Tables and Chairs in the Gurdwara

[Gupt daasan daas]

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

wats next, benches in he sangat?

tables and chairs are against langar concept

its not only were ont he same level

its also we sit on the lowest level together for humility

tables wud take that away

y dont we have benches in sangat??

we gotta stop blending in and stick out as the khalsa shud

bhula chuka maf

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

[Guest JSS]

i agree with being on the same level...but khalistani...where does it say it has to be the lowest level????

i've been to a lot of gurdwaras around the world where thhere are no tables/ chairs and places where there are tables...and let me tell you...the gurdwaras with the tables don't have tables with DIFFERING heights....everyone IS on the same level...

but i'm curious to see where it says you have to be on the FLOOR....if it says that then..well that ends the debate...if it doesn't say that...then you gotta think rationally about it....tables doesn't equal inequality...so relax on the equal level argument...cuz it's flawed.....if you don't see how it's flawed...take a first year course in modes of reasoning at any uni and you'll see that it's flawed.....

[S1ngh]

i agree with being on the same level...but khalistani...where does it say it has to be the lowest level????

i've been to a lot of gurdwaras around the world where thhere are no tables/ chairs and places where there are tables...and let me tell you...the gurdwaras with the tables don't have tables with DIFFERING heights....everyone IS on the same level...

but i'm curious to see where it says you have to be on the FLOOR....if it says that then..well that ends the debate...if it doesn't say that...then you gotta think rationally about it....tables doesn't equal inequality...so relax on the equal level argument...cuz it's flawed.....if you don't see how it's flawed...take a first year course in modes of reasoning at any uni and you'll see that it's flawed.....

So veerjee u agree and will have no problem with having table and chairs at SAME level in langar hall? even Akal takht made it sikh law not to have chairs and tables in diwan hall? :wub: okay lets forget akal takht in this.. Can you pls tell me this.. Will you or us accept the concept of having chairs in diwan hall?? Though the guru sahib jee will still be seated higher than sangat chairs. But will you accept that?? it goes

pretty well with the concept of ppls idea of having table and chairs in langar hall. There were chairs and table during guru jees time and kings like akbar always sit on chairs.. but guru jee choose langar on ground.. Why? We all will ask from guru jee later on (in my case i will ask jamdoot).

Okay chalo there is table and chairs in langar.. nothing new about it .. kalyug ya keey karreeyaay.. anyway langar on table/chair but without head cover but with shoes?? (Ross street & Yuba city sikh temples).. See this is what happen when we don't set the limits. we don't need to be thaaaaat liberal, be conservative when it comes to these issues. That's my views :wub:

[Guest JSS]

k...first off....SIngh bro...

i really don't hold an opinion on the matter...if i go to a gurdwara where there's no table and chairs,,,i'll sit on the floor..if i go to a gurdwara where they got the tables and chairs thing going...i'm really not going to create a stink over it....i dunnno why...i just don't think it's all that important....

HOWEVER.....

i did post my earlier post hoping to get a really solid argument from one of you guys...cuz the same level thing isn't convincing....sort of playing devil's advocate....

your post made me think....

firstly...chairs in divan would be messed up....EXCEPT when they're at the back of the hall and for elderly people who can't sit down...i have NO problems with accomodating elderly people, people with disabilities...i doubt guru ji would mind....

now relating divan hall to langar hall...i really don't know if it's the same thing... i couldn't say either or....if it is considered the same thing..then i get your point....but if it is the same thing...then there are a lot of changes need to be made in MOST gurdwaras...

[Deep Singh]

A conversation between Anand Singh and Bijay Singh.....

A - GurFateh! Brother B, how is it going at your place? Gurdwara Sahib and sangat?

B: Fateh, bhaji A! Everything is fine, just there was a disturbance and fighting over chairs and tables. It is time we get some chairs in the langar hall!

A - But veer, langar should be in pangat!

B: What is pangat, bhaji?

A - Well, Pangat means a 'row' or line. Bhai Kahn Singh Nabha ji says that it is the same as a kataar.

B: If pangat is simply line, then we can make a line of table and chair and the problem is solved!?

A - Rehat says that while eating in the Langar, no one should be high or low. Everyone should sit together.

B: So tables and chairs can be at the same level...no problems created.

A - Langar should symbolize unity or saanjh (kind of feeling of oneness or indifference). Also, when eating langar we should "leave" our wordly possesions, and sit down. (at this level there is nothing higher - you are literally at the ground level). While sitting, you recieve Guru's blessings (the langar).

B: But, don't you think it is all about culture...in those days all Indians used to sit on the floor and eat! Now, there are enough resources to have tables and chairs. so why shouldn't we have that instead?

A - brother B, you argument is valid. BUT, not ALL indians ate while sitting on the floor...can you imagine raja/maharajas sitting down eating? Guru Sahib have created the langar in pangat on the floor so that no one has the feeling of being high or

low. Guru Sahib want their Sikhs to be full of nimarta (being humble/polite) and eat what the body needs nothing more.

If you are going to buy chairs, which type will you buy? Wooden, steel, maybe whole-steel, or plastic, or perhaps furnished, if the Gurdwara Committe has extra funds! But why don't they use the money to help poor people and giving more people food or education? Humanity is not served by creating monuments and structures, it is served by giving away what you have earned.

B: I never thought about that.

A - Just imagine what kind of spiritual bless a person has sitting besides GurSikhs eating in the pangat. Oh imagine, how it is to have Guru's blessings!

Either you are a doctor, a minister or a rickshaw-driver, you sit in the pangat. You have forgotten your wordly possesion, sitting at the ground....in the langar hall, you are nothing but a part of the sangat.

Sure, there is no other way of having true Langar, as ordained by Guru Sahib....

B: Dhan Dhan Waheguru!

( :wub: just thought we should introduce a new genre at sikhsangat...was kind of bored)

[JagKaur]

Thank you all soo much for your posts...i e-mailed the person back...with really good arguements..so thank you all!!!!

[GABROO KHALISTAN DAH]

if Guru Sahib can sit on the floor in sangat and shaak langar, then why can we?

im sure guru ji could've brought tables and chairs.

how is the langar hall different from guru maharaaajs divaan hall? its in the same building etc, guru ji is still the primary owner of that, and is the reigning king!

my question to u is would u sit on a chair of guru arjun dev ji wuz sitting up stairs or ne other guru sahib for that matter?