I don't know y people say Gurus are God...

[simran345]

Penji yes they are human form, but for me if I was to have darshan of them, or if was born in that yug, they would be god to me, I would think god gave me their darshan, same as Sri Guru Granth Sahib Maharaj ji, is our living guru and I should respect them the same as god, thats my thinking anyways.,

Agree with previous poster, dont know how its said properly, but think its Guru hai Shabad, Shabad hai Guru, thus Shabad is Truth, Guru is Truth, Waheguru is Truth too.

[Raaj.Karega.Khalsa]

Below are a few quotations from Dhan Sri Guru Granth Saheb Ji and Bhai Gurdas Ji's Vaar/Kabit.

guru myrw pwrbRhmu guru BgvMqu ]

gur maeraa paarabreham gur bhagava(n)th ||

My Guru is the Supreme Lord God; the Guru is the Lord God.

guru goibMdu goivMdu guru joiq iek duie nwv DrwieAw]

gur gobi(n)dh govi(n)dh gur joth eik dhue naav dhharaaeiaa||

Guru is God and God is the Guru, two names are of the same supreme reality.

guru prmysru eyko jwxu ]

gur paramaesar eaeko jaan ||

Know that the Guru and the Transcendent Lord are One.

guru myrw pwrbRhm prmysuru qw kw ihrdY Dir mn iDAwnu ]1] rhwau ]

gur maeraa paarabreham paramaesur thaa kaahiradhai dhhar man dhhiaan ||1|| rehaao ||

My Guru is the Supreme Lord God, the Transcendent Lord; I enshrine Him within my heart, and meditate on Him within my mind. ||1||Pause||

guru pwrbRhmu prmysru Awip ]

gur paarabreham paramaesar aap ||

The Guru is the Supreme Lord God; He Himself is the Transcendent Lord.

gur goivMdu guoivMdu gurU hY nwnk Bydu n BweI ]4]1]8]

gur govi(n)dh guovi(n)dh guroo hai naanak bhaedh n bhaaee ||4||1||8||

The Guru is God, and God is the Guru, O Nanak; there is no difference between the two, O Siblings of Destiny. ||4||1||8||

gur goivMdu goivMdu guru hirgoivMdu sdw ivgsMdw]

gur govi(n)dh govi(n)dh gur harigovi(n)dh sadhaa vigasa(n)dhaa||

Accepting Guru (Arjan Dev) as God and God as Guru, Hargobind (the Guru) remains ever elated.

gur pwrbRhm prmysur AprMpr AlK AByv ]16]

gur paarabreham paramaesur apara(n)par alakh abhaev ||16||

The Guru is the Supreme Lord God, the Transcendent Lord, infinite, unseen and unknowable. ||16||

DMnu DMnu siqgur purKu inrMkwir Awkwru bxwieAw]

dhha(n)n dhha(n)n sathigur purakh nira(n)kaar aakaar banaaeiaa||

The formless Lord has assumed the form of True Guru, the blessed one.

Dnu Dnu siqguru purKu inrMjnu ijqu imil hir nwmu iDAweI ]

dhhan dhhan sathigur purakh nira(n)jan jith mil har naam dhhiaaee ||

Blessed, blessed is the True Guru, the Immaculate, Almighty Lord God; meeting Him, I meditate on the Name of the Lord.

pRB siqgur dIn dieAwlw ]

prabh sathigur dheen dhaeiaalaa ||

God, the True Guru, is Merciful to the meek.

gur goibMd gopwl gur gur pUrn nwrwiexh ]

gur gobi(n)dh gopaal gur gur pooran naaraaeineh ||

The Guru is the Lord of the Universe; the Guru is the Lord of the world; the Guru is the Perfect Pervading Lord God.

guru goibMd gurU gopwl ]

gur gobi(n)dh guroo gopaal ||

The Guru is the Lord of the Universe, the Guru is the Lord of the World.

guru gopwlu guru goivMdw ]

gur gopaal gur govi(n)dhaa ||

The Guru is the Lord of the World, the Guru is the Master of the Universe.

pwrbRhm prmysr siqgur Awpy krxYhwrw ]

paarabreham paramaesar sathigur aapaekaranaihaaraa ||

The True Guru is the Transcendent Lord, the Supreme Lord God; He Himself is the Creator Lord.

guru prmysru guru goivMdu ]

gur paramaesar gur govi(n)dh ||

The Guru is the Supreme Lord God; the Guru is the Lord of the Universe.

[luckysingh99]

This is talking about Guru as in the reference to akaal purakh.

Remember Guru can mean any of our gurus and it can also mean the ONE ALMIGHTY, just like govind,raam,har....etc..

There are many names used to describe and the raam name does NOT mean raam chandar the lover of Sita!!!!

Guru Nanak wrote 'Ek onkaar'' NOT to describe himself. He is not the akaal puraakh and the ONE almighty in human form!!!

Read the mool mantar carefully.

God does not come into human form with bounadries and limits.

Don't get confused by calling a human form as THE GOD. We all have God within us, but we don't represent him we represent his creation.

I don't think Guru Gobind Singh ji said 'not to worship him as God'' out of humility. This just goes against the principles of gurmat teaching in my opinion.

[Raaj.Karega.Khalsa]

This is talking about Guru as in the reference to akaal purakh.

Remember Guru can mean any of our gurus and it can also mean the ONE ALMIGHTY, just like govind,raam,har....etc..

There are many names used to describe and the raam name does NOT mean raam chandar the lover of Sita!!!!

Guru Nanak wrote 'Ek onkaar'' NOT to describe himself. He is not the akaal puraakh and the ONE almighty in human form!!!

Read the mool mantar carefully.

Bhaji, I've read the mool mantar...and have also read the 'arth' done by Sant Giani Kartar Singh ji Bhindranwale. With Maharaaj ji's Kirpa, I'm pretty sure about what I'm saying.

Infact, Sant Ji has made it extremely clear, with abundant proof, that Guru Nanak Dev Ji were Akaal Purakh themselves. In the 'steek', about 30 pages are a beautifully detailed explanation of how Guru Nanak Dev Ji were the Avtar of Akaal Purakh Waheguru Himself!

Following are the panktian satated as proof in Sant ji's steek:

siqgur nwnk dyau hY prmysru soeI]

sathigur naanak dhaeo hai paramaesar soee||

Guru Nanak is the True Guru and is God Himself.

nwrwiex inj rUip Dir nwQw nwQ snwQ krwieAw]

Awip nrwiexu klw Dwir jg mih prvirXau ]

joiq rUip hir Awip gurU nwnku khwXau ]

joth roop har aap guroo naanak kehaayo ||

The Embodiment of Light, the Lord Himself is called Guru Nanak.

siqguru prmysru myrw ]

sathigur paramaesar maeraa ||

The True Guru is my Transcendent Lord.

In Sri Naanak Prakash Granth: "Ekangkaar dhaar nij roopa ll Pragte Satgur Roop Anoopa ll"

Anq klw hoie Twkuru ciVAw ]

guru prmysru eyku hY sB mih rihAw smwie ]

gur paramaesar eaek hai sabh mehi rehiaa samaae ||

The Guru and the Transcendent Lord are one and the same, pervading and permeating amongst all.

[luckysingh99]

Bhaji, I've read the mool mantar...and have also read the 'arth' done by Sant Giani Kartar Singh ji Bhindranwale. With Maharaaj ji's Kirpa, I'm pretty sure about what I'm saying.

Infact, Sant Ji has made it extremely clear, with abundant proof, that Guru Nanak Dev Ji were Akaal Purakh themselves. In the 'steek', about 30 pages are a beautifully detailed explanation of how Guru Nanak Dev Ji were the Avtar of Akaal Purakh Waheguru Himself!

Following are the panktian satated as proof in Sant ji's steek:

siqgur nwnk dyau hY prmysru soeI]

sathigur naanak dhaeo hai paramaesar soee||

Guru Nanak is the True Guru and is God Himself.

nwrwiex inj rUip Dir nwQw nwQ snwQ krwieAw]

Awip nrwiexu klw Dwir jg mih prvirXau ]

joiq rUip hir Awip gurU nwnku khwXau ]

joth roop har aap guroo naanak kehaayo ||

The Embodiment of Light, the Lord Himself is called Guru Nanak.

siqguru prmysru myrw ]

sathigur paramaesar maeraa ||

The True Guru is my Transcendent Lord.

In Sri Naanak Prakash Granth: "Ekangkaar dhaar nij roopa ll Pragte Satgur Roop Anoopa ll"

Anq klw hoie Twkuru ciVAw ]

guru prmysru eyku hY sB mih rihAw smwie ]

gur paramaesar eaek hai sabh mehi rehiaa samaae ||

The Guru and the Transcendent Lord are one and the same, pervading and permeating amongst all.

Shall we just rely on this and ignore the SGGS ji ?

Was this Guru Nanak's message ?

I don't for a minute think that God himself had to come in a life form and address us in the form of Nanak.

I believe that Nanak under the hukam and divine will was here to teach and guide, and spoke the word or shabad of the akaal purakh.

This does mean that there was some form of the almighty within him that gave this message, but it does NOT mean that it was ALL God himself here in a human form disguise !!!

[papidas]

ਵਾਿਹਗੁਰੂ ਜੀ ਕਾ ਼ਖਾਲਸਾ ਵਾਿਹਗੁਰੂ ਜੀ ਕੀ ਫਤਹ ॥

I remeber listening to Katha one time in which the Pracharak shared a Sakhi about Dhan Dhan Baba Nand Singh Jee Mahapurash.

Baba Jee used to say that Dhan Dhan Dhan Dasmesh Pita Sahib Jee says not to call Him (Dasmesh Jee) Vaheguroo and if you do you will got to hell. But Baba Jee said I will call Sri KalgiDhar Pita Sahib Jee Vaheguroo Jee's Roop over and over and when He sends Me to hell I will call Him that there as well and than Dasmesh Jee Himself will pull Me out of hell.

Also Baba Jee used to call Dhan Dhan Dhan Sahih Sri Satguru Nanak Dev Sahib Jee Maharaj Nirankar Saroop. And if we believe Baba Jee was Braham Giani than why would he lie. Ek Sadh Bachan Atlada. Further, according to Bhai Sahib Bhai Randhir Singh Jee, he met a Gursikh once who reached Oochee Avastha through writing Gurbani, such is the Power of Writing Gurbani. And Bhai Sahib Bhai Gurdas Sahib Jee wrote the entire Mahan Sri Pothi Sahib Jee (Sri Adi Granth Sahib Jee) under the guidance of Shanti De Punj Sahib Sri Satguru Arjan Dev Sahib Jee Maharaj and his Vaars and Kabits were approved by Satguru Jee themselves. And what did they write? Ek Baba Akal Roop!

And Gurbani is itself proof of this. Many people will argue Guru holds different Arths in different place in Gurbani. According To Damdami Taksal started by Dhan Dhan Dhan Sahib Sri Satguru Gobind Singh Sahib Jee and according to Oochee Avastha (Turiyee Pad) Gursikhs, the Arths of this Line and other similiar Lines is thus,

Nanak Sodhay Sim(n)®iti Bed ||

ParBraham Gur Naahee Ped ||4||11||24||

Ang 1142 Bhairo Mahala 5

Roughly,

Nanak has searched and studied the Simritees and Beds,

There is no difference between Guru (Dhan Dhan Dhan Sahib Sri Satguru Nanak Dev Sahib Jee Maharaj) and ParBraham (He who is "away" or not stained by sin).

For those who say this statement is making Satguru Jee seem like egotistic, can there be ego in the Truth proclaimed by Satguru Jee? If so, how about when Satguru Jee denounces the bad practices in other religions and the Pakhand in them and Announces and Promotes the greatness of Naam?

Further, those who believe these Arths are not stating Guru as in Satguru Nanak Dev Jee Maharaj, have you reached 7 Pad or Turiyeea Pad and BrahamGian like the Taksali MahaPurakhs, other Sampardayee MahaPurashes, Great Gursikhs like Bhai Sahib Bhai Randhir Singh Jee?

Gurdev Mata Gurdev Pita Gurdev Swami Parmesuraa ||

I could go on but we will leave it at that for now.

Bhul Chuk Muaaf. Satguru Maharaj Jee Sumat Bakhshan.

ਵਾਿਹਗੁਰੂ ਜੀ ਕਾ ਼ਖਾਲਸਾ ਵਾਿਹਗੁਰੂ ਜੀ ਕੀ ਫਤਹ ॥

[Raaj.Karega.Khalsa]

Shall we just rely on this and ignore the SGGS ji ?

Was this Guru Nanak's message ?

All the quotes were either from Dhan Sri Guru Granth Saheb Ji or from Bhai Gurdas Jis Kabit/Vaaraan.

I don't for a minute think that God himself had to come in a life form and address us in the form of Nanak.

I believe that Nanak under the hukam and divine will was here to teach and guide, and spoke the word or shabad of the akaal purakh.

This does mean that there was some form of the almighty within him that gave this message, but it does NOT mean that it was ALL God himself here in a human form disguise !!!

With all due respect, it simply does NOT matter what you think.

Please provide evidence and proof to back up what you say and believe in.

[luckysingh99]

_{I believe what the op asked.}

_{I believe the gurus were teacher and guides and not the ONE himself.}

_{I don't for a moment believe that the omnipresent nirankaar would take birth as a human.}

_{The gurus starting from Nanak ji are not deities, that when put together make up the ONE lord.}

_{One should look at gurbani grammar and note the different ways that Guru is spelt. There are 3 different terms used with either no aukhad under the r, or with one or two !}

_{The shabad uttered by Guru Nanak dev ji and the following Nanaks is the WORD of th ONE GURU.}

_{This is what the shabads quoted refer to and not a physical guru form.}

_{Please review and you will hopefully realise what I mean.}

_{The answers are all within us and in the shabad.- This is why you don't need to take anyone elses word for it !}

[Raaj.Karega.Khalsa]

_{I believe what the op asked.}

_{I believe the gurus were teacher and guides and not the ONE himself.}

_{I don't for a moment believe that the omnipresent nirankaar would take birth as a human.}

_{The gurus starting from Nanak ji are not deities, that when put together make up the ONE lord.}

Provide proof to back up what you say and believe in.

_{One should look at gurbani grammar and note the different ways that Guru is spelt. There are 3 different terms used with either no aukhad under the r, or with one or two !}

Atleast mention the Gurbani quote that you're referring to!

[luckysingh99]

Sorry the grammar point is not referring to any quote, but the whole Granth.

references are for Guru as teacher or brahmgyani, and references for Guru as the ONE supreme God.