Has anyone here read the Quran

[MisterrSingh]

1 minute ago, AjeetSinghPunjabi said:

When you interpret these scriptures and saying in a metaphorical and subtle way, the beauty emerges ! and extremism fades into thin air ! 

“I saw the prophet – pbuh – sucking on the tongue or the lips of Al-Hassan son of Ali, may the prayers of Allah be upon him. For no tongue or lips that the prophet sucked on will be tormented (by hell fire)

He (the Prophet) lift up his (al Hassan’s) shirt and kissed his (little) <banned word filter activated>..”
روى أنه صلى الله عليه و سلم قبل زبيبة الحسن أو الحسين
He (the prophet) kissed the (little) <banned word filter activated> of al Hassan or al Husein
رأيت النبي صلى الله عليه و سلم فرج ما بين فخذي الحسين و قبل زبيبته
He (the prophet) put Husein’s legs apart and kissed his (little) <banned word filter activated>

Another Hadith. Majma al-Zawa’id, Ali ibn Abu Bakr al-Haythami, 299/9 مجمع الزوائد لعلي بن أبى بكر الهيثمي

رأيت رسول الله صلى الله عليه و سلم فرج ما بين فخذي الحسين و قبل زبيبته
رواه الطبراني و إسناده حسن
translated into English: “I saw the Messenger of Allah pbuh putting Husein’s legs apart and kissing his (little) <banned word filter activated>.”

 

You're chatting nonsense. Show me the beauty in any of the above.

[Guest AjeetSinghPunjabi]

3 minutes ago, MisterrSingh said:

“I saw the prophet – pbuh – sucking on the tongue or the lips of Al-Hassan son of Ali, may the prayers of Allah be upon him. For no tongue or lips that the prophet sucked on will be tormented (by hell fire)

He (the Prophet) lift up his (al Hassan’s) shirt and kissed his (little) <banned word filter activated>..”
روى أنه صلى الله عليه و سلم قبل زبيبة الحسن أو الحسين
He (the prophet) kissed the (little) <banned word filter activated> of al Hassan or al Husein
رأيت النبي صلى الله عليه و سلم فرج ما بين فخذي الحسين و قبل زبيبته
He (the prophet) put Husein’s legs apart and kissed his (little) <banned word filter activated>

Another Hadith. Majma al-Zawa’id, Ali ibn Abu Bakr al-Haythami, 299/9 مجمع الزوائد لعلي بن أبى بكر الهيثمي

رأيت رسول الله صلى الله عليه و سلم فرج ما بين فخذي الحسين و قبل زبيبته
رواه الطبراني و إسناده حسن
translated into English: “I saw the Messenger of Allah pbuh putting Husein’s legs apart and kissing his (little) <banned word filter activated>.”

 

You're chatting nonsense. Show me the beauty in any of the above.

Hadisey are controversial ! Quran is not same as hadiths . Gurbani says nothing on hadiths . 

Hadiths are just life accounts of Muhammad by his contemporaries or so they say. Barbaric things of islam like circumcision etc are found in hadiths only, not quran ! 

Also , I am no apologist for islam. I am just saying our Guru sahib said "Bed kateb kaho mat jhootey, jhoota jo na beecharey"

[MisterrSingh]

5 minutes ago, jkvlondon said:

Guru Sahiban would not have commented on the quran as such because the quran was not the same as it is now , also the hadiths were ascribed to Mohammed many years after his death ; in that case anyone can say anything and say the prophet said it , I mean the sayings had to be sifted for the final published ones out of many thousands 

The Qur'an immediately post Mohammed's death and the versions edited thereafter may have differed in content, but i struggle to believe they were still revising and editing the essence of it a mere 300 or so years ago. Surely it would've been in a finalised form by the year 1700?

[MisterrSingh]

Just now, AjeetSinghPunjabi said:

Hadisey are controversial ! Quran is not same as hadiths . Gurbani says nothing on hadiths . 

Hadiths are just life accounts of Muhammad by his contemporaries or so they say. Barbaric things of islam like circumcision etc are found in hadiths only, not quran ! 

Also , I am no apologist for islam. I am just saying our Guru sahib said "Bed kateb kaho mat jhootey, jhoota jo na beecharey"

Don't make me search for similar content in the Quran itself, lol. It won't be pretty. Btw, you said "scriptures" not solely the Qur'an, so the Hadith is covered by the term "scriptures."

[jkvlondon]

12 minutes ago, MisterrSingh said:

The Qur'an immediately post Mohammed's death and the versions edited thereafter may have differed in content, but i struggle to believe they were still revising and editing the essence of it a mere 300 or so years ago. Surely it would've been in a finalised form by the year 1700?

There is also the versions of islam , one that Mohammeds family had championed and then the one that their (the family's) would-be assassin's created. Allah in the quran is so not detached, but seems gleeful at hurting or confusing the lost instead of loving and forgiving 

[MisterrSingh]

1 minute ago, jkvlondon said:

There is also the versions of islam , one that Mohammeds family had championed and then the one that their would-be assassin's created. Allah in the quran is so not detached, but seems gleeful at hurting or confusing the lost instead of loving and forgiving 

I'll have to read up on all this. I know that Mohammed's assassin was apparently a Jewish woman whose family he'd previously slain, so unless Jews had their hands in creating a version of the Qur'an, I'm getting confused.

[Guest AjeetSinghPunjabi]

7 minutes ago, MisterrSingh said:

Don't make me search for similar content in the Quran itself, lol. It won't be pretty. Btw, you said "scriptures" not solely the Qur'an, so the Hadith is covered by the term "scriptures."

NO ! Hadith is not scripture , the same way that sikh historian book is not a scripture for us 

There are 4 scriptures of east (4 vedas), and 4 of west (Quran, Bible , Avestha and Torah) . Even Gurbani mentions these as "CHAAR" . So there are chaar ved , chaar kateb ! 

 

Quran is not comprehensive as SGGS is ! Its not as great either . I am just saying that it can give you a person direction to spiritual life if they handle it well . I know it has verses which say life of this dunia is temporary delusion . Same concept as "jag is maya" . It introduces in a person unattachment of this worldly life, "bairaag" I might say. 

Ofcourse, only if someone skipped madrasa and kept aside the criminal law verses (chopping hands, heads, etc lol) which I believe were delivered in the first place because arabs were quite bewakoof kind of people. They had to be guided .

Also Muhammad got revelation from outside (angel gabriel), not from inside , as in case of Guru sahib. which leads me to believe that prophet Muhammad was of not a very high spiritual state. no offense

[Guest AjeetSinghPunjabi]

I can say a lot about muhammad here . But I am not going to , because I don't think I have that kind of kamaai to lambast a religious leader, even though he was quite controversial . And I don't want PAAP on my head, incase i m wrong lol

[MisterrSingh]

2 minutes ago, AjeetSinghPunjabi said:

NO ! Hadith is not scripture , the same way that sikh historian book is not a scripture for us 

There are 4 scriptures of east (4 vedas), and 4 of west (Quran, Bible , Avestha and Torah) . Even Gurbani mentions these as "CHAAR" . So there are chaar ved , chaar kateb ! 

 

Quran is not comprehensive as SGGS is ! Its not as great either . I am just saying that it can give you a person direction to spiritual life if they handle it well . I know it has verses which say life of this dunia is temporary delusion . Same concept as "jag is maya" . It introduces in a person unattachment of this worldly life, "bairaag" I might say. 

Ofcourse, only if someone skipped madrasa and kept aside the criminal law verses (chopping hands, heads, etc lol) which I believe were delivered in the first place because arabs were quite bewakoof kind of people. They had to be guided .

Also Muhammad got revelation from outside (angel gabriel), not from inside , as in case of Guru sahib. which leads me to believe that prophet Muhammad was of not a very high spiritual state. no offense

Well, I'll have a better handle of these issues once I've read it.

Plus, don't use exclamation marks and bold entire paragraphs when conversing with people on forums. It denotes shouting, and it makes you seem like a pendu.

[proactive]

23 minutes ago, AjeetSinghPunjabi said:

"Bed kateb kaho mat jhootey. Jhoota jo na beecharey" ~ SGGS

(Do not say that the vedas or semitic books are false . False are those who don't comprehend their essence)

 

Quran is one of those books , like uranium ! You can use it to run electricity plants or make it into atom bombs ! 

Unfortunately for this holy book, it landed amidst a bunch of buffoons ! Who didn't apprehend the underlying essence of it 

 

Who's kaafir ? they say its non muslims. Actually its those humans of any religion who refuse to thank god and are ungrateful. They say "Islam is the only religion acceptable to allah". True that, Islam (submission to will of god) is only religion acceptable to god . Its just that islam can be sikhi or hindu or buddhist too ! 

When you interpret these scriptures and saying in a metaphorical and subtle way, the beauty emerges ! and extremism fades into thin air ! 

Have you read the rest of the Shabad by Bhagat Kabirji? You are no different to those you accuse of not understanding the underlying essence of the scriptures. Please read the rest of the Shabad where Bhagat kabirji criticises halal slaughter, ritual cleansing etc. Btw the Shabad has always been read along with the Sakhi where Bhagat Kabirji criticises those who dismiss other's scriptures without having contemplated them. So there is nothing wrong on stating they do not make sense once you have read them.

Your understanding of Kafir is what the Muslims want non-Muslims in the west to believe until they are able to become a majority and then you will understand what they really mean by kafir. Mohammed killed and threw out all the Jews and Christians out of Arabia. So were all these Jews and Christians ones who refused to thank god and were ungrateful??

Stop playing word games. Islam means submission to the will of Allah not belief in Gods other than Allah. Lets play your wold game further, I know since every person alive in this world is learning something each and every day then that makes them Sikhs! So who says Sikhs are only 25 million, we Sikhs are now 6 Billion!