My Workplace May Fire Me! Read Why! - Advise Needed.

[buddasingh]

Keep in mind that it may be company protocol or policy to investigate such complaints. One hopes a company does this to prevent discrimination. At the least a company would do this to minimize legal implications. The company is vicariously liable for actions of its employees.

They may simply warn you and put it on your record. You may want to explain but also acknowledge how what you said could be taken the wrong way.

As above, if you are unionized, which i doubt, involve your Union immediately.

Assuming caller was Singh in substance not just caste, he may not know that you are Singh in substance. Majority of people with the name Singh are caste Singhs. Largest discrimination and respect of proper Singhs comes from caste Singhs in many places.

Assuming caller was caste Singh there is hardly any basis for your comment that you expect certain conduct. You already stated that you did not know if he was a real Singh. Perhaps you were attempting to confer the honor upon him as a brother but in context of argument things can be misinterpreted.

If your facts justify perhaps you can reassure company in a humble manner that the caller has little or no basis for discrimination complaint in cultural context...but you have learned about being wiser in future.

I always suggest Sikh bros and sisters make their confidence have them grow to a place where our real boss is our conscience without any fear. In other words, if the employer does not treat you properly (they may actually be respecting Singhs here) they should be the first ones afraid of both losing you and being accountable to you.

[Babbar_Singhsta]

VJKKVJKF , thank you guys for the replies ! I've got holidays until todays... I just don't know how to explain "i don't expect this from a singh" to gora operations manger.. need to get the words right.

There isn't a union as such..

I think i'm going to let it pay out , appeal it , stay humble and calm. If they do fire me its their loss and maharaj has bigger things planned for me

Akaal!

[ssinghuk]

VJKKVJKF , thank you guys for the replies ! I've got holidays until todays... I just don't know how to explain "i don't expect this from a singh" to gora operations manger.. need to get the words right.

There isn't a union as such..

I think i'm going to let it pay out , appeal it , stay humble and calm. If they do fire me its their loss and maharaj has bigger things planned for me

Akaal!

I think Buddasingh jee just answered the above:

"Assuming caller was caste Singh there is hardly any basis for your comment that you expect certain conduct. You already stated that you did not know if he was a real Singh. Perhaps you were attempting to confer the honor upon him as a brother but in context of argument things can be misinterpreted."

Anyway, keep Maharaaj with u when you're dealing with this situation.

[double-edge]

vjkk vjkf

Veer ji what you said was right, let it play out, stay humble and most importantly rely only on the support of Guru jee.

Do 1 mala jaap of 'Thir ghar beso har jan piaray' shabad before you sleep at night, followed by ardaas.

Rest Maharaj will arrange.

[JagsawSingh]

SInghs are not a race but a religious group...so again no racism or religious hatred,

jkvlondon, as you live in the UK, you should know that according to UK Law, the Sikhs and the Jews are the only 2 religions that are considered a 'race' as well as a religion.

Now, as for the issue at hand, I'm afraid its not good news for the starter of the thread. We know and understand that our friend meant nothing disrespectful but really, we need to be objective and look at this situation from that customer's point of view. He had a right not to have his race or religious belief brought into any business transaction with the company and anyone else listening back on the conversation will instantly conclude that you feel they and their religion are uncouth and speak with filthy mouths but only Sikhs speak in a civilised way. His race and religion were irrelevent and should not have come into the conversation. That much is so clear cut I really would not advise you to appeal any decision that goes against you.

What is more frightening, judging by the advice you've received from others here, is how little understanding of the law many Sikhs here have. In life there are alleged cases of discrimination that are difficult to judge and some that are easy. This one here is so crystal clear...so obvious that I am amazed you have received the kind of advice given in previous answers. It demonstrates a very widespread ignorance of Laws and rights, and that really doesn't bode to well for our future.

At best, I hope you might be able to minimise your punishment by having a conversation with your employers where you admit that you made a mistake (which you will ensure does not happen again) and it was an honest albeit mistaken attempt to say something positive to the customer.

[JSinghnz]

Thus speaks judge JagsawSingh.

[JagsawSingh]

Thus speaks judge JagsawSingh.

This is not about mine or anyone else's viewpoint. The Law is very clear on this matter and the Law is that the customer deserved not to have his race or religion come into the equation during any business transaction with this company.

[JSinghnz]

This is not about mine or anyone else's viewpoint. The Law is very clear on this matter and the Law is that the customer deserved not to have his race or religion come into the equation during any business transaction with this company.

But is it an dismiss able is another matter.

The law has to be fair and listen to both sides.

That includes circumstantial evidence and then mitigation factors.

Proper procedures have to be followed by the company and

we are giving advice to our brother in that context.

The OP has been told how to deal with this situation calmly and objectively.

If you can help with some advice, it would be good.

Do not make silly judgement that all others know nothing about law.

[JagsawSingh]

But is it an dismiss able is another matter.

The law has to be fair and listen to both sides.

Absolutely agree. We're in total agreement with that which is why I told him in my first message to admit his mistake and try and minimise his punishment.

[jkvlondon]

jkvlondon, as you live in the UK, you should know that according to UK Law, the Sikhs and the Jews are the only 2 religions that are considered a 'race' as well as a religion.

Now, as for the issue at hand, I'm afraid its not good news for the starter of the thread. We know and understand that our friend meant nothing disrespectful but really, we need to be objective and look at this situation from that customer's point of view. He had a right not to have his race or religious belief brought into any business transaction with the company and anyone else listening back on the conversation will instantly conclude that you feel they and their religion are uncouth and speak with filthy mouths but only Sikhs speak in a civilised way. His race and religion were irrelevent and should not have come into the conversation. That much is so clear cut I really would not advise you to appeal any decision that goes against you.

What is more frightening, judging by the advice you've received from others here, is how little understanding of the law many Sikhs here have. In life there are alleged cases of discrimination that are difficult to judge and some that are easy. This one here is so crystal clear...so obvious that I am amazed you have received the kind of advice given in previous answers. It demonstrates a very widespread ignorance of Laws and rights, and that really doesn't bode to well for our future.

At best, I hope you might be able to minimise your punishment by having a conversation with your employers where you admit that you made a mistake (which you will ensure does not happen again) and it was an honest albeit mistaken attempt to say something positive to the customer.

Veer ji ,

one cannot prove Racism from above conversation just that an expectation of a certain standard of behaviour was stated, even one would expect it from anyone . Yes Bhai Sahib is working a helpline/customer support and people get irate often when they perceive that they aren't going to get what they want, but , in truth no one has a right to be abusive and most companies have this policy that they will terminate business conversation or refuse to treat the offer of custom from abusive individuals.

Just because I buy a product it is my job to inform myself of the conditions of sale(caveat emptor) as ignorance of the law is no defence in the UK, in contract law if I have a shop I can refuse to treat any custom I like because the contract is only struck on sale of goods . The guys battery was sold fit for purpose and could in theory be exchanged for similar(sales of goods act 1979) but not get money back, also the contract he struck was for defective part replacement up to six months from sale, which is reasonable for manufacturing faults to become apparent especially in high turnover electronic goods. If he doesn't like it he should complain to the company in writing simple.

Racial discrimination lawsuits are rare here because they are hard to make stick without serious evidence , thankfully unlike USA we have not got to the level of petty litigation running through our courts due to the strict standards held for allowing cases to be submitted . Bhai Sahib's best bet is to talk with HR at head office, and put his case since they will be recording all inputs to this case employer, complainant and employee plus any legal department entries I doubt seriously there is an active union in his particular shop as I think that his company runs a franchise model but maybe his good record and relationship will mean he can talk with his direct manager and iron out the misunderstanding sooner. Yes he should say he expressed an opinion which was naive and mistaken in the business context and apologise in writing but beyond that he should not blow it up further.

Mandla vs lee 1982 is the case law for Sikhs being recognised as a racial group due to seperate indentity and culture.

Under Equality Act 2010 one can justify discrimination see below

http://www.adviceguide.org.uk/england/discrimination_e/discrimination_unlawful_conduct_e/ge14_justifying_discrimination.htm

thing is Bhai Sahib did not fall under any of the four classes of discrimination , he did not deny service because of the race of the person just because of contract law and company policy. He explained the situation clearly and in an non-hostile manner and gave fair warning of termination of conversation when abuse started from the Complainant.