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anom7
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I don't think I contradicted myself because I have explained what in my opinion His Will is. His Will is set of rules or laws by which the creation operates. This is how our actions or karams come into play. Waheguru gives us options and choices to choose from. We can be put into a particular situation based on our past karma but what we decide from thereon is our choice and this is what makes new karma. Our decision depends on our ability to realize His Will. If we have gurmat viewpoint our choice will be good if not it will be bad. Waheguru's Will allows us to make choices. All choices (good or bad) have some destiny which is already known to Waheguru. Hence, everything is happening according to Will. It makes sense in my mind but it is extremely difficult or nearly impossible to write it down and explain it to others. Every shabad is written in its own context. So post the shabad first then we can see what Gurbani says. Without understanding the context of the shabad we will never be able to understand Gurbani.

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hukmI hovin Awkwr hukmu n kihAw jweI ]

hukamee hovan aakaar hukam n kehiaa jaaee ||

By His Command, bodies are created; His Command cannot be described.

hukmI hovin jIA hukim imlY vifAweI ]

hukamee hovan jeea hukam milai vaddiaaee ||

By His Command, souls come into being; by His Command, glory and greatness are obtained.

hukmI auqmu nIcu hukim iliK duK suK pweIAih ]

hukamee outham neech hukam likh dhukh sukh paaeeahi ||

By His Command, some are high and some are low; by His Written Command, pain and pleasure are obtained.

ieknw hukmI bKsIs ieik hukmI sdw BvweIAih ]

eikanaa hukamee bakhasees eik hukamee sadhaa bhavaaeeahi ||

Some, by His Command, are blessed and forgiven; others, by His Command, wander aimlessly forever.

hukmY AMdir sBu ko bwhir hukm n koie ]

hukamai a(n)dhar sabh ko baahar hukam n koe ||

Everyone is subject to His Command; no one is beyond His Command.

nwnk hukmY jy buJY q haumY khY n koie ]2]

naanak hukamai jae bujhai th houmai kehai n koe ||2||

O Nanak, one who understands His Command, does not speak in ego. ||2||

http://www.sikhitothemax.com/page.asp?ShabadID=2

sorry about the gurmukhi not appearing.

i remember asking this question and being told its not possible to fully comprehend hukam.

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but they seem contradicatory

i would say read what u asked (1st post) and now read what u wrote yesterday=)

kaur khalistani i cant remeber off the top of my head

bharam is somethingthat is not easily escaped

ive been searching hard for 10 yrs the answers now, and 5 yrs ago i was extremly serious into the search

i kno i wont find anyhting until guru je bestows it, which is all i wait for

in my mind, all will happen inthe end as he wants it to

u cant excpet a child to understand physics

same situation with us

we cant understand everything perfectly until we actually expiernce vaheguru

guru sahib says that a lot of time that we can't grasp the vastness of vaheguru..."tera anth na payiya" r we trying to find his anth?

about contradictions

... when u read gurbani it seems like it is contradicting ...but it doesn't as is said by many. it is our interpretations of it.

the reason i asked u to post the shabds is that we need to read first few shabds and the last few shabds to understand what is being taught to us(to our mind) so we can understand and walk on the spiritual path.

it's been 10 years? is that what u have been searching for? y?

hukam controls everythings

but then why does guru je also say we get what we derseve through our actions?

is the confusion...>> if everything is within hukum, then how/why do we 'suffere' according to/through our actions?

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theres a lot of reasons to search

it has nothing to do with vahegurus anth, cuz i kno there is no anth to vaheguru

but there are questions in the mind that one wants to adress

and bhagthi does show the truth

and bijla singh i never said u contradicted ureself..

like i said when i reas gurbani i TRY to put my mind on it, and i duntt hnk about writing it down

its not trhe shaabd im not understanding

i understand the shabad pretty well, its the message

im sure uve read it during nitnem

of the to of my head

ok one thuk wud be in the part of anand sahib where it starts with bhagtha ke chaal niralee

around there it will talk about how vaheguru puts bhagthaa on his path

so now if vaheguru puts them on the path, and he causes the papee to paap, then y is the papee punished

it comes dwon to free will vs vaheguurus hukam

japji sahib states that hukmai andar sabh ko bahaar hukam no koe, japji sahib states many times this theme look at wat anon posted

and then again japji sahib says apai beej apai he khahoo

thats wat doesnt make sence to me, and wat io said before about papee being punished

lke i said im sure everyone here has read the two themes im talking about, its everywhere in guru je and banee

and i tried to post some thuks of the top of my head

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We cannot limit the terminology of “Hukam” by translating it to “His command” yes we agree everything in existence his via “His command” the problem is we then start to develop the mentality

“We suffer because the LORD wills it”

no this is not true, suffering is a Human condition, we create suffering because its our inability to handle the situation. This differs from pain, pain is a natural condition designed to tell you something physical is wrong. One could be in pain but it does not mean one also has to suffer, if one does it is totally of their own making.

God as we say does not sit in the heavens picking and choosing who should suffer and who shouldn’t this is something we have developed.

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We cannot limit the terminology of “Hukam” by translating it to “His command” yes we agree everything in existence his via “His command” the problem is we then start to develop the mentality

“We suffer because the LORD wills it”

no this is not true, suffering is a Human condition, we create suffering because its our inability to handle the situation. This differs from pain, pain is a natural condition designed to tell you something physical is wrong. One could be in pain but it does not mean one also has to suffer, if one does it is totally of their own making.

God as we say does not sit in the heavens picking and choosing who should suffer and who shouldn’t this is something we have developed.

crazy post

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but in gurbani it says we suffer because vaheguru wills it.....

thas the whole point of the discussion

ill juist re ask the questions inn my last post

wjkk wjkf!

"man tou jot saroop hai appna mool pacchaan har ji tere naal hai ...."

and many moor tuks refer back to that we are the light....waheguru lives in us right? that means onces that light is recognized...we realize hukum and the pain and suffering is all "gone"(?)

until then we run around feelin all the anguish, disappointments, pains etc etc

is there a controversy? i dont see it at the moment!(u did confuse me and boggled my mind for a bit and made me thing hmm there are two themes..i dont see um now. we need to get into the dept of things by sittin with guru sahiban nd gurmukhs/or any spiritual being who has realized the universal truth)

its the ego

when their is ego...thn there is no god...thus all the mayavi stuff bothrs the ego.

bhul chuk muaff karni

the hardest thing is even though we all know it ...still we suffer...its all known but not REALIZED and felt yet..jus gallaan hi ney(mere talk) to understand who we really.

warrior has explained it well...nd so has bijla singh

may guru sahib does kirpa on us...and help us become what we really are

let me know if it clears ur thought or if u are trying to get at something by posing questions but u already have the answer.

the thing is time to time ..we forget and then it comes back to us wat the truth is. ah may guru sahib always keep us close to his charan.

akal sahai!

wjkk wjkf!

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ok the thuk u posted is great

but it really doesnt help me with my question

ill just repost everything in my last post

ok one thuk wud be in the part of anand sahib where it starts with bhagtha ke chaal niralee

around there it will talk about how vaheguru puts bhagthaa on his path

so now if vaheguru puts them on the path, and he causes the papee to paap, then y is the papee punished

it comes dwon to free will vs vaheguurus hukam

japji sahib states that hukmai andar sabh ko bahaar hukam no koe, japji sahib states many times this theme look at wat anon posted

and then again japji sahib says apai beej apai he khahoo

thats wat doesnt make sence to me, and wat io said before about papee being punished

lke i said im sure everyone here has read the two themes im talking about, its everywhere in guru je and banee

and i tried to post some thuks of the top of my head

if we can reslove these 2 thuks, ill find the other ones that give me questions

we reall havnt answered the question in the context of gurbani

we have tried to answer with our own theories, if tha was the case i wudnt have a prblem

but its gurbani wa i think we all trying to understand

we havnt answered the question at all yet, and if u read the post carefully ull see y the remerging in vaheguru which will destroy dukh will come into one of questions above

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