when we die. And the thing is, our so called "leaders" they cannot do anything to help us spiritually can they? Even if you have all the money in the world it does not matter when you die! Besides the government just are making us poorer. With increased tax!

There is so much going on in my head, i wish i could release it all, then you people would know whats up but i don't know how to explain it all. The whole of society is a joke, its like everything is taxed, like VAT. So whenever you pay your taxes, or buy something, your are supporting things like, the illegal wars going on in Iraq, you are supporting the military who gives weapons to people like the African dictators, who use it to slaughter their own people. Your tax goes to the Queen, and all her private holiday homes she has, her private airport. Some people in this world do not even have 1 house! Yet your money goes to the so called "royal family" who think their blood is more precious than ours, they don't have to work, whilst millions of people across the world are starving and dying. And you tax money is supports this! And yet you are happy to live this way?

That is the joke, that the only reason we are slaves, is because we have let ourselves become weak. We have forgotten God, who is our true saviour and the true source of all power. Thats why we don't know how to look after ourselves, so we need money to buy it all for us. Then people think money is power, but it is not! Money just makes you dependent. No wonder people keep yearning for more and more wealth. Its because inside they are scared of dying. Thats why we need to realise God, the true source of everything. We can get everything we need, learn all the skills we need to have, meet the people we are supposed to meet, we can obtain all this, from God.

You see everything is interconnected, the census is part of a greater conspiracy to enslave us, im sorry to keep rambling on and on, and i know im not any better than those who i critisize. But I just want people to wake up to the true agenda. You need to pray to God that you will learn the truth, seriously it is too crazy to explain.

But their control grid is going to go down, we will rise up! Humanity is waking up! The only way to create a revolution is to first create a spiritual revolution within your own home! The world will know who the Sikh's are, through our good deeds! Saying things are just statistcs, its time to reallly let the world know the power of our Guru. Wake up.

The world is like a reflection, a mirror of our inner state so if we change our inner state of being, and vibrate the love of God, then then the world around us will change.

My point im basically trying to say is, you guys want to help people, by saying "complete the census, then the government will take care of us". You think that will benefit the Sikhs or whatever. But really the best way to help people, is to realise God within you, then you will be able to help in ways that are unimaginable to you right now. We will be able to help ourselves and not rely on someone else to do it for us. All this census completion, is just training and programming us to forget the Guru, who is our true saviour! Because at the end of the day, it doesn't matter what other people think of you, it only matters what God thinks of you!

I'm going to end it with a quote from Martin Luther King, which totally explains the way im feeling right now.

"Cowardice asks the question, 'Is it safe?' Expediency asks the question, 'Is it politic?' Vanity asks the question, 'Is it popular?'

But, conscience asks the question, 'Is it right?'

And there comes a time when one must take a position that is neither safe, nor politic, nor popular, but one must take it because one's conscience tells one that it is right."

You see its time to take responsibility for ourselves, nobody else can help us, or they would of done so by now, no government will do it for you. We can only help ourselves, through the grace of God!

[Hammertime007]

Surely not. Indian covers a wide area. Like saying why have english,welsh,scots and different for irish and gypsys? Indian is like saying have western european as ethnicity. As indians are so diverse. I mean punjabis have so much in common with pakistani punjabis than say tamil or bengali. If it means nationality or origin then ok but if ethnicity then no it is sikh, i first thought like youbut my wife not sikh born told me and explained why, even she is of indian origin but not born sikh. Just read posts above as why, also uk law recognise sikhs as ethnicity like jews no other has the privilage

Pakistani punjabis see you as a kaffir dont get excited over so called punjabi brother hood it dont exist.

[11Gurus1Jot]

If we as a "nation" really cared about our rights, we would all unite, and march right down into downing street and demand our rights. But we have no unity.

We can't help ourselves out, so we need the government to do it for us! And then we wonder why Sikh's don't have their own nation.

we have lost our own power to take care of ourselves. Because we have let ourselves become dependent to people, who have no love for the Guru.

Look imagine if you had to complete a census form for someone like Hitler, or the emperor Aurangzeb, you would know that there would be a sick twist behind it.

Thats what i meant by the Sikh's shall be known by their actions. Because we shall not be a statistic. The whole world will come to know who the Skhs are, because through God, we are going to restore peace and justice to this world! Thank God for pain, because it wakes us up from our sleep, and causes us to act. We need a revolution, we need to take the power back.

Why aren't there any Sikh leaders? Why are we taking orders from people who don't know anything about the Guru? If it doesn't help us spiritually it doesn't help us at all. Because materialism does not go with us when we die. And the thing is, our so called "leaders" they cannot do anything to help us spiritually can they? Even if you have all the money in the world it does not matter when you die! Besides the government just are making us poorer. With increased tax!

Some people in this world do not even have 1 house! Yet your money goes to the so called "royal family" who think their blood is more precious than ours, they don't have to work, whilst millions of people across the world are starving and dying. And you tax money is supports this! And yet you are happy to live this way?

That is the joke, that the only reason we are slaves, is because we have let ourselves become weak. We have forgotten God, who is our true saviour and the true source of all power. Thats why we don't know how to look after ourselves, so we need money to buy it all for us. Then people think money is power, but it is not! Money just makes you dependent. No wonder people keep yearning for more and more wealth. Its because inside they are scared of dying. Thats why we need to realise God, the true source of everything. We can get everything we need, learn all the skills we need to have, meet the people we are supposed to meet, we can obtain all this, from God.

You see everything is interconnected, I just want people to wake up to the true agenda. You need to pray to God that you will learn the truth.

But their control grid is going to go down, we will rise up! Humanity is waking up! The only way to create a revolution is to first create a spiritual revolution within your own home! The world will know who the Sikh's are, through our good deeds! Saying things are just statistcs, its time to reallly let the world know the power of our Guru. Wake up.

The world is like a reflection, a mirror of our inner state so if we change our inner state of being, and vibrate the love of God, then then the world around us will change.

But really the best way to help people, is to realise God within you, then you will be able to help in ways that are unimaginable to you right now. We will be able to help ourselves and not rely on someone else to do it for us. All this, is just training and programming us to forget the Guru, who is our true saviour! Because at the end of the day, it doesn't matter what other people think of you, it only matters what God thinks of you!

I'm going to end it with a quote from Martin Luther King, which totally explains the way im feeling right now.

"Cowardice asks the question, 'Is it safe?' Expediency asks the question, 'Is it politic?' Vanity asks the question, 'Is it popular?'

But, conscience asks the question, 'Is it right?'

And there comes a time when one must take a position that is neither safe, nor politic, nor popular, but one must take it because one's conscience tells one that it is right."

You see its time to take responsibility for ourselves, nobody else can help us, or they would of done so by now, no government will do it for you. We can only help ourselves, through the grace of God!

Harjeet Ji - Your remaining post above rings of some much truth (which we can sometimes forget)! I find it totally inspiring!!

The parts of the your post I can't completely verify, or fully understand, I have deleted. The part of your post that I find very clear, which I will definitely try and learn from, I have left above in blue. I have only deleted things, I have added nothing, the above is all from your post.

Keep the faith, keep the Guru's Sangat, and keep strong!

Like you say we came to this world to do naam simran to find Vaheguru! Don't let anything grind you down and stop you doing that!

I hope you are blessed with the strength to continue to do you Kirt (honest work). You faith in God is infectious, concentrate on that!:waheguru:

[gurdssingh]

Pakistani punjabis see you as a kaffir dont get excited over so called punjabi brother hood it dont exist.

All muslims are taught non muslims are kaffir. But punjabi brotherhood does exist. Talk to bajurgz about it, and also sikhs from uk who been there on yatra. Most pakistanis are from kashmir, mirpur in uk. Most are ok the punjabis are very warm towards us. But im not supprised at your view and outlook as your posts show resentment for pakistanis in general.

[HSD1]

A US arms manufacturer, known as lockheed martin, who create the many weapons, that end up being used to kill innocent people. This group, will be authorizing the census. Why? Whats the bigger agenda they have?

I do a pretty good George Bush Jr impression so I phoned LM up and asked what they were planning to do with the data. They told me they'll programme the data into Predator drones which will then bomb undesirables in the middle of the night. You couldnt make it up!!!!!!!!!11111

Btw, do people know that Apple is a major supplier to the US army? Ipods and ipads have been used in weapons systems to act as targetting dispays or interactive maps. The same ipads and ipods and iphones you use to listen to Shabads or read Gurbani. Funny, eh?