Caste Discrimination Amongst Youth

[SarabhaPanjab]

http://www.ravidassiauk.co.uk/content/have-you-every-been-discriminated-against-because-you-are-a-ravidassia

[Kharkooartsy]

http://www.ravidassi...re-a-ravidassia

sad to see how we let caste divide sikhi

[KhalistaniGunMan]

Only one people to blame penji^..The Jatts.. The Tarkhans....Anyone who puts forward a Caste or a Tribe as their identity!!..before all the pro caste people jump in and start insulting me....my parents are both jatts...i personally have decided to remove any affiliation i have with the term jatt and have decided to distance myself from caste, lineage, tribe etc...Guru kirpa soon i will be removing my surname legally aswell...back to point...the reason caste is so rampant within the sikh community..because our people have not made an effort to cut off ties to their caste and tribal lineage..until that happens...we will never get out of this mess....THE QUESTION I PUT FORWARD IS..ARE YOU A SIKH OR A JATT / TARKHAN / ETC???...BECAUSE YOU CANT BE BOTH!!!.

[Kharkooartsy]

Only one people to blame penji^..The Jatts.. The Tarkhans....Anyone who puts forward a Caste or a Tribe as their identity!!..before all the pro caste people jump in and start insulting me....my parents are both jatts...i personally have decided to remove any affiliation i have with the term jatt and have decided to distance myself from caste, lineage, tribe

yh i agree on this although i am jatt i dont take pride in it although i admit that i havent taken any steps towards moving away from it... me and my friends talked about this.. i think the problem is that culture of jatts and khatris is different so a lot of people look for someone more like them and end up sorta believing in caste...

[VanHelsingh]

I don't see how caste is even relevant to those of us living outside of India. That's not to say caste should be relevant to those living back home.

I only wish the elders within our communities and our families would find the concept of caste easier to let go.

[SikhWorldTv]

These sort of stories more often than not turn out to be urban myths and sinister mischief making. Please look at who is telling you this story, why they are telling it to you or others and what they will gain from it. At this moment in time there is a massive power struggle for who will be the lead of the Ravidassia community and their deras and sadhs fighting over who will be their voice. This type of blog is to persuade the historically down trodden "chamar" caste to now become proud and prominent to break away from Sikhism. So they are using shock tactics and stereotypical situations where they have been victimised especially by Sikhs. You can watch the power struggle weekly on 2 UK Sky tv channels where one group supporting the Shri Guru Granth Sahib ji are on MATV and the other Ravidassia group are supporting the new Amrit Bani holy book on Venus tv. Do not get yourself embroiled in any of this situation as it is turning very nasty with accusation and counter accusation flying around daily rather than the Ravidassia community understanding their "new" religion.

[Mehtab Singh]

Brilliant post Sikh World TV jeeo. Makes sense, but (1.) How do we know for sure that those stories are a lie, (2.) Why should anyone believe what is mentioned in your post above? Don't get me wrong jeeo, I am not saying that you believe in caste system or support it, nor am I questioning what you've said. My only concern is that in such a scenario its basically one person's word against another. Those who have faced discrimination from one segment of Punjabi society are always going to blame them, and vice versa. People will tend to trust those who are like them or have had similar (bad) experiences, be that person a Jatt or Tarkhan or Ravidassia. Our intention should be to not point fingers (again, I am not saying that you did), and try to resolve this menace called caste system once and for all and eradicate its cancerous roots off of the Sikh qaum.

To those who are still young and unmarried, take Amrit if you haven't already and I dare you to marry someone out of your parent's "caste" (good luck with that lol), then raise your kids to believe in ਏਕ ਨੂਰ ਤੇ ਸਭੁ ਜਗੁ ਉਪਜਿਆ ਕਉਨ ਭਲੇ ਕੋ ਮੰਦੇ (From the One Light, the entire universe welled up. So who is good, and who is bad?). If you guys and girls can do that much, more power to you. If not, I don't see how good much can an online Sikh forum do unless you practice for real all that you type out here . We all can talk the talk, time to walk the walk. If you are up for it, that is amazing. If not, then continue to live in a dream world that caste system is bad, yet knowing deep down that we are stuck with it forever with no way out, yet.

[dalsingh101]

What kills me is the absolute denial certain apnay have over the caste issue.

It's there, it is not a figment of people's imagination but you always get those who (for reasons best known to themselves?) alway play it down??

Maybe it is a case of when you are not on the receiving end of it, it is easy to be blind to it, much like many whites can frequently be blind and ignorant about racism taking place from their own society and believe people talking about it are making it up?

In any case it needs to get eradicated, at least in the west. Whilst an uneducated pendu might be expected to act backwards in this respect - someone whose been lucky enough to be educated and lives in a multicultural society - where they can see many people from diverse backgrounds generally getting on without the weird stuff that goes on in Panjabi society, has no excuse. And trying to deflect this into an issue of ethnicity, tribe, clan blah blah blah isn't anything but excuses.

The way I see it now the choice lies in whether you actually want a strong egalitarian Sikh society for the 21st century or you want to continue with the backward feudal system we've inherited.

[SikhWorldTv]

Pyare Mehtab Singh ji, on reading the 3 stories in the link post from 2009 they are very negative specifically against the jatt tribe and viciously negative against the Sikh faith.

(1.) You don't need to know if these stories are a lie or the truth but by reading the venom with which they are written the divisive intent is to drive a wedge between the Sikhs/Hindus and the Ravidassia community. So by the time you have finished reading them as a member of a community that has had issues in the past they again become inflammed and angry.

(2) This process of a Ravidassia power struggle is self evident you just need to watch both parties ridicule each other on both channels - one lot argue against what the other side have said in a statement every week (June 2011)

In my original post I have not given any indication of my personal thoughts on the issue of caste and my position is solid as it is in the Sikh faith all are equal.

This post specifically deals with the Ravidassia forum where persons have been asked to write all the bad stuff that has happened to them because of their caste.

There is no point in discussing the evils of caste in relation to this post as it is totally one sided and has been set-up to divide on religious lines rather than the historical caste system.

[dalsingh101]

Seriously SikhworldTV??

How do you know it isn't simply people talking about real experiences they have had and sharing them.

Today I was talking to an estate agent about racism in the 80s and we shared experiences. What you are doing is the equivalent of some gora hearing this and saying "Nah, they are making it all up to make whites look bad..blah blah blah...."

You talk about these issues saying they are 'in the past', well did you ever consider that maybe the experiences they have aren't simply isolated ones in some distant past, but rather ones that are a pervasive force in their life experiences?

It's exactly this type of apologism, denial and totally unnecessary defensiveness you are demonstrating that helps casteists carry on with their evil. Don't help them!

Please, don't turn everything into some conspiracy against us. The panth needs serious change in certain areas, it doesn't demean us to face up to and admit this. There will be lots of people who have had negative experiences along caste lines at the hands of Sikhs. When some of them open their mouth don't automatically assume it is some vindictive campaign against us.

Only a sly closet casteist or a Sikh ostrich (i.e. has head buried in sand) would deny that there is a problem to resolve. Let the people who have suffered have a voice for God's sake, without jumping on them for being on the receiving end of attitudes we all know (damn well) our people shouldn't be having in the first place.

Don't blame the oppressed for complaining about their oppression - blame the oppressors.