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Panj Kakkar Redundant In The West?


Guest confusedsikh

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Guest confusedsikh

You know how sikhi is a practical dharam.. Then why do we wear the 5 K's in the west? I mean realistically when would we use our kirpan.

Isn't it better to learn mma, boxing etc. which are much more practically and if you get in a fight, can use and not get a prison sentence for /

someone told me sikhism is based on the time, so like the first 5 guru sahibs didnt wear a kirpan (cuz it wasnt needed) but then the next 5 did cuz of the situtation with the mughals. So like in the west it's peace, the law doesnt really let us use kirpana. so what's the practical reason? what do you think>??

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Guest Best Guest

What a silly question:

You don't comb your hair? You don't wear undergarments? You never know when violence breaks out, you will stand there and get hurt and not fight back?

As for your concept of the Sikh religion and modernity, you are wrong. All the Guru's wore shastars. You're telling Guru Nanak Dev Ji went around the world through thick jungles, without arming himself? Guru Nanak Dev Ji's shastar can be seen, I believe currently at Patna Sahib Museum, he had a kirpan and barsha with him every where he went.

At the end of the day, when your mind justifies your not wanting to commit to something by saying it is not necessary, that is what we call manmat.

As for going with the times, no where in the sikh religion does it say anything about going with anything. Guru Arjan Dev Ji said it:

qyrI Bgiq n Cofau ikAw ko hsY ] thaeree bhagath n shhoddo kiaa ko hasai || I shall not renounce Your devotional worship, O Lord; what does it matter if people laugh at me?

As did Bhagat Nam Dev:

qyrI Bgiq n Cofau BwvY logu hsY ] thaeree bhagath n shhoddo bhaavai log hasai ||

I shall not abandon devotional worship of You, O Lord, even if the people laugh at me.

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Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh

We need the Panj Kakaar. It makes us stand out.

If you look at every the leader of other religions e.g. Jesus and Hindu Dev's, they all had long hair. It helps in spirituality and does has power. The Gursikhs are enough evidence for this. look at Bhai Taru Singh Ji he had his whole scalp scarped off to remove his Kesh. Also if you read the story of Samson from the Hebrew Bible, he had his hair cut and he lost all his power.

We should learn MMA or other martial arts, it will teach us to fight with out body, but if someone where to have a weapon you would also have one. Also just because the Mugals have gone doesn't mean that all 'bad' people have gone, a Sikh should defend people so we need to be armed. Where Waheguru JI's army, the Kakaars are apart of our uniform, every army has a uniform.

If you look at what Dhan Dhan Sri Hargobind Mahraj Said to Dhan Dhan Sri Guru Har Rai Sahib Patsha. To keep an army but never to go in battle, and that same army was ready upon ready to face the Mugals.

Also the Kirpan is our Peer, search on Google for more info.

We need Kanga to keep our hair clean, and also when we comb our hair we should contemplate how are day went.

We need a Kashera, a Kashera has a nara ( rope to tie it up like on tracksuits), if your going to misuse your sexual organs then first you need to untie the nara. In this day and age, this is required as the internet also has its dark side. Also to remind you that we should not do stuff before marriage and out of marriage.

Watch this video explains everything better than me

Please forgive me if i said anything wrong or offensive

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh

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If you are a proponent of “practical” why do you wear clothes, beyond your speedo, on hot humid shady days of summer? You are a follower of the overclothed. You won't get arrested if you simply walk around in your speedo. Is that practical? Attempt to answer this question. Part of that answer may begin to enlighten you. We can go further down that road if needed, but it’s your turn to explain and tell us what you think.

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Guest Jacfsing2

You know how sikhi is a practical dharam.. Then why do we wear the 5 K's in the west? I mean realistically when would we use our kirpan.

Isn't it better to learn mma, boxing etc. which are much more practically and if you get in a fight, can use and not get a prison sentence for /

someone told me sikhism is based on the time, so like the first 5 guru sahibs didnt wear a kirpan (cuz it wasnt needed) but then the next 5 did cuz of the situtation with the mughals. So like in the west it's peace, the law doesnt really let us use kirpana. so what's the practical reason? what do you think>??

In my country, (The United States of America), everyone has at least a gun, and it's the nation of the most guns per capita, you aren't going to be able to box these people, no body gets a prison sentence for that?
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Guest Anonymous Sikh

The word kirpan is made from two words “Kirpa” (mercy, grace or kindness) and “Aan” (honor). Thus it has wide meaning, it means “one that has grace to protect the honor” of self, family, home and others. Thus it is for serving very important practical purpose of individual forming part of the militia protecting life and liberty. It is an invented word to represent any weapon of the day that produces the desired result. During 1600s, the guns in use were matchlocks. They could only be fired by touching the end of a burning string or rope with touch hole to ignite gunpowder. It was clumsy and one could not always keep a burning string always ready. That is why Kirpan came to be associated with sword and not gun. Modern day Kirpan is gun. Every knowledgable Sikh will agree.

This view also gets credence from various historical weapons of the Sikhs, historical books and records that Sikhs carried and used almost all kinds of weapons including latest firearms of the day. Thus it also demonstrates that all kinds of arms have historically as well as present, have sacred place for leading life of honor and dignity. It also demonstrates that bearing of arms is the essential medium through which the individual asserts both his social power and his participation in politics as a responsible moral being.

It is well established that human rights are moral principles or norms that describe certain

standards of human behavior, and are regularly protected as legal rights in national and international

law. Since arms are part and parcel of human conscience, human and natural rights, dignity that is

personal self realization and autonomy, that is why wearing and carrying of kirpans is explicitly

recognized as a historic sui generis fundamental right of a historically sui generis sovereign and

distinct social group. Let us not forget that the right to keep and bear arms is, in order of importance, the first human right. It is the Sikh people's first freedom, the one right that protects all of the other rights.

Irreducible complexity is a term used to describe a characteristic of certain complex systems

whereby they need all of their individual component parts in place in order to function. In other

words, it is impossible to reduce the complexity of (or to simplify) an irreducibly complex system

by removing any of its component parts and still maintain its functionality. Also as per irreducible

laws of God or nature, liberty regardless of its type or manifestation, is like a three legged standing

table. Thus it has a very delicate balance. In order to maintain this delicate balance, all the three legs of liberty have to be firm, in equal amplitude and footing. The three legs of liberty are knowledge,

property and violence. Damage or remove any one or more of these three, liberty does not remain

liberty. These three are ageless, dynamic, enduring, living facts and truths, able to transcend both

space and time. They will last for all time. They are not a Rubick's cube, something to be "figured

out" or "solved". Depending whether one is friend of liberty or enemy of liberty, any or all of these

three can be used for positive or negative purposes. All fundamental rights are children and

dependents of these three facts and truths. Let me explain these three very briefly below for purpose

of illustration:

Knowledge includes all kinds of knowledge, all its manifestations and means. Thus fundamental rights of conscience, expression, religion, speech, intelligence gathering, surveillance, science, technology and the like are all also its children and dependents.

Property includes all kinds of property, its all manifestations and means. Thus fundamental right of

property, right over one's own body, intellectual property, trade, commerce, industry and the like are all also its children and dependents.

Violence includes all kinds of violence, its all manifestations and means. Thus fundamental rights of

self defense, right to keep and bear arms and the like are all also its children and dependents.

These three legs of liberty are all inalienably linked together with all the three of themselves.

And all through the ages to this day, there is a constant conflict between friends of liberty who

protect these three legs of liberty and enemies of liberty who attack these three legs of liberty.

Whenever any of the three legs of liberty are damaged or shortened by enemies of liberty, the table

of liberty is on the brink of destruction, in due course of time it looses its balance and falls. Now

with example of three legged table, I have explained how the three legs or foundations of liberty are

important for the very existence and enjoyment of liberty and its subset sovereignty.

For ease of understanding, now let me explain below with another concrete example, about how

sovereignty is dependent on liberty, how liberty and sovereignty is bound to fall with the fall of any

of the three legs of liberty.

Lion is called King or Sovereign of the jungle not without a reason. He is sovereign because he has

all the three pillars of liberty, no other animal in jungle can surpass his ability to protect the three

pillars of liberty. He has first pillar of liberty called knowledge i.e. he knows how to hunt. He has

the second pillar called property i.e. marks and possesses territory where he hunts. He can unleash

violence i.e. powerful teeth and claws. Remove any one pillar of liberty, other two pillars can't

support the weight of his liberty. He is no more sovereign. See how it happens in examples of facts

and truth below:

Remove or bypass knowledge, like hunter lays a hidden trap. Lion has no knowledge or

understanding that there is a trap. He gets trapped. He becomes the slave or prisoner of hunter. His

liberty is finished. His life is also at the mercy of hunter. He is no more sovereign.

Remove the property i.e. territory of lion by putting him in cage or zoo. He is slave or prisoner. His

liberty is finished. His life is also at the mercy of hunter. He is no more sovereign.

Remove violence i.e. remove the teeth and claws of lion. He becomes the slave or prisoner of all

those who have teeth and claws in the jungle. His life is also at the mercy of enemies of his liberty

who have teeth and claws in the jungle. They do what they want, like injure, torture or kill him. His

liberty is finished. He is no more sovereign.

Above example is equally and similarly applicable to any Nation, it's State or it's citizens or

persons. Remove or damage any of the above mentioned three pillars of liberty for any Nation, it's State or it's citizens or persons, liberty is no more liberty for them. They are at mercy and slave of those powers who enjoy all the three pillars of liberty. Put the above test to any period of history of Sikhs, whenever any of their three pillars of liberty was compromised(mainly due to their ignorance or lack of foresight), they lost their sovereignty and became slaves. One may also call the three pillars of liberty as grundnorms of liberty. From all these it becomes clear that if the liberty means liberty, then it is undoubtedly bound to have all the three pillars(causa sine qua non) of liberty, that are the essence, the elements, the substance of liberty including the right to keep and bear arms is bound to be inalienably sine qua non embedded in it equally for all, including the Constitution, it's State, it's citizens and it's persons.

It is moral duty of every Sikh to support the movement of Right to Keep and Bear Arms and organizations that stand for it. It is in their interest. It is part and parcel of their religious doctrine. The Right to Keep and Bear Arms is part and parcel of British Common Law. The Doctrine of 2nd Amendment is also from British Common Law foundations. This Doctrine is also part and parcel of Sikh religion. Examples:

1) Miri Piri

2) Degh Tegh Fateh

3) Raaj bina Dharam Nahin, Dharam bina sab dalle malle

4) Koi kisi ko raaj na dehe, jo le he, nij bal se le he

5) Chun kar az hameh heelat-e dar guzasht halal ast burdan b-shamshir dast(When all the stratagem employed for (solving) a problem are exhausted,(only) then taking your hand to the sword is legitimate.) This is the most quoted verse of Zafarnama. 300 years ago, Guru Gobind Singh Ji had laid down the circumstances when a person or a nation can pick up the sword(weapons of war) against the other.

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Guest Jacfsing2

Some of the 5 kakkars help us not just in this life.. but afterlife(hell) as well. For example; I was told that we are supposed to keep our hairs so we can be distinguished in(if we happen to be in) narakh and get rescued ..

By that logic Gurbachana is in Sach Khand.
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