Is Stopping Medical Help Classed As Suicide By The Sikhs

[BTKaur]

Waheguru Satnam

Regarding suicide I am so lonely and hurt I wonder if anyone can help me with this. Reading on suicide and that after death person ends up in hell. My 46 year old brother passed away a month ago,(12/11/2011), his kidneys had failed and  had other complications. This illnesses had been going on for the past 12  years. Now what is eating me away and killing me is after he passed away I found out that my  brother stopped dialysis and this was the reason he passed away. To stop dialysis and medication was discussed only with his wife by my brother and no one else, and what he was planning to do. He was weak and frail and i believe personally very very depressed. He was a very active person until this illness. I feel as a sister cheated and useless, for letting this happen. I believe it should of been discussed with the family and not just him and the wife deciding. My brother for the 12 years was in and out of hospital the poor soul and had no quality of life.

Please can anyone tell me was it classed as suicide? Is my brother going to go through the proper Sikh paths of no more pain and not what I am reading to hell. I pray to God that my  brother is not suffering no more now. Please help me it is killing me. Waheguru .

[S1ngh]

I do not think that is classified as suicide at all. I can give you example of very enlightened soul; Sant Kartar Singh Ji. He was seriously injured in a car accident and required brain surgery to survive. Hair removal was required to make surgery possible. However Sant Kartar Singh Ji refused to undergo surgery and thus passed away in hospital. You can learn more about sant ji here: http://www.sikhiwiki.org/index.php/Sant_Giani_Kartar_Singh_Khalsa_Bhindranwale

I am very sorry about your brother passing away and how he went thru hospital trips later in his life. Dukh (sadness) and Sukh (happiness) is all part of manukh life. I would suggest your family members and particular yourself to leave it in the hands of waheguru jee. We all get "What if..." ideas and continuously thinking about solutions for what has already gone out of our hands. This is nobody's faults and everybody should respect the wishes of your brother while he was alive. We all are here on temporary human visa and one day; sooner or later, we all have to leave whenever our timed swavas (breathing) gets over.

In our Sikhi culture we remember our loved ones by reading and listening to gurbani to bring calm and peace to soul. Sukhmani Sahib particularly brings sukh. Practicality is more important; one should do akhand paat for departed soul, not just because it is ritual but it brings peace to us and to the departed soul.

Please accept my apologies if i offended you by mistake.

[BTKaur]

Thank you for replying I was hoping deep down that my brother had not made the wrong choice.Yes I know nothing can be done now but I personally needed a answer as the family are all grieving, he was the baby of the family . And my father who is 82 can do without me asking him many question. In the near future we will all be contributing towards questions and answers. Plus I would want to say to his children 16, 12 and 10 that their father is at peace, and out of pain.

Can anyone help me with a shabad from the Guru Granth Sahib with the meaning of something in the lines for my brother is resting in peace in

heaven.

Again thank you very much for the reply I feel a big weight as just been lifted. Waheguru Satnam .

I Ask for forgiveness if anything was said out of context

[JSinghnz]

I do not think that is classified as suicide at all. I can give you example of very enlightened soul; Sant Kartar Singh Ji. He was seriously injured in a car accident and required brain surgery to survive. Hair removal was required to make surgery possible. However Sant Kartar Singh Ji refused to undergo surgery and thus passed away in hospital. You can learn more about sant ji here: http://www.sikhiwiki...sa_Bhindranwale

I am very sorry about your brother passing away and how he went thru hospital trips later in his life. Dukh (sadness) and Sukh (happiness) is all part of manukh life. I would suggest your family members and particular yourself to leave it in the hands of waheguru jee. We all get "What if..." ideas and continuously thinking about solutions for what has already gone out of our hands. This is nobody's faults and everybody should respect the wishes of your brother while he was alive. We all are here on temporary human visa and one day; sooner or later, we all have to leave whenever our timed swavas (breathing) gets over.

In our Sikhi culture we remember our loved ones by reading and listening to gurbani to bring calm and peace to soul. Sukhmani Sahib particularly brings sukh. Practicality is more important; one should do akhand paat for departed soul, not just because it is ritual but it brings peace to us and to the departed soul.

Please accept my apologies if i offended you by mistake.

Great answer to this highly sensitive question. You have said it all in the context of Gurbani.

[DustOfTheSaintsFeet]

Sister, firstly I'd like to offer my condolences for your loss. Your brother sounds like he had alot of dukhi in this janam- dukhi on earth is karam being repaid to Satnam Ji- it cleanses a soul and makes it lighter. So please be comforted by this fact.

Secondly, doctors would not have agreed to stop your brothers treatment if they didn't think it was suitable. There are too many lawsuits occurring for this type of thing. So your brother won't go to hell, don't dwell on this- you need to stop worrying about him and let him be free to continue his journey, as difficult as that may be. We come alone and go alone, we have journeyed many lifetimes and paid off so much karam to get here, noone and nothing is as it seems- and your brother will continue his evolution into another identity, whether its in heaven or sachkandh or in another janam on earth. Trust in Gods unconditional love for us all and that he is leading your brother down the right path, trust in Hukam for it is always perfect.

Gurbani says that naam heals all pains, why not commence on the path of bhagti, turn your dukhi into the real sukh and discover your true origin-for that is the aim of this life and all human janams before and after this one- to become Brahmgyani, to merge with the Truth.

God bless you

[Balait_da_Sher]

I have been meaning to reply to this topic for days but have been too busy. Being the only brother to 3 sisters, I will try to provide you a brother's perspective.

As individuals, when it comes to family, we would rather suffer hardship than make our family members part of the process. For this reason, a lot of people do not tell family members things which will cause them emotional pain. If I was in your brother's position, I would have done the same because if you or your parents were made to be a part of the decision making process them you would have either done one of the following:

• Not allowed him to go through with the decision
  
• Allowed him to go through with the decision
  

either way, you and your parents would have suffered as a result of the decision because eventually you would have blamed your self for making him suffer (decision 1) or blamed your self for his death by saying "Maybe if we had just waited few more months etc" (decision 2).

Finally, I believe that your brother was old enough to make his own decision and you guys should respect that and leave it at that. It is natural to think the way you are, I just hope that you guys do understand that his wife's involvement in the decision making process is what doctors always ask for and I hope your relationship with his wife has not suffered as a consequence.

I hope guru ji gives you and your family the strength to get through this difficult period. As S1ngh suggested path (gurbani) is the most beneficial thing for your family and your brother.

[Balait_da_Sher]

Here is a type of shabad you asked for.

ਜੈਸੇ ਏਕ ਆਗ ਤੇ ਕਨੂਕਾ ਕੋਟਿ ਆਗ ਉਠੈ ਨਿਆਰੇ ਨਿਆਰੇ ਹੁਇ ਕੈ ਫੇਰਿ ਆਗ ਮੈ ਮਿਲਾਹਿਂਗੇ ॥

Just as millions of sparks are created from the fire; although they are different entities, they merge in the same fire.

ਜੈਸੇ ਏਕ ਧੂਰਿ ਤੇ ਅਨੇਕ ਧੂਰਿ ਪੂਰਤ ਹੈ ਧੂਰਿ ਕੇ ਕਨੂਕਾ ਫੇਰ ਧੂਰਿ ਹਿ ਸਮਾਹਿਂਗੇ

Just as from of waves are created on the surface of the big rivers and all the waves are called water.

ਜੈਸੇ ਏਕ ਨਦ ਤੇ ਤੰਰਗ ਕੋਟਿ ਉਪਜਤ ਹੈਂ ਪਾਨਿ ਕੇ ਤਰੰਗ ਸਬੈ ਪਾਨਿ ਹੀ ਕਹਾਹਿਂਗੇ ॥

Similarly the animate and inanimate objects come out of the Supreme Lord; having been created from the same Lord, they merge in the same Lord. 17.87.

[Only five]

I'm sorry for you loss, Sri Vaheguru ji Maharaj only truly knows where you brother is. In Sikhi taking your own life is not permitted. Pain and pleasure are to be seen as one. Sant Baba Kartar Singh ji Maharaj situation is different from your brothers, unless your brother stopped treatment to keep rehat. Sant ji refused treatment because Rehat Maryada would be comprimised. Satguru Sri Guru Gobind Singh Sahib Ji Maharaj as said that rehat is more dear to me than the Sikh. So on this teaching, Sant ji did not let the doctors give treatment as Sant ji's hair would need to be cut. There are some other Gurmukhs who were faced with the same decision and they took Satguru Sri Guru Gobind Singh Sahib ji Maharaj teaching to heart.

Do Sri Chaupai Sahib da paat as much as you can. Do ardas for you brothers atma as Satguru gives everything to his Sikhs.

[DalbirSingh]

It's a fluke in medical science we can perlong someones life a little longer with no cure, they are dead pretty much at that point, there is not much to gain by giving thema few seconds unless you want a will in which case they are void due to the medical condition or a few words which is not always worth much. It is a matter of pana (will of god) so they are to depart.