Puratan Sikhi

[Guest AnonSengh]

6 minutes ago, Kira said:

Where did you hear that some of them had mistakes from? would love to see the sources as its pretty intriguing. 

It's in the photo:

The Date on the Bir is 1755BK, which is 1698, as we know, but look closely:

It says ੴ ਸ੍ਰੀਸਤਿਗੁਰਪ੍ਰਸਾਦਿ, you can also see Vaheguru is missing a Sihari before the ਹ.

 

Also, there is some controversy if ੴ ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂ ਜੀ ਕੀ ਫਤਹ ॥ is the correct manglacharan, or ੴ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂ ਜੀ ਕੀ ਫਤਹ ॥ is the correct one.

Bul Chuk Muaaf!

[Kira]

7 minutes ago, Guest AnonSengh said:

It's in the photo:

The Date on the Bir is 1755BK, which is 1698, as we know, but look closely:

It says ੴ ਸ੍ਰੀਸਤਿਗੁਰਪ੍ਰਸਾਦਿ, you can also see Vaheguru is missing a Sihari before the ਹ.

 

Also, there is some controversy if ੴ ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂ ਜੀ ਕੀ ਫਤਹ ॥ is the correct manglacharan, or ੴ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂ ਜੀ ਕੀ ਫਤਹ ॥ is the correct one.

Bul Chuk Muaaf!

The way I see it the red script is Bhai Mani Singh Ji's notes, given that the actual Mukhvaak is started later on, it wasn't really uncommon for poetics to adopt their own Manglacharans as their own sort of mark. 

[Guest AnonSengh]

3 minutes ago, Kira said:

The way I see it the red script is Bhai Mani Singh Ji's notes

That's a new thing I heard, It doesn't make sense in my opinion if thats the case

[Kira]

1 minute ago, Guest AnonSengh said:

That's a new thing I heard, It doesn't make sense in my opinion if thats the case

Looking at the bani and how its done it seems to be Bhai Mani Singh Ji taking the date and other things, it actually makes perfect sense given how the process of compiling and getting the Granths down on parchment was done. Again im hyposizing based on what I know and what I'm seeing right now. That Bir (the Patna Sahib Bir) has had extensive research done on it already by learned scholars, all of whom have concluded its authentic.

Top left the writing talks refers to the index of the Granth, When it was written and who's bani it is and then "thy grace" , and then From the Mukh of the tenth master. The actual Gurbani index is written differently than that, rather than looking at the index look at the actual Gurbani within the Granth, that's where the actual Manglacharan from Guru Sahib is.

[jkvlondon]

9 hours ago, Jacfsing2 said:

If you read through my previous posts, I'm not exactly pro-Singh Sabha, but somebody pierced Dasam Granth and nobody is claiming any side. But to answer that question, it's probably the same with Anti-Pad-Shed folk, who downright insult Non-Larivar Saroops of Dhan Dhan Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji, (you'll even find those folk lurking on this forum, claiming love for Guru Sahib). I'm sorry to anyone who hates Pad Shed so much, but I think it's probably the same thing with the Nihangs, they felt the Saroop wasn't complete or something.

Padd ched is manmat , and even according to SGPC larivaar saroop is Guru ji's true form , there is a reason Guru Sahiban wrote Bani that way. Since Padd ched had been introduced by SGPC they have tried to 'normalise' manglacharans across the Guru Granth Sahib they print but were caught ...by scholars . In the decades ahead who will do this ? people who accept whatever they mischievously try to pass as true?

[ipledgeblue]

On 04/06/2016 at 11:58 PM, AmandeepSinghBansel said:

Waheguru ji ka khalsa waheguru ji ki fateh,

After doing much itihaas i have found it that the darshan of Sri Dasam and Sarbloh Darbar is of utmost importance for the sake of the chardikala of the Sikh panth alongside Satguru Granth sahib ji maharaj. What can be done in the uk and in sangats across the world to install sri Dasam granth and Sarbloh Granth as seen in Takht Sri Hazoor sahib were the maryada of the tisarpanth seems to be alive and well aswell as shastar darshan.Can those of us that believe this to be an important issue do anything to create change?

This will be slow but should happen. Dasam bani knowledge is urgently needed for sikhs all over the world. If sikhs had chartripakhyan knowledge gyaan it could help with the kanjar dating stuff and drink pub club smoke culture mentality bringing us down. Also dasme pathsha banis promote the mind to support carrying shastar. Sarbloh Granth will take more difficulty for panth to understand, but is required.

Slowly, slowly need to bring banis back into nitnem before these changes. 

-bring more dasam banis into nitnem, and promote longer Chaupai Sahib and Tav prasad Swaiye. Add Chandi banis and shastarnaam mala. some gurdwaras I see are now doing the longer Chaupai paat. Sampooran Rehraas and also full Aarti Aarta with Guru Gobind Singh ji baniya, not the short one they do in Harimandir Sahib. THEN, things will change.

However, also remember that alot of parkash might be done by Chakarvarti Singhs or outside gurdwaras. Remember rehati Singhs might be living outside and travelling. Gurdwaras had much more sehajdhari sangat before Singh Sabha movement, so may have just had Adi Guru Granth parkash. In fact, there were gurdwaras that just had shastar prakash only, and no granth parkash. This would have reduced beadbi greatly, as Adi Granth saroop were handwritten and larivaar, and not SGPC printing press copies. The saroop would more likely be at gurdwaras with sewadaars, and not lonely, quiet gurdwaras. Now that gurdwaras are controlled by amrit dharis, why are the gurdwaras still only parkash Adi Guru Granth, this is more like sehajdhari gurdwara. If the mahants have been removed, then why are gurdwaras only concentrating on bani for wider panth and not Khalsa panth. It is making gurdwaras into sehajdhari gurdwaras, and sehajdhari mentaltiy - this would be pefectly fine for gurdwaras that are not under khalsa panth and under sehajdharis or sehajdhari mahants

 

On 05/06/2016 at 9:09 PM, GurburAkal said:

I am welcome to this idea, but SDGS and SSGS should not be prakashon the same level as SGGS.

prakash should be very much lower, so that we show respect to our Guru.

I have full faith and respect for Dasam Bani, but I think we need to remember our GURU is SGGS.

Guru Granth Sahib Maharaj is our GURU, they are not just a granth.

Although I do feel Dasve Patshah Dee Bani needs to return to our Gurdwara Sahibs

And along with keeping nice shiny shastars prakash , I think we should also buy firearms and keep them locked up in a gun safe to protect the Gurdwara Sahib if need be. Shastars aren't only for show, contrary to popular belief.

I think it might have been this forum where I read words of Guru Gobind Singh, where the pothis are consider siblings or children of Adi Granth. Parkash of pothis can be done a bit lower or nearby.

On 05/06/2016 at 2:25 PM, Jacfsing2 said:

For Shastars you make Gatka the up most importance for an activity in the Gurdwara that anyone can do, (many people won't be inspired just looking at Shastars if you asked them. Vaheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Vaheguru Ji Ki Fateh!

instead of the gatka dancing done by mainstream, we should have archery and shooting ranges set up in the big gurdwaras. Look how much space there is in Singh Sabha Havelock Southall! LEarning archery and shooting is much more useful then modern gatka.

shastar vidiya (or i guess some gatka) is important, but only if we can find the correct teachers. otherwise need to complement with martial arts. But also important to have wrestling/mal yudh and kabaddi also aids in this. Remember Guru Angad setup up wrestling akharas. So why are we not doing this? And most of the kabaddi players are moneh, why are amrit dharis not picking this up? see some aspects of shastar vidiya such as mal yudh/wrestling is easily available yet we are not implementing it!

[Guest Jacfsing2]

1 hour ago, jkvlondon said:

Padd ched is manmat , 

This one statement proves my point. 

[Mahakaal96]

45 minutes ago, Jacfsing2 said:

This one statement proves my point. 

Doesn't prove anything.

first padd ched saroop & Gutka Sahibs were written by shaheed Bhai Mani Singh Ji .... some in puratan sampardai believe that Bhai Mani Singh being cut bhund by bhund was the price they had to pay for cutting Gurbani up into padd ched saroop.... which was actually done by Bhai Mani Singh to assist the panth in the future by making Gurbani easier to read for the masses.

[jkvlondon]

1 hour ago, Mahakaal96 said:

Doesn't prove anything.

first padd ched saroop & Gutka Sahibs were written by shaheed Bhai Mani Singh Ji .... some in puratan sampardai believe that Bhai Mani Singh being cut bhund by bhund was the price they had to pay for cutting Gurbani up into padd ched saroop.... which was actually done by Bhai Mani Singh to assist the panth in the future by making Gurbani easier to read for the masses.

but the truth is what was done for learning the bisrams etc has now been used to transform and mutilate full saroops and even to sneak in changes to bani, I'm sure that is not what our bazurg had intended but to maintain the awe and respect of unbroken Guru ji and strive to be worthy of being a granthi i.e. Vizier of Guru Sahib, by going through full training of santhiya, raag etc 

[SoulSingh]

lol I'm really confused now, can I at least know if nihungs and the singh sabha movement had a rivalry/ didn't get along with each other.