Is 3H0 Based On True Sikhi?

[MiddxSingh]

You can take it as a personal attack, and calling anyone who is against hindu rituals in sikhi as mr hindu allergy is getting old mate.

You have suddenly changed your tune by agreeing with Johnny101. All I said was gurbani never salutes hindu god shiva and you, lacking respect for guru sahib, tried to show Guru Gobind Singh ji did with the following comment:

"So can you explain why Guru Gobind Singh is insulting us by your view in the dasam granth with the following bani:

Deh siva bar mohe eh-hey subh karman te kabhu na taro.
Na daro arr seo jab jaye laro nischey kar apni jeet karo..."

Why do you think Johnny had to explain this basic concept to you? because it was obvious that you falsely believe gurbani salutes Shiva.

So I stand by what I said, you have openly declared your views after hundreds of posts, which do not fit in with the basic principles of sikhi. Taking this as a personal attack is a joke, no insult or mick taking was aimed at you. Personal attacks happen frequently here so try comparing them to what I said.

MLOL again at making me out to have a hindu allergy because I refuse to believe that gurbani/sikhi condones worshiping any hindu deities!

[DalbirSingh]

You can take it as a personal attack, and calling anyone who is against hindu rituals in sikhi as mr hindu allergy is getting old mate.

You have suddenly changed your tune by agreeing with Johnny101. All I said was gurbani never salutes hindu god shiva and you, lacking respect for guru sahib, tried to show Guru Gobind Singh ji did with the following comment:

"So can you explain why Guru Gobind Singh is insulting us by your view in the dasam granth with the following bani:

Deh siva bar mohe eh-hey subh karman te kabhu na taro.

Na daro arr seo jab jaye laro nischey kar apni jeet karo..."

Why do you think Johnny had to explain this basic concept to you? because it was obvious that you falsely believe gurbani salutes Shiva.

So I stand by what I said, you have openly declared your views after hundreds of posts, which do not fit in with the basic principles of sikhi. Taking this as a personal attack is a joke, no insult or mick taking was aimed at you. Personal attacks happen frequently here so try comparing them to what I said.

MLOL again at making me out to have a hindu allergy because I refuse to believe that gurbani/sikhi condones worshiping any hindu deities!

I never said anything about worshipping a hindu deity

I can admit I phrased the salute incorrectly perhaps it would have been better if I said the name shiva was used for god in gurbani you can play these context games if you want.

As for personal attacks happening all the time here take that up with the admins it's for them to enforce, they way they enforce will change how popular their site becomes.

You do have a hindu allergy with all those gursant videos go and speak to gursant you will realise he hates anything hindu, the hindi language, the sikh religion which may use linguistic terms which are shared like dharma or tilak. Gursant is an evangelical christian wanabe muslim sikh.

[luckysingh99]

Firstly, I can see where Dalbirji is coming from and I do have to agree !

Secondly, where the hell were these people like Gursant when the Yogi was alive ?

It's easy to kick a man down when they are not here to defend themselves. As Sikhs we shouldn't be judging or classing people to their misdeeds.

In all honesty, none of us are saints and would we want Guruji to judge us on our bad deeds alone or the good deeds as well ??

The huge misconception is that kundalini yoga = 3HO= Sikh !

This is where it goes wrong because the yoga doesn't have much to do with sikhi except you can use the gurbani gurmantars for the meditative aspects combined with yoga.

BTW, I am a Kundalini yoga student and it hasn't hindufied me yet !

The yoga is for general well being and I use it as part of many other physical well being exercises. The advantage for me with kundalini yoga is that I can use mind and meditation primarily with the physical movements incorporated. Now, seeing as in other yogas they will use other Vedic gurmantars in order to aid the focus, as a Sikh what better gurmantar could I be using than 'waheguru' ?

Gurbani tells us to keep the gurmantar enshrined within you 24/7. This should be having waheguru vibrating with every single breath no matter what you are doing.

If you can't get this state of rom rom and sehaj, then you should try to think 'waheguru' with every single step you take when walking or every single movement you make with hands and feet. Even running on the tread mill in the gym can be synchronized with your own waheguru jap instead of counting or looking at the timer.- TRY IT if you really want to see what I mean !

[Only five]

Gursant is an evangelical christian interpreting sikhi from a biblical viewpoint he has lost it, he believes sikh history is corrupted when it mentions tilak and the existence of shiva in gurbani is done by the rss. He thinks all gurdwaras should remove all guru paintings, the gilding on harmandir sahib of icons like the guru should be removed. It could be very possible he is a christian infiltrating sikhs to turn them on each other. He thinks basically all sikhs are lost apart from him and we should give him our hard earned money by buying his book.

This evangelical approach does a great job in pushing people away from christianity I think we don't need that behaviour in sikhi. He has some points about the tantra and yogi bhajans sexualised sikhi but bhajan was preaching his own kundalani stuff. So what alot of our own punjabi sikhs have hodge podge ideas.

5.44 of the 2nd video he talks about yoga having salutation to shiva and to shakti if you read jap sahib it has it as well and he is calling it bad and damaging.

I don't know what you said above is true about Gursant Singh, but after what he has gone through with yogi bhajan trying to shove down Yoga is Sikhi. Then it is very understandable why Gursant Singh is anti yoga or even mention of any devi and devta in Gurbani sets him off in the other direction.

Yogi Bhajan was pushing his manmat yoga stuff as Sikhi. You want proof listen to his lectures. It is, also very evident from what his students say about Sikhi and then use Yogi Bhajan as a reference to support the idea that Kundalini yoga, trantric sex is Sikhi.

[Only five]

The huge misconception is that kundalini yoga = 3HO= Sikh !

This is where it goes wrong because the yoga doesn't have much to do with sikhi except you can use the gurbani gurmantars for the meditative aspects combined with yoga.

BTW, I am a Kundalini yoga student and it hasn't hindufied me yet !

The yoga is for general well being and I use it as part of many other physical well being exercises. The advantage for me with kundalini yoga is that I can use mind and meditation primarily with the physical movements incorporated.

So do you sit there holding certain hand positions while saying a Gurmantra? Does the certain hand position or body position help calm the mind?

[DalbirSingh]

So do you sit there holding certain hand positions while saying a Gurmantra? Does the certain hand position or body position help calm the mind?

Yoga has nothing to do with sikhi, it was yogi bhajans bread and butter, his business he ran a yoga school and over the years they all started to embrace sikhi with a kundalani twist to it. They seem to be using a lot of metaphors which can go either way and don't have to be literal take for example the magnetic effect we know there isn't a real magnet but the power of simran is being metaphorically taught.

Don't kick yoga entirely it's very therapeutic that is hattha yoga, it does wonders for joints, it's good for flexibility and is a good form of cardiovascular exercises as is the stretches. Gursant has some valid points, but he shouldn't be appointed the leader of the reform call of the 3ho simply because of his evangelical techniques in doing it, going and telling people off and shunning them doesn't work. By him doing it he has been banned from all 3ho events, none of them want to talk to him or sit with him.

But I don't believe every 3ho-er is bad or has misconceived ideas, the sri chand statue just seems like art outside of the gurdwara, just like people have little gargoyles or elves or miniature statues of other decorations it seems, it just looks like a man sitting in the lotus position as you would in a gurdwara. Yogi Bhajan wasn't a sikh but was still part of sikh history. That statute they have actually originates from harmander sahib it was installed during the massand period and was removed around the singh sabha reform. YB is dead let's face it his followers or remains are free and independent people if they bow to the guru then just tell them to learn gurbani, question them of the shabads which challenge their practices. As for this phallus drawings I can't help but laugh, I remember seeing children go through that silly phase it's hilarious that 3ho might be taking that seriously.

[luckysingh99]

So do you sit there holding certain hand positions while saying a Gurmantra? Does the certain hand position or body position help calm the mind?

I don't actually remember doing any hand positions whilst holding a pose of any sort and i'm not sure what all these youtube videos show because I tend to avoid them.

The only yoga I have ever done has been upper or lower body stretch positions with a repetitive movement incorporated, -THEN the gurmantar may come in to help aid focus. That's what the difference is, -you are not sat there chanting and THEN waving your ang about.

When I started the kundalini, I was also very skeptical and prepared to be offended but my intentions were more for therapy in terms of my smashed up back, plus I wanted to see for real what all the fuss was about !

To date, I have been amazed at how it has been helping me in my general well being with increased mobility.

I have not had any one trying to sell me yogi's products or forcing me to by his teas or other golden temple stuff. Neither has anyone tried to convert any gorahs in to sikhi by making them believe that the yoga is a pre-requisite for sikhi.

As far as I know, everyone else in the class meaning the goirahs, Mexicans, americans, latinos.. are all in it for their well being, therapy and health. None of them seem to come across as wanting to become Sikh or be part of 3HO.

-Maybe, because it's kundalini in a rented recreational studio and not a 3HO property itself,.........I really don't know !!

[Only five]

There is a difference between stretching the body to prepare it for a vigorous work out and trying to heal like you say a bad back to doing Kundalini yoga. If you did not hold any hand positions or held certain positions to "release" the body of lust, anger, and ego. Then you did not participate in kundalini yoga. If you did hold certain body positions without knowing they are so called to release lust, anger, and ego, then you have been cheated into practicing Kundalini yoga.

In kundalini yoga each posture is held to align the chakras to release a human from the 5 thieves. The chakras cannot be held by Kundalini yoga and Satguru explains this through Gurbani. You might think I am not doing self harm, but you are really hurting your chances at realizing Naam while practicing Kundalini yoga. Kundalini yoga does not heal the issue. It just mask's the problem. It's like drinking cha to heal a headache. The cha just gives the body a boost to look the other way. Ever seen a person so high on cocaine that he has an object jammed inside of him, but to his buddies hes telling them......I am perfect....I cannot feel a thing. People that are depressed, they go to the doctor. The doctor prescribes the person pills to mask the problem. Take the depressed person off the pills and there you have billy bob lying on the ground with a bottle of alcohol in his hand. What the doctor ought to do is ask bob why the hell are you depressed? Get to the root of the problem.

If a person has a torn muscle then find a method to repair the muscle don't throw pain killers into your body hoping the muscle will heal. Essentially, the 3HO cult is hiding their true intentions for the most part on why they practice kundalini yoga. Not only does Kundalini yoga mask the problem, but 3HO are masking to the public on why to practice it. Many times I hear people say, it gives me peace of mind. I'm clear headed, i'm relaxed, etc. The person by doing kundalini yoga just took a pain killer. The real pain in everyone's life is the separation of the atma from Akal Purakh. Look up the word Yoga and it true meaning is union. Union with what? With Brahmin/ Akal Purakh/ Allah, Gobind, Ram, whatever you want to call him. But these 3HO people have the world on pain killers.

Satguru said forget the pain killers. Here is a solution that doesn't have an end. Satguru says read the truth (Gurbani), be content with the truth, and then contemplate on this truth. You do these three things and you have not only given the mind complete peace, but that union is in your grasp.

[DalbirSingh]

Hatha yoga is different to Kundalani Yoga, there are many sub-divisions of yoga just like the number of religions. Hatha yoga is just about stretches really. The mantras stuff is bhakti yoga, then jnana yoga is yoga of knowledge all to attain union with brahma or his manifestations.

Kundalani for the most part is bakwas there isn't no snake in your back. But even if it was a means to reduce your 5 vices what's wrong with it, does everything have to be directly reduced by gurbani and not due to banis teachings put into effect? Can the 5 vices only be subdued by lip service?

"Satguru said forget the pain killers. " mate next you going to say satguru said forget the insulin if you have diabetes don't take it, satguru will heal you and if you die due to this advice don't worry it was hukam. Go and take medical treatment when you need it, this type of advice is formed by those who haven't experienced those ailments or lack empathy to understand how medical treatment helps a person. If this subtraction of medicines is your version of sikhi then you will be surprised how many people will reject it. I guess we should also shun western education and open madrassa with kids rocking back and forth being told about making war with the kuffar if we are going to take this limited thought. Every human being will contract an ailment at least once in their life, I dare you to go without medicines then and to reject vaccinations and see how it effects you.

[Only five]

Hatha yoga is different to Kundalani Yoga, there are many sub-divisions of yoga just like the number of religions. Hatha yoga is just about stretches really. The mantras stuff is bhakti yoga, then jnana yoga is yoga of knowledge all to attain union with brahma or his manifestations.

Hatha yoga incorporates postures no doubt, but the end goal with the postures and breath control is suppose to control the mind and ultimately lead to Samadhi. Such practices are rejected in Gurbani as they don't control the mind and do not lead to Samadhi. The yogis sitting in the mountains for thousands of years could not control the mind with these types of yogas, what makes you think anyone else will be able too?

Again cocaine does not cure a wound caused by a foreign object being jammed in a person. The cocaine mask's the actual problem. Kundalini and other similar yogas do the same thing. If you have a health issue, then find the source for the health issue and then the health issue can be cured through medicine that attacks the source.