Gurbani From Bhagats & Bhats in SGGSJ

[V]

Sat Sri Akal:

"Understand something, no True Guru belongs to any religion. You cannot tie a True Guru to a lable. "

With all due respect, care to explain Guru Gobind Singh Ji taking amrit, becoming a member of the Khalsa Panth and saying that that Panth is his Roop?

veer ji,

Firstly a few question, When Guru Gobind Singh ji took Amrit from the 5, who did he take the Amrit for himself or to show us the power that the 5 Piyaray posses which is in equal to the Guru himself.

Was Guru Gobind Singh ji any less before he took amrit and became more divine after he took the Amrit? Or was he equally divine regardless.

Waheguru

THere were actually TWO Bhagat Kabir ji's

It is said tha bhagat Kabir ji met Guru Nanak DEv ji along with other Bhagats In AYodhya-

Bhagat Kabir Jee was also a contemporary of Guru Nanak Dev Jee. There meeting

are mentioned in Granths of the Kabir Panthis. This is confirmed by the writings of the first Kabir Panthi Dharam Daas. Puraatan Granths “Kabir Mansoor” mention meetings of Guru Nanak Dev Jee and Bhagat Kabir Jee several times.

For more information pelase read THIS THREAD

bhull chukk maaf

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

[SSB]

Self Edited:

y do plp rite that :wub:

[ms514]

Sat Sri Akal:

"Firstly a few question, When Guru Gobind Singh ji took Amrit from the 5, who did he take the Amrit for himself or to show us the power that the 5 Piyaray posses which is in equal to the Guru himself.

Was Guru Gobind Singh ji any less before he took amrit and became more divine after he took the Amrit? Or was he equally divine regardless. "

I do not understand what you are trying to say here and how this relates to what the origional point of the thread is.

Guru Gobind Singh Ji himself begged for Amrit from the Panj Pyare, like any Guru Ka Sikh does. He himself was subject to the same Rehat as every Sikh. Hewas also punished like every Sikh (see: http://allaboutsikhs.com/gurus/gurugobind8.htm in reference to saint Dadu).

I fail to understand how saying whether his divinity was increased by taking Amrit or not has any relevance to this post. The fact remains that Guru Sahib did become a member of the Khalsa Panth, he was subject to its laws and he was, in every way, a Sikh of the Panth as well. I cannot debate how divine Guru Sahib was or say whether divinity increased or decreased as an effect to taking Amrit, as my intelligence is non-existent in contrast to a Gursikh, let alone Guru Sahib and the Almighty.

Forgive if any of the above is offensive.

[Pheena]

Sat Sri Akal:

I do not understand what you are trying to say here and how this relates to what the origional point of the thread is.

Guru Gobind Singh Ji himself begged for Amrit from the Panj Pyare, like any Guru Ka Sikh does. He himself was subject to the same Rehat as every Sikh. Hewas also punished like every Sikh (see: http://allaboutsikhs.com/gurus/gurugobind8.htm in reference to saint Dadu).

I fail to understand how saying whether his divinity was increased by taking Amrit or not has any relevance to this post. The fact remains that Guru Sahib did become a member of the Khalsa Panth, he was subject to its laws and he was, in every way, a Sikh of the Panth as well. I cannot debate how divine Guru Sahib was or say whether divinity increased or decreased as an effect to taking Amrit, as my intelligence is non-existent in contrast to a Gursikh, let alone Guru Sahib and the Almighty.

Forgive if any of the above is offensive.

veer ji,

My point is that not matter if you say a Guru belongs to a religion, regardless if he is or isn't his divinity remains the same. He equally loves everyone, regarless of whatever religion they belong to. His message is equally potent to everyone, not just his followers. We try to captive the Gurus to 'us' only,

where they are 'ours' meaning only belonging to our religion. But they and their message is equally for everyone. Hence i say you cannot put a lable on a Guru.

In the Realm of a organized Religion, you are correct. But in the wider eyes of the universe you only belong to God, not any religion. Your true self is the image of the divine which has no religion/race/gender and the Gurus/Bhagats were the Manifestation of God himself...so how can you capture them in a religion?

Waheguru.

[Pheena]

Self Edited:

y do plp rite that :wub:

because i wrote soemthing, but decided to remove it.

[ms514]

Sat Sri Akal:

Pheena Ji, I believe you have made your points and and I have mine. While I believe that Gurus merged themselves into the Panth and Granth of the Khalsa, you believe that the Guru's message is for the entire of humanity, not just Sikhs. So I respect that, though I do not fully agree with it (and a very long debate on this can ensue, possibly inflaming this moorakh's ego, so I will avoid it).

Let the topic go back to its origional topic. If you believe that the matter should go further, feel free to post so.

[Pheena]

Sat Sri Akal:

Pheena Ji, I believe you have made your points and and I have mine. While I believe that Gurus merged themselves into the Panth and Granth of the Khalsa, you believe that the Guru's message is for the entire of humanity, not just Sikhs. So I respect that, though I do not fully agree with it (and a very long debate on this can ensue, possibly inflaming this moorakh's ego, so I will avoid it).

Let the topic go back to its origional topic. If you believe that the matter should go further, feel free to post so.

veer ji,

I contemplated on this for quite a while now and i believe i understand your point of view and from your prespective, you are 100% correct.

I never thought about the idea of Gurus merging themselves into the Khalsa Panth and because i don't have first hand knowledge on this i will not try to argue about something that i haven't experienced. If possible if you can elaborate more on this, i would love to hear it.

Waheguru.

[Balwinder Singh]

Well...I dont know whether I shud mention it here or not as it is offtopic.

But I was listening to the katha of sukhmani sahib ji by Gyani thaker singh ji and there he mentioned that bhagat kabir ji came to Guru Gobind Singh ji maharaj to take amrit.kabir ji came with his wife Loi ji.

He is an amazing kathawachak and he was doing katha in the hazoori of SGGS ji, so its really hard to doubt on his comments.I think people who reach some 'avastha' can easily understand these things.

[moorakh mugadh]

vwihgurU jI kw Kwlsw!

vwihgurU jI kI &iqh!!

SaadhSangat,

I have a few questions regarding Gurbani by Bhagats & Bhats such Bhagat Farid Ji, Bhagat Kabir Ji, Bhagat Ravidas and all others in Guru Granth Sahib Jee.

I've been confused on this for some time......

1) How do we regard these Bhagats? ie. As Hindu/ Muslim or as Gur Kai Sikh?

2) Did all the Bhagats & Bhats recieve Charan Pahul Amrit to regard themselves as Sikh?

3) If we regard them as Muslim/Hindu, then isn't that just supporting the views of some Muslim and Hindus who say Sikhism is a mixture of these 2 religions?

4) I've heard some Sikhs say that Sikhism is all the best parts taken from Islam and Hinduism. What are your views on this?

Can Sangat Jee elaborate on these questions. Sorry for the complete lack of knowledge and understanding.

vwihgurU jI kw Kwlsw!

vwihgurU jI kI &iqh!!

<span style='font-size:14pt;line-height:100%'>To all the Cyber SaadhSangat, Vadhaeeyaa on Guru Granth Sahib Jee's 400 Years Parkash Utsav.

</span&

gt;May Waheguru Jee Bless us with Naam & understanding of Gurbani.

vwihgurU jI kw Kwlsw!

vwihgurU jI kI &iqh!!

sab to pehlaaa, veerje u must not get confused on our gurujee :wub: maharj sarbat te kirpa kare.

now ill try my best to answer ur question, sangat jee if im wrong anywhere pls correct daas

1) How do we regard these Bhagats? ie. As Hindu/ Muslim or as Gur Kai Sikh?

answer- veerje even we singhs are above any caste and creeds, in every bhagat baani ull see they have said many times wrong to their religion too like " idols , kabar" they where all above religion caste and creeds and very very nimrta thats why maharjj added their baani so they where sikhs ,hindu muslim question dosent araises" for them it is only manas ke jaat sabhe eke pachanbo"

2) Did all the Bhagats & Bhats recieve Charan Pahul Amrit to regard themselves as Sikh?

answer- yes they where guruwalla in their own rehat, in many sakhi we hear bahgat kabir jee had a guru.

3) If we regard them as Muslim/Hindu, then isn't that just supporting the views of some Muslim and Hindus who say Sikhism is a mixture of these 2 religions?

answer: their view was just akal purkh nirankar and nimrta and we also belive in that thats why maharj gave space in our sggs for their pavitar baani, ull not see abit of howmey in that.

4) I've heard some Sikhs say that Sikhism is all the best parts taken fr

om Islam and Hinduism. What are your views on this?

answer: same as 3rd answer

[ISingh]

vwihgurU jI kw Kwlsw!

vwihgurU jI kI &iqh!!

Thankyou Sangat Jee, I understand now.

Regardless of their background and religion they were all Guru Kai Sikh. They saw beyond the boundaries of religion and believed in One Akal Purakh and Naam as the highest religion of them all.

Bhul Chukh Maaf.

vwihgurU jI kw Kwlsw!

vwihgurU jI kI &iqh!!