Why do people doubt jhatka and Sukha when there are vast amounts of evidence stating Sikhs practiced both?

[Nihang96k 4]

Everyone knows that nihangs in both budha and tarna dal practice jhatka and drink shaheedi degh, but people always say “oh that’s going against rehat” and “that’s a “kurheit”. 

Mate go and look at all the evidence out there that says that we ate meat. The English have been successful in messing up the Panth. They changed our dastaars, made most of the Panth think that dasam and sarbloh Granth is not authentic, changed our nishaan sahibs and made us into some Brahmin religion. 

Looking at the Sikhs today, it really does look like we are a sect of Hinduism with our vaishnu practices. 

Go and read your history and see for yourself, stop making sikhi into some Hindu sect!

go onto http://www.jhatkamaryada.com/ and see for yourself the amount of evidence from souces ranging from Panth Prakash to the British themselves! 

[singh598 470]

The life of a gyani taksali Singh or nirmala is very different to that of the Nihangs.

The true Nihangs are rare as they are the incarnation of the shatriya warrior

Today's jathedar the like of Buddha Dal jathedar are all fake the true Nihangs loved an extremely difficult life of wilderness fighting a gureiila war against the enemy even the feeble Hindus worshipped the Nihangs and prayed that there first child be a Nihang killing wild animals with chatka and drinking sukha these kamikazes were the vanguard protecting the panth unlike today's fat belly's ie manjit Singh gk and gurcharan Singh jathedar of akaal takhat and the corrupt SGPC and the baby Harnaam Singh sitting in the seat of the greatest Baba Jarnail Singh the greatest warrior of the 21st century

Edited March 4, 2018 by singh598

[jkvlondon 4,922]

1 hour ago, Nihang96k said:

Everyone knows that nihangs in both budha and tarna dal practice jhatka and drink shaheedi degh, but people always say “oh that’s going against rehat” and “that’s a “kurheit”. 

Mate go and look at all the evidence out there that says that we ate meat. The English have been successful in messing up the Panth. They changed our dastaars, made most of the Panth think that dasam and sarbloh Granth is not authentic, changed our nishaan sahibs and made us into some Brahmin religion. 

Looking at the Sikhs today, it really does look like we are a sect of Hinduism with our vaishnu practices. 

Go and read your history and see for yourself, stop making sikhi into some Hindu sect!

go onto http://www.jhatkamaryada.com/ and see for yourself the amount of evidence from souces ranging from Panth Prakash to the British themselves! 

same people who say that are usually happy to chow down on halal meat cooked in some restaurant washed down with beers and spirits galore . Why do Singhs even pay any notice to such hypocrites?

Those who choose not to indulge have the right to choose but not to say the rehit didn't exist because there's plenty of evidence to prove Singhs of old did it . hunting jungle soor /boars is highly dangerous and a real test of reflexes and strength  it doesn't surprise me that was a regular target. Point to take is when such hunts happened nothing was wasted , it was not done for pleasure but training/need.

Edited March 4, 2018 by jkvlondon

[ipledgeblue 134]

10 hours ago, Nihang96k said:

Everyone knows that nihangs in both budha and tarna dal practice jhatka and drink shaheedi degh, but people always say “oh that’s going against rehat” and “that’s a “kurheit”. 

Mate go and look at all the evidence out there that says that we ate meat. The English have been successful in messing up the Panth. They changed our dastaars, made most of the Panth think that dasam and sarbloh Granth is not authentic, changed our nishaan sahibs and made us into some Brahmin religion. 

Looking at the Sikhs today, it really does look like we are a sect of Hinduism with our vaishnu practices. 

Go and read your history and see for yourself, stop making sikhi into some Hindu sect!

go onto http://www.jhatkamaryada.com/ and see for yourself the amount of evidence from souces ranging from Panth Prakash to the British themselves! 

unfortunately colonial jathebandis, colonial and post-colonial babas and deras (and sad to say, even sikhsangat.com moderators, just look at the 3rd topic in the Agree to not Disagree section) have been propagating these anti-rehit vaishnu practises. And on the other hand, Singh Sabha and SGPC mainstream are also responsible for not preserving jhatka and shikaar maryada.

 

As we become more aware of rehit and Guru Gobind Singh's bani the more likely we are able to practise this rehit. It is such a shame that sikhs choose to follow cult personalities before following hukams of Guru ji. How can people turn their backs on Gurus and rehit like this yet show amrit dhari roop? 

 

ਰਹਿਤ ਪਿਆਰੀ ਮੁਝ ਕਉ

ਸਿਖ ਪਿਆਰਾ ਨਾਹਿ

Edited March 4, 2018 by ipledgeblue

[jkvlondon 4,922]

1 hour ago, Nihang96k said:

Everyone knows that nihangs in both budha and tarna dal practice jhatka and drink shaheedi degh, but people always say “oh that’s going against rehat” and “that’s a “kurheit”. 

Mate go and look at all the evidence out there that says that we ate meat. The English have been successful in messing up the Panth. They changed our dastaars, made most of the Panth think that dasam and sarbloh Granth is not authentic, changed our nishaan sahibs and made us into some Brahmin religion. 

Looking at the Sikhs today, it really does look like we are a sect of Hinduism with our vaishnu practices. 

Go and read your history and see for yourself, stop making sikhi into some Hindu sect!

go onto http://www.jhatkamaryada.com/ and see for yourself the amount of evidence from souces ranging from Panth Prakash to the British themselves! 

don't just blame gorey , our own granths state that hindus practices were brought in by new singhs  like vaishnu disgust for flesh. I don't eat because I don't need to , but if I did to be sure chatka would be my choice , my actions taken upon myself not this cowardly shifting of karams supposedly to others ...

 

[TigerForce1 163]

4 hours ago, Nihang96k said:

Everyone knows that nihangs in both budha and tarna dal practice jhatka and drink shaheedi degh, but people always say “oh that’s going against rehat” and “that’s a “kurheit”. 

Mate go and look at all the evidence out there that says that we ate meat. The English have been successful in messing up the Panth. They changed our dastaars, made most of the Panth think that dasam and sarbloh Granth is not authentic, changed our nishaan sahibs and made us into some Brahmin religion. 

Looking at the Sikhs today, it really does look like we are a sect of Hinduism with our vaishnu practices. 

Go and read your history and see for yourself, stop making sikhi into some Hindu sect!

go onto http://www.jhatkamaryada.com/ and see for yourself the amount of evidence from souces ranging from Panth Prakash to the British themselves! 

The whole Meat vs Veg argument vs Shaheedi Degh equalling a better warrior is becoming a favourite amongst the youth.  

 

The question is for what purpose does anyone promote Meat and Sukha.  Is it for building stronger bodies or is it for courage in the face of war or is it a combination of both.  Does Sukha bring courage in a coward, does Jatka Meat build a stronger body frame and mind for someone who is trying to bulk up and do the two combined create the ultimate warrior.  On the other hand does a veg diet build a weaker body and mind and does a narcotic free state of mind limit ones inner courage or spirituality.

 

All this arguing is futile when you look at the bigger picture.  When you break Meat and Veg down all you have is macronutrients (Protein, Carbohydrates, Fat).  In the end nothing is Meat and nothing is Vegetable all you have is argument that goes round and round in circles.  

 

What benefit will the Panth have with the promotion of Meat and Sukha and where do you draw the line when you start to break down the chemical compound of Sukha.  Will other mind altering Chemical Drugs be permissible for use in combat and meditation.

 

What benefit will the use of these have on an individuals own personal Kamai?  Will the Meat and Sukh make you a better warrior or will it consume your own soul with Homai, Lobh and Hankaar.

 

[ipledgeblue 134]

6 hours ago, TigerForce1 said:

What benefit will the Panth have with the promotion of Meat and Sukha and where do you draw the line when you start to break down the chemical compound of Sukha.  Will other mind altering Chemical Drugs be permissible for use in combat and meditation.

What benefit will the use of these have on an individuals own personal Kamai?  Will the Meat and Sukh make you a better warrior or will it consume your own soul with Homai, Lobh and Hankaar.

 

Please do not reduce maryada of jhatka and shikaar to just being about Meat.  Read rehit and dasam bani before making such statements!

[Prokharkoo84 302]

instead of nihangs and wanabe nihangs always hyping about meat and pang, how many of them actually train like the real nihangs of the past? I dont mean swinging a sotee around either. How many of these 'nihangs' have done anything on a street level i.e suleh groomers, or done anything in punjab when mass beadbi has taken place? this aint a cuss, but it seems these type of 'nihangs' wana talk the talk or should i say eat the meat, but do what there supposed to e.g. be the pehredhaars of the panth

[TigerForce1 163]

11 hours ago, ipledgeblue said:

Please do not reduce maryada of jhatka and shikaar to just being about Meat.  Read rehit and dasam bani before making such statements!

Bro, I’m doing the exact opposite to reducing Jatka and Shikaar marayada to just eating meat.  I know this was practiced and is still practised amongst the Nihungs.  I also see, understand and respect the reasoning behind it.  What I also see is that this  Puratan practice and Marayada has been pushed to the confines of Shaunis and Nihung Dereh.  The benefits of these practices are not surfacing in the actions of Nihungs as they are no longer willing to engage in combat or willing to step out of their zones to challenge tyranny in the real world.  Neither are the Nihung Singhs I have seen in the diaspora who advocate Puratan practices such as Jatka and Sukha doing anything for the safekeeping of people around them.  

 

Being a Nihung is about practising a way of life and being ready to engage oppression at all times and not just about keeping alive old traditions or practicing these traditions just  on a weekend and then switching off during the work week going back to a being a shirt and tie.  

 

I’m not refuting any of the Puratan Marayada or what is written in Dassam Bani, all I am saying is that it is disservice to Puratan Nihung Singhs to do all this and then to not engage in the real world.  

 

 

[ipledgeblue 134]

3 hours ago, Prokharkoo84 said:

instead of nihangs and wanabe nihangs always hyping about meat and pang, how many of them actually train like the real nihangs of the past? I dont mean swinging a sotee around either. How many of these 'nihangs' have done anything on a street level i.e suleh groomers, or done anything in punjab when mass beadbi has taken place? this aint a cuss, but it seems these type of 'nihangs' wana talk the talk or should i say eat the meat, but do what there supposed to e.g. be the pehredhaars of the panth

I don't even think the nihang wannabes practise jhatka and shikaar, I think I only see a few that actually do shikaar.

But what about the wannabes who want to dress in bana but follow their jathebandi practises? Are they not worse than the so-called wannabe nihangs? 

[Prokharkoo84 302]

19 hours ago, ipledgeblue said:

I don't even think the nihang wannabes practise jhatka and shikaar, I think I only see a few that actually do shikaar.

But what about the wannabes who want to dress in bana but follow their jathebandi practises? Are they not worse than the so-called wannabe nihangs? 

bro i aint having a dig at nihangs, it breaks me to know that the pehredhaar of the kaum have now been reduced to a joke or going on large hyping over meat but not ready for any form of action. regards to others wearing bana but constantly slandering other jathebandis are just has bad, all these divisions in the panth i doubt are even out of sharda for Sikhi, its all self hype and trying to be bigger and better than each other. Until we truly bow our heads in shame in front of Guru Ji then we gona continue to suffer how we are

[13Mirch 1,151]

21 hours ago, Prokharkoo84 said:

bro i aint having a dig at nihangs, it breaks me to know that the pehredhaar of the kaum have now been reduced to a joke or going on large hyping over meat but not ready for any form of action. regards to others wearing bana but constantly slandering other jathebandis are just has bad, all these divisions in the panth i doubt are even out of sharda for Sikhi, its all self hype and trying to be bigger and better than each other. Until we truly bow our heads in shame in front of Guru Ji then we gona continue to suffer how we are

My grandfather was general secretary of the Doaba Kisan Union when Giani Zail Singh inaugurated the Guru Gobind Singh Ji Marg. During those days Zail Singh was playing fiddle to both  Santa Singh of Budha-Dal and the neo-Nirankaris. Only a few days prior, Nirankari gangs had set upon an amritdhari Singh and burned him with acid. The Union took up his case and approached Zail Singh who outright refused to interfere in the matter asserting that Gurbachan Nirankari was a Sant and Sants could not be publicly arraigned and/or criticized. The Union next approached Santa Singh who was, then, based at Bathinda and preparing for his journey to Anandpur Sahib. It informed him that not only were Nirankaris publicly desecrating Gurbani but also attacking Sikhs. Santa Singh, laughed them off, saying that Zail Singh was a hans (pure as swan) and if he believed Gurbachna to be divine then even he-Santa Singh- was ready to conform to the latter. The other Nihang Dals, however, contributed money towards the victim's kin all the while grumbling against Santa Singh's ludicrous rhetoric.  

[s50 105]

4 hours ago, 13Mirch said:

My grandfather was general secretary of the Doaba Kisan Union when Giani Zail Singh inaugurated the Guru Gobind Singh Ji Marg. During those days Zail Singh was playing fiddle to both  Santa Singh of Budha-Dal and the neo-Nirankaris. Only a few days prior, Nirankari gangs had set upon an amritdhari Singh and burned him with acid. The Union took up his case and approached Zail Singh who outright refused to interfere in the matter asserting that Gurbachan Nirankari was a Sant and Sants could not be publicly arraigned and/or criticized. The Union next approached Santa Singh who was, then, based at Bathinda and preparing for his journey to Anandpur Sahib. It informed him that not only were Nirankaris publicly desecrating Gurbani but also attacking Sikhs. Santa Singh, laughed them off, saying that Zail Singh was a hans (pure as swan) and if he believed Gurbachna to be divine then even he-Santa Singh- was ready to conform to the latter. The other Nihang Dals, however, contributed money towards the victim's kin all the while grumbling against Santa Singh's ludicrous rhetoric.  

SNAKES.

 

Santa Singh was excommunicated from the Panth in 1986. 

Baba Santa Singh chose Congress over the panth and had the sewa of Sri Akaal Takht Sahib funded by the same government that had once destroyed it. The true singhs of Guru Gobind Singh Ji Maharaj did not like this cowardly manoeuvre and on 26th January 1986 Sarbat Khalsa, the Jathedar Baba Thakur Singh Ji himself gave the leadership of the Budha Dal to Bhai Amrik Singh Jaura and tied him the dastar. It was also on this day that the sewa of Sri Akaal Takht Sahib was recommenced, but this time entirely by the Saadh Sangat.

 

Santa Singh should have never been Jathedaar again of the Budha Dal even after he came back into the Panth. Todays Dals are in total shambles. 

 

Note. Bhai Amrik Singh Jaura was a Great Freedom Fighter who worked with Bhai Avtar Singh Brahma.

 

 

[ipledgeblue 134]

1 hour ago, s50 said:

Baba Santa Singh chose Congress over the panth and had the sewa of Sri Akaal Takht Sahib funded by the same government that had once destroyed it. The true singhs of Guru Gobind Singh Ji Maharaj did not like this cowardly manoeuvre and on 26th January 1986 Sarbat Khalsa, the Jathedar Baba Thakur Singh Ji himself gave the leadership of the Budha Dal to Bhai Amrik Singh Jaura and tied him the dastar. It was also on this day that the sewa of Sri Akaal Takht Sahib was recommenced, but this time entirely by the Saadh Sangat.

 

http://www.sikhawareness.com/topic/18648-death-of-the-nihangs/?page=6

 

Amritsar, October 7
The ongoing kar seva is unlikely to restore the two-and-a-half-century old ivory mosaic work, ‘gach’, a sort of stone or gypsum priceless murals, naqqashi and paintings, depicting mythological scenes which was destroyed in January 1986 when radical Sikhs pulled down the magnificent structure of Akal Takht following the ‘sarbat khalsa’.

The priceless naqqashi which fell prey to militant diktat 16 years ago was a specimen of excellence attained by Sikh craftsmen. While the craftsmen had dedicated their lives to complete the exquisite art work in the interiors of Akal Takht, the same is none being done in a hurried manner.

Mr Surinder Singh and Mr Satpal Danish — both sons of the late G.S. Sohan Singh, famous fresco artist who had worked for 32 years in Golden Temple — alleged that the art work at Akal Takht was not being done as per the traditional design and technique. They claimed that the present paint and art work being done through kar seva would not last long.

Mr Danish claimed that he was the first person who had objected to the demolition of Akal Takht in 1986, but nobody heeded his advice then. “However, I kept frame-by-frame frescoes and gach work which included paintings of Hindu gods with me,” he said, adding that more than 20 per cent of the craft work of Akal Takht and 60 per cent work of the Golden Temple was done by his grandfather, Bhai Gian Singh, who had devoted his life to this work.

Fresco paintings were introduced by Bhai Kehar Singh under the patronage of Maharaja Ranjit Singh. Today, few artists pursue this ‘Sikh school of art’.

However, Baba Amrik Singh who has been supervising the kar seva being done by Dera Baba Jagtar Singh at the behest of the SGPC said the life of the new technique of naqqashi was more than the traditional one. He claimed that while the old structure of Akal Takht had been demolished and the frescoes and rich art work had disappeared after 1986, it was not practicable to use the ‘traditional technique’ to adorn the interior walls with old frescoes which had disappeared forever. He said the design of Akal Takht had also been changed when the building was reconstructed after 1986.

The historical well, which was got sunk by Guru Hargobind had been included in the spacious building during the earlier kar seva carried out by Damdami Taksal.

Replying to a question about the enamel paint, Baba Amrik Singh said only water colours were being used which did not fade for five years.

Baba Amrik Singh claimed that the fresco work was being done by Mr Harbhajan Singh who had more than 40 years of experience in this field. He said he had done 50 per cent work of retouching the frescoes of the Golden Temple.

The state convener of INTACH, Dr Sukhdev Singh, asked the babas who are carrying out ‘kar seva’ to use old materials and styles, in consonance with what is in the sanctum sanctorum of the Golden Temple.

Experts and knowledgeable persons must be consulted on the issue. He said old blocks of the designs preserved in the archives of the SGPC or in private possession could be of great use. The use of synthetic and bright colours did not reflect the ideology of Sikhism or belong to the Sikh school of art, he said.

 

 

 

[BhForce 1,088]

52 minutes ago, ipledgeblue said:

First, the unnecessary destruction of old aspects of the Akal Bunga is highly regrettable and a big loss for the Sikh panth.

Secondly, if the father of Sobha Singh was responsible for 20-60% of the artwork in Akal Takhat and Darbar Sahib, that means that 20-60% of the work is quite recent, and is certainly not of the period of the 10 Gurus, and possibly not even of the Sikh Raj, right?

Finally, in regards to Baba Santa Singh, would the following suppositions (widely assumed by many Sikhs) be correct or incorrect:

1) Since the Nihangs were not allowed leadership of the Akal Takhat, and the Akali Dal party was in charge of the SGPC, the Nihangs favored Congress, which they thought would give them control over the SGPC/Akal Takhat.

2) When the attack on Darbar Sahib Complex happened, it was seen by Baba Santa Singh as a sign from God, and he was happy about it, since it was the fulfillment of a prophesied event when the control of the Akal Takhat would be returned to the Nihangs.