Aukhati sant samaaj - boycotts rally for Prof Bhullar

[UKLondonSikh]

But you will get ... missionaries try to discredit these men every chance they get.

Where is are these fake professors ... dhunda ... gone? Why arent they supporting Sadda Haq and Prof Bullar?

UK = Paji, the whole Panth is 100% united in favour of innocent Professor Sahib being released. The whole Panth regards Bhai Rajoana and Bhai Jagtar Singh Hawara with the greatest of respect for sacrificing their own lives in order to protect those of the innocent.

UK = Sarbjit Singh Khalsa and Panthpreet Singh Khalsa are merely opposed for considering the birth of the Khalsa Panth at Sri Anandpur Sahib in 1699 to be more central in the reckoning of Sikh history than the supposed figure of "Dusht Daman" (concept ... rather than actual name) in relation to the Hindu Maa Durga in Uttaranchal near Sri Hemkhunt Sahib.

Below you can see their positions on Bhai Rajoana and Professor Bhullar quite clearly:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SQrHRUw7CHM

And yet these two parcharaks Sarabhjit Singh Khalsa (Dhunda) and Panthpreet Singh Khalsa are accused of being the biggest threats to Sikhi because they focus on eliminating jaath-paath, ending female infanticide, the drugs menace and literacy as core issues. Sikhi can never be destroyed if we as a Panth have full ekta on the fundamental issues that count and debate with pyaar and satkaar when it comes to lesser issues which should not lead to violence within the Panth.

[Jonny101]

And yet these two parcharaks Sarabhjit Singh Khalsa (Dhunda) and Panthpreet Singh Khalsa are accused of being the biggest threats to Sikhi because they focus on eliminating jaath-paath, ending female infanticide, the drugs menace and literacy as core issues. Sikhi can never be destroyed if we as a Panth have full ekta on the fundamental issues that count and debate with pyaar and satkaar when it comes to lesser issues which should not lead to violence within the Panth.

rrrm, not quite. They are considered threats because they do parchar(actually attack) against the very fundamentals of Sikhism such as Gurbani and Naam Simran, hence against Sikhi itself!

BTW, you do realize that Dhunda has not said a word about Prof Bhullar. Last year I was in Punjab during the Rajoana riots. All Sikh leaders were either on the streets or were arrested. Interestingly Dhunda and the Kala Afghanist mandli were neither on the streets to lead the Sikhs neither did the government arrest them. Wonder why. As for Panth preet Singh, I will give him credit where he deserves it. He is neither a fully fledged Kala Afghanist but neither traditionalist, he is sort of a half way between the two sides. But he deserves credit for speaking on Panthic Masle.

As for Dasam Bani issue, veerji, considering our political state as it is right now, it is really necessary for the Kala Afghanists to right now at this point in time to cause division amongst Sikhs on the topic of Dasam Granth? We have so many more pressing issues to deal with, why create Vaad Vivaad on a topic which Sikhs never gave a second thought about in the past? Seriously?

[UKLondonSikh]

rrrm, not quite. They are considered threats because they do parchar(actually attack) against the very fundamentals of Sikhism such as Gurbani and Naam Simran, hence against Sikhi itself!

BTW, you do realize that Dhunda has not said a word about Prof Bhullar. Last year I was in Punjab during the Rajoana riots. All Sikh leaders were either on the streets or were arrested. Interestingly Dhunda and the Kala Afghanist mandli were neither on the streets to lead the Sikhs neither did the government arrest them. Wonder why. As for Panth preet Singh, I will give him credit where he deserves it. He is neither a fully fledged Kala Afghanist but neither traditionalist, he is sort of a half way between the two sides. But he deserves credit for speaking on Panthic Masle.

As for Dasam Bani issue, veerji, considering our political state as it is right now, it is really necessary for the Kala Afghanists to right now at this point in time to cause division amongst Sikhs on the topic of Dasam Granth? We have so many more pressing issues to deal with, why create Vaad Vivaad on a topic which Sikhs never gave a second thought about in the past? Seriously?

UK = Paji i hear you. It's my sincere belief that Dhunda Sahib cannot be in the same boat as Sant Samaj on this issue. He's always vocal about the Genocides and injustices meted out against our Qaum. The Kesri Lehar concept has 100% support amongst the Qaum and I think we shouldn't assume that if a youtube clip with such a subject heading is not always quickly accessible that it necassarily means opposition to the same (as you rightly clarified in Bhai Ranjit Singh's case).

UK = Paji i totally agree with you that ekta is the need for the moment. But if we have pyaar amngst us then even debate cannot weaken our bonds. Obviously I have a totally opposite viewpoint to you on that issue but as your brother within the Panth i have total 100% faith in your sincerity and love for Sikhi ... so I would always stand alongside you and brothers like GPS Paji and DSG Paji for the advancement of our Panth's bigger objectives. Paji please give your thoughts on another thread regarding the waiver of East Punjab's debts if you can as I believe if we as a Panth unite on that easy objective which no GurSikh can oppose we can uplift millions of Sikhs (and others) out of poverty and that ought to help fade smaller issues that have gained prominence since 1977 even more into the background.

[Jonny101]

UK = Paji i totally agree with you that ekta is the need for the moment. But if we have pyaar amngst us then even debate cannot weaken our bonds. Obviously I have a totally opposite viewpoint to you on that issue but as your brother within the Panth i have total 100% faith in your sincerity and love for Sikhi ... so I would always stand alongside you and brothers like GPS Paji and DSG Paji for the advancement of our Panth's bigger objectives. Paji please give your thoughts on another thread regarding the waiver of East Punjab's debts if you can as I believe if we as a Panth unite on that easy objective which no GurSikh can oppose we can uplift millions of Sikhs (and others) out of poverty and that ought to help fade smaller issues that have gained prominence since 1977 even more into the background.

Veerji, I agree. Politically we can see Sikhs all want the same thing i.e. justice for 84, upliftment of our people. For that we need unity. But when one side is constantly raking up issues which have literally divided the Panth since the last 15 yrs, and knowing their actions have divided the Panth they still continue to do so instead of thinking that maybe we have bigger masle/issues to deal with right now and temporarily we should put aside theological issues and just concentrate on achieving our Panthic goals i.e. Justice for 84, tackling female infanticide, apostasy amongst youth, and drug use. These are the issues that need to be dealt with, rather than questioning whether or not Guru Jee was at Hemkunt or whether Nitnemi Banis Jaap Sahib, Chaupi Sahib, Svaye is Bani or not and thus confusing the common Sikhs in the process instead of uniting them.

The only people that benefit from Sikhs fighting on the topic of Dasam Bani is the GOI because they know as long as Sikhs are distracted on these, Sikhs will not focus on political issues that really matter to the Panth. Just look at how when last year when the entire global Sikh nation was united on Bhai Rajoana, all of North India was shaken. GOI does not want Sikhs to show united front like this, they want Sikhs to be confused and fight on frivolous topics.

[UKLondonSikh]

Jonny Paji i'm glad we agree in essence. I think that's the key to our Panth's onward progress in all issues facing us. Let's all of us Sangat continue to stress and highlight the issues on which it is automatic and natural for us to be in total Unity and keep other smaller issues on the back burner. One issue that I am confident Sant Samaj, Badal, Sarbhjit Singh Dhunda, Panthpreet Singh Khalsa and all on this forum can all be 100% united on is to push Professor Bhullar Sahib's beliefs on the East Punjab debts waiver that Delhi racked up pursuing the Genocide of Sikhs most aggressively between 1980 and Beanta's fitting death. So these dogs butcher our innocent people and then lump ensuing generations of mostly Sikh youth with the noose of state debt for that - thereby stifling economic growth in Punjab as a consequence as well as increasing poverty and encouraging the drugs menace to boot. If we can convert our energies on the Professor Bhullar injustice to simultaneously raising a 25million strong petition on the waiver of East Punjab debts then with a bit of luck we might just get Manmohan Singh to convince Sonia to go along it before the next Indian election.

[gurdeepsinghjohal]

They(sant) have decided to meet President to submit petition for Prof. Bhullar.

[Sikhistan]

3 pages of discussion but where is the news source? Which daily this news got published in ?

Was it from some missionary news site or some amateur self made news site or a post from fb?

[chatanga]

i had hoped that some people inc those who posted in a frivolous news item a few months ago would have learned some lessons from it. Akali Dal Amritsar, have been very vocal in attacking Sant Samaj, because of their alliance with badal, which should give you some idea, of the news source, and whether it is a personal issue, or not. Damdami Taksal, had distanced themselves from S. Maan after he began to use poor words against Baba Thakur Singh Ji.

One thing I wish to say, is that things are not always what they seem on the surface to us commoners. A lot of Sikhs do a lot of work, in local and panthic circles, whioch very few people acknowledge or are even aware off.

I personally have had this said against me, by ignorant members of my local gurdwara committee,simply because i dont do my sewa in front of them.

You dont need to take my word fir it, but i know that the Sant Samaj have be working hard in the Prof. Bhullar, but not just that they have been working where it has some effect.

I hope that some of the more educated ones amongst you can accept this.

[S1ngh]

Totally agree with chatanga. I may or may not agree with sant samaj but I won't listen to third party who are pretty much rogue and disorganized entities.

Those who are praising small time akuhati bani attacking speakers like dhunda or panthpreet or other rogue missionaries need to take fresh course on Sikhi. Though I also need to take course to learn more about Sikhi but people who get swayed by people like dhunda and co are no different than naive folks who get swayed by deravaad like Radha swami.

Rather than jumping guns on finding blame who is responsible for not saving bhullar need to take basic course of political science or have bit of common sense. Tomorrow I can release news against someone whom I really dislike by saying that they never released press release nor gone to Delhi to protest etc etc.

All these personal grudge and fights are the main reason why such news release ppl are not focused on one subject. These ppl are opportunist who try to score their points against their enemies by raping true cause.

Sorry for being blunt but totally disgusting of ppl finger pointing each other and throwing blame on others.

I am not fan of sant samaj and I think such name should not be kept and even having such entity is threat to Sri Akal takht sahib.

Sgpc, whole samaj org and jathabandiya should be dissolved both that is distant dream.

[UKLondonSikh]

S4P = Totally agree with chatanga. I may or may not agree with sant samaj but I won't listen to third party who are pretty much rogue and disorganized entities.

UK = Paji whilst i may not always agree with Simranjit Singh Mann I don't believe he is a rogue by any stretch. I believe he does wish for Sikhi's Chardi Kallah even though his approach is one that will never succeed in today's world where the West is courting India due to the billions they can earn through commercial trade (to the detriment of various people's human rights)

S4P = Those who are praising small time akuhati bani attacking speakers like dhunda or panthpreet or other rogue missionaries need to take fresh course on Sikhi. Though I also need to take course to learn more about Sikhi but people who get swayed by people like dhunda and co are no different than naive folks who get swayed by deravaad like Radha swami.

UK = Agreed Paji i am just an ordinary person so I can definitely learn more about Sikhi. However, the point that Sarbhjit Singh Khalsa (Dhunda) and Panthpreet Singh Khalsa make about Sri Anandpur Sahib and the birth of the Khalsa Panth being more central to what Sikhi is about than, for example, Sri Hemkhunt Sahib cannot be dismissed so easily and it's something that will not vanish as a position. We are one indivisible Panth. I think differing viewpoints, if expressed with pyaar and satkaar, should be allowed to vent freely as I'm 100% convinced that the pro-Gurmat position as famously espoused from Gurmat Gyan College is a valid position within Sikhi. I oppose people Gurinder Dhillon and Congressi Sarna just as much as you do Paji.

S4P = Rather than jumping guns on finding blame who is responsible for not saving bhullar need to take basic course of political science or have bit of common sense. Tomorrow I can release news against someone whom I really dislike by saying that they never released press release nor gone to Delhi to protest etc etc.

UK = Agreed Paji that we cannot conclude someone is against Sikhi if their press release has not been publicised but I believe the wider point that Badal has not done enough for innocent Professor Bhullar Sahib stands.

S4P = All these personal grudge and fights are the main reason why such news release ppl are not focused on one subject. These ppl are opportunist who try to score their points against their enemies by raping true cause.

UK = Agreed Paji it's not about points scoring, we have to work together as a Panth on the matters where 100% of the Panth agrees and foster Unity even where we may disagree.

S4P = Sorry for being blunt but totally disgusting of ppl finger pointing each other and throwing blame on others.

UK = I think Mann Sahib did it to goad them into action but I do agree with your point overall.

S4P = I am not fan of sant samaj and I think such name should not be kept and even having such entity is threat to Sri Akal takht sahib.

UK = I agree with you Paji

S4P = Sgpc, whole samaj org and jathabandiya should be dissolved both that is distant dream.

UK = Even if they don't immediately dissolve, as long as all work together in Unity for the Panth interests that's the main thing. And tackling the drugs menace, female infanticide, woeful education+healthcare provision in Punjab, bakhre bakhre Gurdwaray are five easy examples where we should all put our differences aside and unite for the common good (which would be helped if Manmohan Singh were to waive a portion of Punjab's debts so that the same monies could be diverted towards education and healthcare in Punjab). We as a Panth can and should demand this as as issue and objective even more important than Professor Bhullar's immoral death sentence.