Sin/ Relationships/ Marriage

[The One]

Amongst people specially youth are affected by relationships etc... why is it frowned upon in the sikh community? why are notions like your a papi etc.. used to describe these people? Is it even Wrong? if So why is it?

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Marriage what if your parents want to choice your marriage partner? sounds all nice n jolly as your parents know whats best for you etc.. but what if your parents are not so "religious" and say they want their "religious" son to marry a girl that maybe not so religious? maybe shes not even baptized and vis vis virsa for a girl marrying someone not so religious?

Why is sex before marriage wrong? and if some one has done this are all past mistakes forgiven?

thank you

[JustME]

waheguruuuuuuuuuuuuuuu

im gonna attempt with gur kirpa to answer the first part of the question u ask.....but as i am not married i fell im ill equipped to advise you as such .....

Amongst people specially youth are affected by relationships etc... why is it frowned upon in the sikh community? why are notions like your a papi etc.. used to describe these people? Is it even Wrong? if So why is it?

There is Nothing wrong with the idea of having a relationship with someone outside of marriage..............its when we push the boundries of the term "relationship the situation gets complicated and in comes the notion of paap...............Sex before marraige is a sin simply bcos if we cannot control our carnel lust for a person until after marriage then, on the opposite scale how can we claim to be followers of God if we cannot practise the simplicity od self-restraint?

To follow the path of waheguru.......control of mind, body and spirit are the key players.........now to accosiate with someone before marriage, in terms of aqaintence, friendliness and company is not a bad thing..........for two souls to merge into one we must find out whether beliefs sentiments and dharic values are equal and shared.........now when the mind begins to push its way over dharam we start seeing the person in a lustful, unpure way and our mind takes us to the depths of Narak without the body making a single movement..........Here is where the self-restaint and control comes in and that can only be obtained through the grace of waheguru and bani/simeran/sewa.......

one can only be labled a papi where pasp is committed by we manmukhs see paap as what other people see........the REAL paap is the filth that resides in our minds.........the body simply carries out these desires/thoughts and wills...........the notion on paap today is used all too much but never applied in the right context..............if we look inside ourselves we'll we see the real paap/punn and THAT is what holds greater value.

A sikh community and a sikh believer are too different things..........hence the notion of paap differs...........on both internal and external factors...........

Why is sex before marriage wrong? and if some one has done this are all past mistakes forgiven?

i think i have answered the first part of this question in the above reply..........aaaaah good ol forgivness.................we often seek forgiveness on the notion we have done something wrong but when we think about we never quite understand the wrongness of our actions................in order to seek forgiveness we need to understad "regret" understand why we feel the need to be forgiven...............forgiveness can only be obtained when the mind understands the wrongness.rightness one ones actions.....

[Tarrandeep Kaur]

sex before marriage is wrong becuase it is a bajjar kurehit.

yes alot of people are in the position were your parents dont always know best when it comes to marriage, in that case try get some older gursikhs to help. Or other family/friends. Its one of those things that will just happen, without you worrying too much about it.

[The One]

alot of amritdhari youths are in relationships to some "undercover" others not so much. Alot of sikhs that i have come across always seem to have in their minds you shouldn't go to clubs etc... because all you go for is to look and chat up members of the opposite sex ( some go to the extreme that you should avoid even talking to people of the opposite sex) but at the same time you have sikhs youth in they baanas etc.. going to kirtan programmes and rehansbhais ( which is good) but all they do is talk to girls and boys their maybe even "flirt" , whats the difference between someone going to a club and trying to find someone and someone who goes to a gurdwara and does it.

I find alot of people who wear dastaars and keep beards and maybe amritdhari to be really stuck up, they tend to stay away from people that may not be as into sikhi as them,

[kh@ls@]

but at the same time you have sikhs youth in they baanas etc.. going to kirtan programmes and rehansbhais ( which is good) but all they do is talk to girls and boys their maybe even "flirt" , whats the difference between someone going to a club and trying to find someone and someone who goes to a gurdwara and does it.

I don't know anyone that goes to rehnsbais to "flirt" people go to have darshan of maharaj and get laha of sangat. Most ppl stay in the hall most of the time and so don't really get time to talk to anyone, because thats not the point of going...... You don't really know what your talking about.

Is it even Wrong? if So why is it?

Relationships are WRONG. Why, because they can lead to premarital relations, as said before sex before marriage is a bujjer kureiht.

why are notions like your a papi etc.. used to describe these people?

You say people that have relationships are referred to as papi's. Well what is a papi, someone who has committed paap, relationships in most cases will lead to paap. Why because it is human nature and this is kaljug. Only people with good karm and who japp naam alot can beat kaam. Even if you think you can have a relationship and get to know someone etc. without anything 'happening' the chances of kaam taking control of your mind are very high. If an amritdhari gets into this situation and loses to kaam then he is a kurehti, and thereby will have ruined his jeevan it make take him years to get back to where he was spirtually. So why put yourself at risk in the first place.

So basically relationships MIGHT lead kaam this is why they are wrong. Because you're gambling with your jeevan.

[JustME]

alot of amritdhari youths are in relationships to some "undercover" others not so much. Alot of sikhs that i have come across always seem to have in their minds you shouldn't go to clubs etc... because all you go for is to look and chat up members of the opposite sex ( some go to the extreme that you should avoid even talking to people of the opposite sex) but at the same time you have sikhs youth in they baanas etc.. going to kirtan programmes and rehansbhais ( which is good) but all they do is talk to girls and boys their maybe even "flirt" , whats the difference between someone going to a club and trying to find someone and someone who goes to a gurdwara and does it.

why concern urself with the actions of others? y are u trying to use others to justify ur own actions/thoughts or feelings? each is a slave to their karam........dont mess up urs following what other are destined to do...............

whether u do it at a club or a rainsbhai the "PAAP" aspect of following carnal lust over ur Guru is exactly the same...........i do not think u will get more or less eaither way..........the mind is same, the thoughts are the same..........it doesnt matter where the physical presence is..

I find alot of people who wear dastaars and keep beards and maybe amritdhari to be really stuck up, they tend to stay away from people that may not be as into sikhi as them,

Again and that effects ur sikhi in what way?................i understand cos i was pretty much a loner in terms of physical sangat apart from the few gems that were able to look past the cut hair and wild clothes.................but it is Waheguru who is by urside no matter wot and when u stop looking at others and look inside urself, u will know exactly what is right and wot is wrong..............what path u decide to take..........well................thats up to u.

instead of "oh they are like this so im gonna be like that" trying to right a wrong action will only lead you to one place.................chaurassi lakh joon

waheguruuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu

[Guest peacemaker]

I find alot of people who wear dastaars and keep beards and maybe amritdhari to be really stuck up, they tend to stay away from people that may not be as into sikhi as them,

I've seen that in real life and I hate that mentality in both men and women.

[Tarrandeep Kaur]

alot of amritdhari youths are in relationships to some "undercover" others not so much. Alot of sikhs that i have come across always seem to have in their minds you shouldn't go to clubs etc... because all you go for is to look and chat up members of the opposite sex ( some go to the extreme that you should avoid even talking to people of the opposite sex) but at the same time you have sikhs youth in they baanas etc.. going to kirtan programmes and rehansbhais ( which is good) but all they do is talk to girls and boys their maybe even "flirt" , whats the difference between someone going to a club and trying to find someone and someone who goes to a gurdwara and does it.

I find alot of people who wear dastaars and keep beards and maybe amritdhari to be really stuck up, they tend to stay away from people that may not be as into sikhi as them,

paaji/penji

ok so there maybe SOME people who do them things you have stated, but so what. If they are doing these silly actions, what concern is it to you. this mentality of they do this so why cant we do this, seems rather silly. If they are doing wrong actions then they will be dealt with, in the meantime, you avoid the mistakes they make and try harder.

ok some people distance themselves from others due to appearance which is wrong. and we shouldnt have this mentality. however there are some people i know personally that prefer to just have sangat of gursikhs, but that doesnt mean they would ignore non sikh people.

at the end of the day were not perfect, us youth are constantly making mistakes and learning from them. Its a shame that people fail to pick out the good points that the youth do. Like i said dont worry about peoples bad actions and focus on your own actions.

sorry if ive said anything wrong.

gurfateh jeeo.

[B4ND4]

I find alot of people who wear dastaars and keep beards and maybe amritdhari to be really stuck up, they tend to stay away from people that may not be as into sikhi as them,

Its their personal choice and i feel we shoudln't be pointing fingers at them. For example, I can't stand close and chat with a person who is smoking. Similarly, may be they feel talking to someone who doesn't share same values as them might affect their jeevan.

[Guest peacemaker]

So they wouldn't be rude if a non sikh approached them, but would they be rude if a sikh approached them?