Concept Of Sunn-Void,Nullity.

[Guest Ksingh5]

Satsangat,

I just wanted to know what was the Concept Of Sunn-Void, nullity, within the Sikh belief system?

[mohinder pal]

Only who has achieved this avstha can tell you about Sunn Samdhi or Fanaha Fila or Tu Tu KArta Tu Hoya Mujh mein raha na Hu. Goto Sant Mahapursh to know about this avastha.

[Guest Ksingh5]

Only who has achieved this avstha can tell you about Sunn Samdhi or Fanaha Fila or Tu Tu KArta Tu Hoya Mujh mein raha na Hu. Goto Sant Mahapursh to know about this avastha.

I apologise if you have misunderstood my question. I'm after the concept of the void within the Sikh religion, what s the belief behind it?

[Guru_Da_Chella]

I don't think the concept is constrained to a religion!

[alias]

sunn is basically an avastha where you are reely close to ralaa-ing with that undying jot (brahamgyaani tor oopar).

in most gurbani tuks, the void is implied. like, "sache te, pavana bhaeya..." ang 19. meaning that from the Lord, through the void, came the pavan (hydroden).

in other tuks, the "oocha assan" is the Void, as in God. in others, the "sunn" word is mentioned.

so as far as i see it, there are two types of void. one, the void through which all came, (zero) and the other 'void' i.e. the oocha assan, aka god.

to get to the sunn stage is simple enuf to do naam, open the dasam, then start ur journey to God, we gta overcome this body/maya chass first, then we are on the raaha. it is all the raha. the journey to open the 10th and then onward n upward. like >hukmi hukam chalaee raha<

in sidh gost, guru ji says > antar sunnag, bahar sunang, trebhavn sun masunang, chauthe sunai jo nar janai, tako paap na puang......<

AMqir suMnµ bwhir suMnµ iqRBvx suMn msuMnµ ]

cauQy suMnY jo nru jwxY qw kau pwpu n puMnµ ]

Git Git suMn kw jwxY Byau ] Awid purKu inrMjn dyau ]

jo jnu nwm inrMjn rwqw ]

nwnk soeI purKu ibDwqw ]51]

suMno suMnu khY sBu koeI ]

Anhq suMnu khw qy hoeI ]

Anhq suMin rqy sy kYsy ]

ijs qy aupjy iqs hI jYsy ]

Eie jnim n mrih n Awvih jwih ]

nwnk gurmuiK mnu smJwih ]52]

this is where 'sunn avastha' aka 'sehej avastha' aka 'chauta pad', exists. once u reach this (by definition) undescribable stage, then you know the secret of the sunn within the midst of your own heart, and it is aap akaal purakh that gives it to you. and lastly in this pauri, guru ji says, whosoever becomes drenched in naam like this, they are then known as the lord himself. they become guru (jun), then god (purakh). then they are further known as the scribes of destany itself.

some may say, for somone to become guru is imposible but it is possible. > satpurakh jin jaanya...< to jaan akkal puakh is defined by the sunn stage.

gurmukhs are the ones who can understand this. (nanak gurmukh mun samjaahe)

to understand wha guru ji is, is just different. e.g. to ask the question, 'what exactly is pavan guru' and understand the depth of this question, is tough enough. and gruji gives this to us on a plate in japji sahib.

the sunn stage is a sarovar that is beant hence cannot dscribe.

best thing to do is to jup naam properly, and see what happens. :pluggedin: --> :angeljump:

:D

[mohinder pal]

This avastha is not limited just to Sikh Religion. Mahapursh like Baba Farid, Baba Kabir,Bahi Kaniya Ji, Sant Jawala singh ji, Sant Attar singh ji, Sant Harnam singh ji Kilewale, Baba Bhulle Shah, SHah Hussain, Jesus Christ, Mahatama Budha, Inayat Shah, Bakhtiyar Kaki are few(of many) Gurusikhs who achieved this avastha.

[DustOfTheSaintsFeet]

The Primal Void as described in gurbani is the Silence from which all was created. It is a state of Absolute Nothingness-It is the True State of God...

Becuase it is the True state of God which He discovered himself to be, it is the Ultimate Power- It is more powerful than siddhis, more powerful than any form of white magic, it is All Loving, Without Fear, beyond form, caste creed and is Most Humble for to be most humble is to be Truly Nothing(and to be nothing is to be most Powerful, a truth that most people refuse to accept-which is the main reason we are stuck in maya)....

The choice to be humble and to silence the mind to achieve and experience this state is so difficult for the egostistical human beings, for we have been programmed and seduced since birth, by God himself, to love everything that proves to be the antithesis of these qualities, i.e the 5 thieves-

We love everything with an image(the Black Demon of Attachment)- we cannot let go of the imagery/ the pride and ego because of imagery/ the greed for imagery/ the lust for false imagery(people)/ the anger towards false imagery(people)...

God has planned his testing and learning ground so intricately and has seduced us so much through maya so that only his most Beloved Ones, the ones who truly want him are able to find him through samadhi(bhagti and naam simran -the silencing of the mind(through attuning oneself to naam which is the frequency of a balanced gyan(Balance) that applies across a universal spectrum that lives to discover while remaining detached from the nasha of the discovery be it High or Low)to experience the nothingness in the deepest meditation) for it is Only Those who detach from the imagery, from the khel that keeps us in the pain of births and deaths that are able to walk on the path to become jivan mukt...

The people around us, the distractions of the false images of your family, friends, nature, materials, anything you can feel, see, hear and touch(all distractions) etc are all God, He is the Saint and the Sinner, he is simply testing us and teaching us that the nothingness is his true state, for attachment to the false Imagery which is all you see, feel and touch Only Brings Pain.- No matter how much it feels like sukh happiness, the only real true nasha and happiness is from the detachment and silencing of the mind which is the only way we can discover the Truth which is Him. Remember that Dukh and Sukh are fed to us equally, how much sukh we recieve is how much dukh we'll eventually get, the only way to get out of it is the state of Balance ie. silencing of the mind i.e nothingness i.e Truth i.e Him.

[alias]

what do you think is the veechaar that comes from the following tuk?

nwnk duKu suKu sm kir jwpY ( siqgur qy kwlu n gRwsY ) ]61]

naanak dhukh sukh sam kar jaapai ( sathigur thae kaal n graasai ) |61|

how would you describe the veechaar to another person of 'jupping' with looking at dukh n sukh as the same form?

[DustOfTheSaintsFeet]

naanak dukh sukh sam kar jaapai satgur tay kaal na garaasai. ||61||

O Nanak, when one looks upon pain and pleasure alike, through the True Guru,

then he is not consumed by Death.

When one is attuned to the balanced gyan that pervades across and applies across the universe which is Truth, i.e naam, one is detached from the nashas of the highs and lows- hence they'll witness the appearance of the highs and lows i.e, someone slandering them or treating them nicely or badly, but are attuned to such a state that they feel the same- their hearts remain calm. The fact is that they realise that nothing is real, this is all a khel and We are Truly Nothing- this gyan within itself applied and lived while attuned to naam is enough for one to see both pleasure and pain as the same for the imagery is false- pleasure and pain simply do not exist- only the balance(Truth) does. ..

[alias]

yes, i agree. most people say that jupping naam makes all other tastes, tasteless. >peevtang sant na tripyate<. ..

but how are we to understand dukh and sukh as one? teek a , we become indifferent to it. seetal.

but, >sum kar , jaapai< has a deeper meaning. hat is the veechaar (not simple meaning) of this?

i wud say it means 'samaj what dukh and sukh are, then you are able to jup naam' (teek a also that ,can jup naam anytime etc)

what is your veechaar on sum kar , jaapai ?

thanks jio