Vienna- What Really Happened?

[GPS]

I look forward to your confession:))

You need to read sikh history before passing your judgement on character of sikhs especially when lying is involved.

Sikhs have taken such actions earlier many years ago on a foreign soil .But when it came to courts they defended themselves speaking truth.

Thus they demonstrated that sikh ideals are more important to hold than their lives.

I am saying that they should defend themselves citing reasons for such action.That is not confession but stating the facts.

[Khoolasice]

You need to read sikh history before passing your judgement on character of sikhs especially when lying is involved.

Sikhs have taken such actions earlier many years ago on a foreign soil .But when it came to courts they defended themselves speaking truth.

Thus they demonstrated that sikh ideals are more important to hold than their lives.

I am saying that they should defend themselves citing reasons for such action.That is not confession but stating the facts.

They are more than good enough for me.

May WaheGuru bless them and their families.

[bakaree]

I bow in homage to those true Gursikhs who are real warriors ready to stand for what they believe in,

May Maharaj please bless me to be like them not the Cyber Warriors littering our qaum today.

GPS stop trying to measure everyone else with yout "mahaan Shaheed" ruler, instead see how u measure up.

if you disagree with the sect, i bet you aint got the spheres to go into their congregation and boldly proclaim your stance and equally if you disagree with the singhs you aint got the fortitude to tell one of these real singhs to his face that you think they are cowards

[GPS]

GPS stop trying to measure everyone else with yout "mahaan Shaheed" ruler, instead see how u measure up.

if you disagree with the sect, i bet you aint got the spheres to go into their congregation and boldly proclaim your stance and equally if you disagree with the singhs you aint got the fortitude to tell one of these real singhs to his face that you think they are cowards

Read my posts.I did not call them cowards.I said if they have done it they should own it

by letting people know why they had to take such an action.Lying is not a sikh trait.

[Pyara]

Read my posts.I did not call them cowards.I said if they have done it they should own it

by letting people know why they had to take such an action.Lying is not a sikh trait.

I somewhat agree with GPS. The Singhs who were sentanced needed to produce some kind of impact statement explaining their stance/reasons instead of going down the amnesia route. It's just gave the media and the enemies of the Panth another opportunity to portray the negative side.

This article shows a picture display of the kirpans worn by the Singhs as well as other pictures. It also mentions that a child was used as a protective shield and the use of "daggars".

http://austrianindependent.com/news/General_News/2010-09-28/4716/Temple_attacker_gets_life

28. 09. 10. - 14:00

Temple attacker gets life

A 35-year-old Sikh was sentenced to life behind bars yesterday (Mon) for killing a guru of the Ravidas movement in a temple in Vienna last year.

Prosecutor Stefan Apostol explained at the Criminal Court of Vienna that Jaspal Singh fired seven shots from close range at gurus Sant Niranjan Dass and Sant Rama Nand at a Ravidas temple in the city’s Rudolfsheim-Fünfhaus district on 24 May 2009.

While the religious movement’s spiritual leader Sant Niranjan Dass, 68, survived seriously injured, his 57-year-old deputy and designated successor Sant Rama Nand died shortly after the attack which hit headlines all over the world.

Jaspal Singh claimed in court he could not remember the incident. He was in an artificial coma for five weeks after horrified believers punched him with frying pans and a camera tripod.

Asked what his profession was, he told judge Susanne Lehr: "I see myself delivering newspapers in my dreams, so I might have been a newspaper deliverer."

The 35-year-old was accompanied by five fellow members of a radical Sikh branch in Spain. Four of them were sentenced to 17 and 18 years in jail for complicity and attempted bodily harm, while the fifth defendant got just six months.

The group travelled to Austria when it was announced that the two gurus will attend a ceremony. Reports have it that the group planned to attack the gurus because the Ravidas sect worshipped them as much as they honour their books of prayers. Their own religious group, however, thinks that the holy books and writings must stand above all.

Witnesses said the main suspect shot at the spiritual leaders of the community when the hundreds of people attending the mass kneeled down in front of them. They also told judges that the attackers used a little child as a "protective shield" when they tried to flee the temple. Dozens of people were injured as the six-member gang used daggers in their bid to escape.

Crime site investigations revealed that the attackers took off their socks and shoes in their car to avoid wasting time getting into the temple and out again as it is forbidden to enter wearing footgear.

One defendant infuriated witnesses by claiming in court he did not even hear shots since he was so immersed in praying.

It took Viennese police months to clarify who was in charge of the attack due to the havoc and contradicting statements made by suspects and witnesses. Charges were eventually set after DNA investigations eventually identified the offenders.

Two people were killed by army and police forces during riots in the Pakistani-Indian Punjab region following the incident. The attack also caused a heated debate in Austria over the coexistence of different religious groups in Austria.

[Pyara]

Read my posts.I did not call them cowards.I said if they have done it they should own it

by letting people know why they had to take such an action.Lying is not a sikh trait.

I somewhat agree with GPS. The Singhs who were sentanced needed to produce some kind of impact statement explaining their stance/reasons instead of going down the amnesia route. It's just gave the media and the enemies of the Panth another opportunity to portray the negative side.

This article shows a picture display of the kirpans worn by the Singhs as well as other pictures. It also mentions that a child was used as a protective shield and the use of "daggars".

http://austrianindependent.com/news/General_News/2010-09-28/4716/Temple_attacker_gets_life

28. 09. 10. - 14:00

Temple attacker gets life

A 35-year-old Sikh was sentenced to life behind bars yesterday (Mon) for killing a guru of the Ravidas movement in a temple in Vienna last year.

Prosecutor Stefan Apostol explained at the Criminal Court of Vienna that Jaspal Singh fired seven shots from close range at gurus Sant Niranjan Dass and Sant Rama Nand at a Ravidas temple in the city’s Rudolfsheim-Fünfhaus district on 24 May 2009.

While the religious movement’s spiritual leader Sant Niranjan Dass, 68, survived seriously injured, his 57-year-old deputy and designated successor Sant Rama Nand died shortly after the attack which hit headlines all over the world.

Jaspal Singh claimed in court he could not remember the incident. He was in an artificial coma for five weeks after horrified believers punched him with frying pans and a camera tripod.

Asked what his profession was, he told judge Susanne Lehr: "I see myself delivering newspapers in my dreams, so I might have been a newspaper deliverer."

The 35-year-old was accompanied by five fellow members of a radical Sikh branch in Spain. Four of them were sentenced to 17 and 18 years in jail for complicity and attempted bodily harm, while the fifth defendant got just six months.

The group travelled to Austria when it was announced that the two gurus will attend a ceremony. Reports have it that the group planned to attack the gurus because the Ravidas sect worshipped them as much as they honour their books of prayers. Their own religious group, however, thinks that the holy books and writings must stand above all.

Witnesses said the main suspect shot at the spiritual leaders of the community when the hundreds of people attending the mass kneeled down in front of them. They also told judges that the attackers used a little child as a "protective shield" when they tried to flee the temple. Dozens of people were injured as the six-member gang used daggers in their bid to escape.

Crime site investigations revealed that the attackers took off their socks and shoes in their car to avoid wasting time getting into the temple and out again as it is forbidden to enter wearing footgear.

One defendant infuriated witnesses by claiming in court he did not even hear shots since he was so immersed in praying.

It took Viennese police months to clarify who was in charge of the attack due to the havoc and contradicting statements made by suspects and witnesses. Charges were eventually set after DNA investigations eventually identified the offenders.

Two people were killed by army and police forces during riots in the Pakistani-Indian Punjab region following the incident. The attack also caused a heated debate in Austria over the coexistence of different religious groups in Austria.

[MAJHAIL_JATT]

What happened is some real fauji Singhs went in there and took care business and sent pappi's gaddi straight on a one way ticket. Then you have internet critics who themselves aren't ready to put themselves on the front line critic them.

[Khoolasice]

The Child is mentioned by witnesses, I would suggest that these 'witnesses' were Ravidass worshippers so would potray these heroes in the worst possible light.

I would have prefered it if at least five of these Sikhs were free to be of further service to Sikhi.

[Pyara]

What happened is some real fauji Singhs went in there and took care business and sent pappi's gaddi straight on a one way ticket. Then you have internet critics who themselves aren't ready to put themselves on the front line critic them.

OK...then there should have been more of a postive spin on what these Singhs done within the Sikh community and this could happen if the Singhs vocally expained what they stood for instead of allowing assumptions to be made by remaining silent.

I have not seen any Sikh jathebhandi come forward to openly support these Singhs which automatically allows people to classify these Singhs as "renegades" within the Sikh community. It almost seems like the Singhs and the Panthic jathebhandis' don't want to take any ownership of the Vienna incident. If their sewa meant anything to us then how come none of us ran down to support them during the trial, none of us visited them whilst they were in custody, none of us have collected support for their families. None of us even talked about them on Sikh internet forums.

Like others in the past, these Singhs will end up doing their prison sentances, their families won't be supported and they will come out after 20 years as unknowns. Unless some solid communications are given by the Panthic Jathebhandis and these Singhs, the wrong assumptions will keep on being made.

[SinghWarrior]

The Singhs could not have been taking responsibility for their actions in the hope of not being found guilty due to lack of evidence, and hence maintaining their freedom to carry on with seva.

This has happened in other contexts.