Dating A White Girl

[AmanSingh1867 55]

Thanks for the replies Sangat Ji!

I should point out that it isn't the fact that her skin is white that is making me have doubts, there are 2 other reasons:

1) I want to raise my kids to be Sikhs, so naturally I will be teaching them Punjabi. My GF does not speak Punjabi, so it would be hard to have a Punjabi-speaking environment at home. I want my future kids to be able to read/write Gurmukhi too, so they can read Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji without needing to use English translations.

2) My parents. I do not know how they will react to me bringing home a white girl. I am pretty sure they wouldn't be too happy though.

But other than that, I could definitely see myself getting married to her in the future once we are done with Uni. She knows how seriously I take my Sikhi, and that I want to start a Sikh family in the future, so the fact that she has stuck around shows me that she is willing to (if we get married) bring the kids up as Sikhs, she would have no problem with it.

@Ek_Sikh: Yeah I've seen keshdari guys go out with Hindu and Muslim girls too. I really don't know what it is, for some reason, the majority of apnea kuddiya don't have much respect for the turban and beard. There isn't much you can do about it though, I think that the kesh acts as a great filter to keep away immature girls who aren't long-term relationship material. This girl asked me out, so right away I knew that she cared about more than just appearances (although tbh, I consider myself to be a pretty good looking guy, not trying to brag lol), and she has proved me right over the past couple of weeks. I think that most keshdari guys who complain about girl problems are the ones that only go for Punjabi girls. The ones that will go for white/hindu/muslim/black/chinese etc... girls too know that there are plenty of chicks out there who will date them for who they are, lots of girls who actually respect a guy who stands up for his Sikhi, and a lot of them ain't Punjabi.

@nanosecond: Yes I think she likes me for my values. Like I said, she doesn't go clubbing or get drunk or do drugs or anything of the sort. She is the kind of girl who focuses on her studies, volunteers with charities and organizes food drives. She told me how much of a relief it was for her to meet a guy who actually shared her straight edge lifestyle and drive to do sewa (although she doesn't call it that obviously). I have been told over and over again throughout my life by girls that the most attractive trait in a guy is for him to stand up for what he believes in. Kesh is a symbol that you believe in Sikhi values of selfless service, equality of all mankind, no drugs/alcohol, fighting against injustice etc... a guy that cuts his hair for girls is pathetic. If a guy cuts his hair to win over a girl, I'd bet my life that the girl is going to end up dumping him in the future, because if she can make you give up your Sikhi, she knows she can make you do anything she wants, and she will lose all respect for you. And a girl who does not respect you is a girl who won't stay with you. Real men, pioneers, leaders, do not care what the world throws at them, they stand tall in the face of all adversity and never throw away what they believe in, for that would be the death of their soul. It is for this reason that I have decided that I would rather remain single for the rest of my life than cut my hair to try and get with some immature girl. Thankfully, it doesn't seem like I will have to do that

I am sorry about your situation, I hope things work out for you, you sound like a really nice guy and deserve happiness

[Only five 1,124]

If you are flashing around daddy's bank roll in a nice car, nice clothing, money to spend without a care, and university paid for by daddy, then any clever girl will be nice and make sure she gets a piece of that pie.

More and more girls from other races have figured out that Punjabi parents give everything to their boys and this means easily six figures. So they target Punjabi naïve boys that start drooling as a white girl asks them out.

Many Punjabi girls don't go for the money because they are sick and tired of being classed as second class once they are married into Punjabi families. So they compensate for the money by making the money for themselves and now they can do as they wish. Punjabi girls want that relaxed married life without taking care of the husbands parents. The girl from the other race gets away with this because she molds the husband into her way of thinking.

[AmanSingh1867 55]

If you are flashing around daddy's bank roll in a nice car, nice clothing, money to spend without a care, and university paid for by daddy, then any clever girl will be nice and make sure she gets a piece of that pie.

More and more girls from other races have figured out that Punjabi parents give everything to their boys and this means easily six figures. So they target Punjabi naïve boys that start drooling as a white girl asks them out.

Many Punjabi girls don't go for the money because they are sick and tired of being classed as second class once they are married into Punjabi families. So they compensate for the money by making the money for themselves and now they can do as they wish. Punjabi girls want that relaxed married life without taking care of the husbands parents. The girl from the other race gets away with this because she molds the husband into her way of thinking.

Well I don't have a car, I wear pretty normal clothing and my parents have never given me so much as 20 dollars to "spend without a care" on whatever I want. I've been told to work for everything that I want.

I wasn't drooling over the fact that she is white, it actually made me apprehensive because I knew of the possible problems we may have to face down the line. I DO want to live with my parents even after marriage, I am the eldest son and want to take care of my parents. I will also do my best to take care of my wife's parents, as I believe in respecting your in-laws.

I would never allow any girl to mold me into her way of thinking lol. The second any girls starts telling me what I can and can't do, or makes me compromise my Sikhi and fundamental values in any way, I am out of there. But that's just me, can't speak for all Punjabi guys.

[isingh1699 209]

Make 2 parchian - yes and no.....go to Gurdwara, do ardas from heart if she's the one for you....and have some kid pick one for you.

But do this only if you are strong enough to follow Guru sahib's hukum.

Veerji this is the manmat method that Pakhandi Babe usually advise. It is contrary to Gurmat and fake examples are usually given to justify it.

Why? I have heard of many enlightened Gursikhs asking important questions before Guru Ji in this way. Didn't Bhai Mani Singh Ji use this method to decide whether to follow Guru Granth Sahib or Banda Singh Bahadur?

Veerji when Banda Singh Bahadur himself followed Guru Granth Sahib Ji Maharaj the question of Bhai Mani Singh using the Pakhandi Sadh method of parchian (gambling) does not arise. It's a shame we have stooped so low as to even propagate lies on Bhai Mehtab Singh and Bhai Sukha Singh regarding the parchi method when our Guru Sahib has all the answers.

[Guest gupt]

One thing though the only thing that would bother me is when it comes to marriage right I mean a girls whole family got to be same caste and how do we find this out in this case. Its not possible right, but bhaji you are lucky to have found a good girl.

[proactive 2,080]

If you are flashing around daddy's bank roll in a nice car, nice clothing, money to spend without a care, and university paid for by daddy, then any clever girl will be nice and make sure she gets a piece of that pie.

More and more girls from other races have figured out that Punjabi parents give everything to their boys and this means easily six figures. So they target Punjabi naïve boys that start drooling as a white girl asks them out.

Many Punjabi girls don't go for the money because they are sick and tired of being classed as second class once they are married into Punjabi families. So they compensate for the money by making the money for themselves and now they can do as they wish. Punjabi girls want that relaxed married life without taking care of the husbands parents. The girl from the other race gets away with this because she molds the husband into her way of thinking.

That's pretty harsh. Aman Singh sounds like a an intelligent guy so if this girl was after him for his money then he would soon have figured that out.

Aman Singh

I think you are right in considering all the issues that arise from having a non-Punjabi partner. The issue with parents is a major issue, mainly because your mother would want a Punjabi daughter in law because she is looking into the future and thinks that a Punjabi one would be more respectful, probably want to live in the extended family, look after her etc. Although we all know that even a Punjabi wife is less likely to do the above but your mother probably has the above perception. Also our own stereotyping of white people also doesn't help so she will probably think that the white girl will turn you into a clubbing-shubbing, sharabi-kababi!

I think both your parents as well as the white girl needs you to put everything on the table. She needs to know that your family are an important part of your life, that she might have to live in the extended family and take an active part in the larger family. Your parents will need you to be straight with them. As you said marriage is still far off as you need to complete uni so you could mention in passing how you see some non-Punjabis are more Sikh than the Sikhs that you have met. Tell them that you are friends with males and females of all races. This will get your family used to that fact that you are interacting with all kinds of people and they will see that you are still strong in your Sikhi.

[Only five 1,124]

That's pretty harsh. Aman Singh sounds like a an intelligent guy so if this girl was after him for his money then he would soon have figured that out.

Tell that to Sikhs who married a white woman and she refuses to take Amrit.

[sat 542]

Goreh are slowly realizing that their western values mostly do not give them inner peace and are drawn to sikhi, where as apne girls and boys want to be westernized, ok there are good points to their way of live too, but like i say they are slowly realizing but apne are heading down a path of destruction, so i think marrying a gori who is interested in sikhi is far way better than an apne who is not, had i have been in the same situation 20 years ago or my kids are in the same situation in years to come, i know what decision i will make, and the talkers in our community can whistle!!!

ok what about the apne who have married apnia who refuse to take amrit, you cant give a guarantee about anyone, it is all in Guru ji's hands.

[13Mirch 1,180]

All up to u son. No one else only between u and the guru.

[MKaur89 108]

It's funny that people are saying making parchia with 'YES' or 'NO' is not what a Sikh of the Guru should do, but it's okay to encourage this Sikh of the Guru to have pre-maritial interracial relationships? In relationships of this nature, whether white or brown, sooner or later both parties give in to kaam and this is not the Sikh way of doing things.

To the OP, you already know your family won't be too happy about you bringing home a white girl, so what more needs to be said? Before things get too deep with this girl, why not sit your parents down and ask them how they would feel about having this girl as their future daughter-in-law? Surely it's your family you should be seeking advice from, not people here. It's you and your family who will have to deal with the consequences if you end up marrying this girl, not people on this forum so of course they will encourage you to do things that they wouldn't want their own brothers/sisters/daughters/sons to do. In my own family and many others, I've seen what happens when Punjabis marry white girls/boys and it's not pretty. The actions of one person can cause so much fall-out throughout even the extended family and it's not easy to be a part of this.

Your mother and father raised you, you owe more to them than this girl- why risk your parents' happiness and respect just because of a few rotten Punjabi girls you met. You mention that these girls were Punjabi and didn't like your turban and beard, but if instead you met or were introduced to a Punjabi Gursikh or keshdari girl, then she would like your turban and beard. Before you are certain that you want to marry this girl, why not ask your parents to use their connections to introduce you to a Punjabi girl who does respect your kesh, because despite common belief, there are quite a few Sikh girls out there who do want to marry a sardar.

Of course there are many white girls who do respect Sikh values and kesh, and even go on to marry Sikh guys. Some of these girls also become Sikh and take Amrit, but many more also do not become Sikh or amritdhari, no matter how much respect they have for our religion.

Pre-maritial relationships of any kind are forbidden, and an Anand Karaj can only be done between a Sikh man and Sikh woman- read up on it in the Sikh Rehat Maryada.

[tuhintuhin 670]

Veerji this is the manmat method that Pakhandi Babe usually advise. It is contrary to Gurmat and fake examples are usually given to justify it.

well .... it's upto you.....you are doing ardas to guru sahib.........

I heard this in one of Sant Sujan Singh ji's deewan , keertaniye of Dhan Dhan Baba Nand Singh ji - "if ever in doubt.....go to Guru sahib, do ardas ke mein paapi haan, eni matt nahin ke sahi faisla kar sakaa, tusin nirna karke daso" (now please don't start doing nindeya here, nahin manana na mano, tuhadi marji - (no offence)

and I do fully agree with that and have implied this in my life and I am happy with the decisions I got, not really what I desired, may be opposite..but benefitted me at the end.......kise kolon slaahan lain ton better hai apne Guru nu pusho......

this is all I have to say.......

Guru bhalla kare

[N30S1NGH 3,155]

Good post tuhituhin, one can alternatively take hakumnama as well and meet panj pyares privately... If you meet panj pyares they will tell you advise based on individual case, in this case may provide advise to follow steps in sehaj when it comes take amrit.. For eg if one is not ready for Amrit they won't tell you take one if they think you are not ready but use vidhiya from past like do this many patt, meditation, sehaj patt, seva, kirtan to invoke stream of love for guru and sikhi.. Panj pyares can do parchar and provide vidhiyas to invoke stream of love toward Guru rest is up guru and Karam of an individual.. Akhan jor chaupe na jor pauri from japji comes in mind.

[Guest jammyyyyddger]

awwww she sounds like a keeper and decent, she sounds enlightened about sikhi

BTW DONT FEEL LIKE A HYPOCRIT COS MUSLIM AND GORIYAA R DIFFERENT. N SINGHS HAVE BEEF, WHITE PPL N SIKHS DONT..WELL DERS EDL BUT THEY REALLY H8 ON MUSALMAN BCOS OG TERRIOISM.

[luckysingh99 1,200]

First off a Sikh of the guru is not allowed to date.

The problem is that dating, then marriage seems to be the only way to eradicate the caste system !!

I've known plenty of Sikhs who have dated and married out of caste but I have NEVER known anyone have an arranged marriage out of caste, have you ???

[N30S1NGH 3,155]

Luckysingh you bought up a good point but it appears even if one overcomes marrying out of caste, one seems to be stuck marrying within their groups, sects and so on.!!

But i am happy to say things are changing slowly..we are seeing more interracial/out of caste/out of group marriages between two sikhs who are baptized ..i can speak for my own divine friend who used to be sampardaie katha vaichak for 10 years ..he recently married white singhani recently..its funny in their case- she does not know punjabi and he knows english but still broken they are couple match made in heaven as they both have put divine guru as their central theme, divinity as witness in their marriage. They both went to see his family last year. She was more inclined to learn about our sikh culture, more interested than some of punjabi women you would find. Things are definitely in reverse in good way. As veer said above, our punjabi girls seem to be more western whereas many white/blacks other races have bought up in western culture and they discovered its shallowness in overtime they are more into eastern spiritualism-peace of mind than our whole lot...they don't waste time in talk about technicalities/other flame wars, they jump right in depth of eastern spiritualism and sikh gurbani mysticism...!!