Forgotten stories of the bravery of the 1.5m Indian soldiers who fought alongside the British in WWI and the racism they faced in the trenche

[dallysingh101]

12 hours ago, 5aaban said:

Village Panjabis who served in the army were generally poorer and didn't own enough land.

There are even British guides on how to recruit them and which ones are better fit for the army according to area! 

"As regards military qualities, it is doubtful whether there is anything to choose between the two. ‘'The Manjha Sikh is as a rule brighter, smart-er, quicker, and more refined than the Malwai, while the latter on the other hand is more stubborn, works quite as conscientiously but less cheerfully

* It may be mentioned, however, that the Sikhs of the country between the Beas and the Sutlej, i.e., Kapurthala, Jullundur, and Hoshiarpur, are generally called Doaba Sikhs. Their  lands are fertile, and they as a rule prefer agriculture to soldiering. This, coupled with ; he fact that their Sikhism is rather lax, renders them, in the opinion of some commanding officers  somewhat inferior as soldiers to the men of the Malwa and the Manjha."

From the "Handbook on Sikhs for the use of regimental officers"

https://ia802901.us.archive.org/19/items/handbookonsikhsf00falc/handbookonsikhsf00falc.pdf

"The men of the Manjha are, by nature, very hardy. Though the average of them is smaller physically than the average of the Malwa Sikhs, they are often met with of very powerful physique, they are very hard and full of work, includes from their antecedents to habits of looting, cattle lifting, and rough play, they are not perhaps so quiet and amenable to discipline as Sikhs of other parts, they can carry great weights and are of a fearless and independent sprit."

"The Manjha recruit will show more coolness and freedom from nervousness..."

"Though comparatively a small tract of country, the Manjha gives more men to service than any other tract..."

"The Sikhs of the Doaba are of a much softer type, they are too absorbed in cultivation, for the Doaba is exceedingly fertile, to have leisure for much else. Their Sikhism is very diluted by Hinduism...In the northern parts of the Doaba, recruits should be very carefully selected, as the quality is very poor"

Great share!

[dallysingh101]

On 7/11/2022 at 6:19 AM, 5aaban said:

Village Panjabis who served in the army were generally poorer and didn't own enough land.

There are even British guides on how to recruit them and which ones are better fit for the army according to area! 

"As regards military qualities, it is doubtful whether there is anything to choose between the two. ‘'The Manjha Sikh is as a rule brighter, smart-er, quicker, and more refined than the Malwai, while the latter on the other hand is more stubborn, works quite as conscientiously but less cheerfully

* It may be mentioned, however, that the Sikhs of the country between the Beas and the Sutlej, i.e., Kapurthala, Jullundur, and Hoshiarpur, are generally called Doaba Sikhs. Their  lands are fertile, and they as a rule prefer agriculture to soldiering. This, coupled with ; he fact that their Sikhism is rather lax, renders them, in the opinion of some commanding officers  somewhat inferior as soldiers to the men of the Malwa and the Manjha."

From the "Handbook on Sikhs for the use of regimental officers"

https://ia802901.us.archive.org/19/items/handbookonsikhsf00falc/handbookonsikhsf00falc.pdf

"The men of the Manjha are, by nature, very hardy. Though the average of them is smaller physically than the average of the Malwa Sikhs, they are often met with of very powerful physique, they are very hard and full of work, includes from their antecedents to habits of looting, cattle lifting, and rough play, they are not perhaps so quiet and amenable to discipline as Sikhs of other parts, they can carry great weights and are of a fearless and independent sprit."

"The Manjha recruit will show more coolness and freedom from nervousness..."

"Though comparatively a small tract of country, the Manjha gives more men to service than any other tract..."

"The Sikhs of the Doaba are of a much softer type, they are too absorbed in cultivation, for the Doaba is exceedingly fertile, to have leisure for much else. Their Sikhism is very diluted by Hinduism...In the northern parts of the Doaba, recruits should be very carefully selected, as the quality is very poor"

Look at this from the same source. The way goray are describing our pendus is exactly like I hear them talking about their pet dogs - seriously! Essentially, they thought of our pendus as slow-witted, docile people. And they've mentioned this a few times in historical sources. That's what the descendants of these people can't face up to. 

 

 

 

[dallysingh101]

Deleted duplicate

 

 

[5aaban]

On 7/15/2022 at 10:04 PM, dallysingh101 said:

Look at this from the same source. The way goray are describing our pendus is exactly like I hear them talking about their pet dogs - seriously! Essentially, they thought of our pendus as slow-witted, docile people. And they've mentioned this a few times in historical sources. That's what the descendants of these people can't face up to. 

 

 

 

Many British books described and classified all people of the subcontinent like animals. 

 

 

[MisterrSingh]

It's interesting to know differences on a purely sociological basis. Our elders make these distinctions (between different flavours of Punjabis, regions, and associated characteristics) all the time in everyday conversations. The British did it from the perspective of classifying their "subjects" for organisation and ruling; we do it for gossip. But i'm sure it's upsetting to see it committed to paper, doubly so when the source is an outsider and not one of your own. It's almost a violation of sorts; a foreigner comes in and coldly analyses and classifies people into ostensibly an animal genus. It is dehumanising but interesting. I've been unknowingly doing something similar for a few years in order to understand Punjabi people and how they tick (as opposed to exploiting them for financial gain).

[dallysingh101]

2 hours ago, MisterrSingh said:

The British did it from the perspective of classifying their "subjects" for organisation and ruling; we do it for gossip.

You probably do. I do it so that I can know what they really think/thought of us outside of blowing flattering hot air up our ar5es (a tactic a certain group seem especially susceptible too). 

2 hours ago, MisterrSingh said:

But i'm sure it's upsetting to see it committed to paper, doubly so when the source is an outsider and not one of your own. It's almost a violation of sorts; a foreigner comes in and coldly analyses and classifies people into ostensibly an animal genus. It is dehumanising but interesting. I've been unknowingly doing something similar for a few years in order to understand Punjabi people and how they tick (as opposed to exploiting them for financial gain).

Well, it's a certain jaat  (very close to home for you) that continually comes up as the docile, dimwittedly loyal, attack dogs. You personally openly personified that mentality on the forum for years. So it's actually exactly people like you they are talking about.  People like me would be too free-minded and free-willed for them to try and box up like this. 

Rural mentalities have some things going for them, but as we can see, from a more sophisticated, devious communities perspective, it looks like they are looking at lesser developed animals. And one big way goray screwed our community was to put these lesser developed creatures into seats of Sikh power. That probably explains our continual slide over so long, that's continuing to this day.   

[MisterrSingh]

I especially like to analyze Tarkhans. They're very interesting.

[dallysingh101]

9 minutes ago, MisterrSingh said:

I especially like to analyze Tarkhans. They're very interesting.

Must push your cognitive levels to their upper limits when doing so. 

We can see what these goray really thought of your lot now. Anyone with a brain would find it condescending - but that's the issue, you need half a brain to have a chance to even remotely grasp things with some degree of objectivity. 

http://i.imgur.com/DumeT59.gif

 

 

Shake your head about and shake off the colonial propaganda. We're in the 21st century now. 

[dallysingh101]

[dallysingh101]

British general and scholar Lieutenant-General Sir George MacMunn (1869–1952) noted in his writings "It is only necessary for a feeling to arise that it is impious and disgraceful to serve the British, for the whole of our fabric to tumble like a house of cards without a shot being fired or a sword unsheathed". To this end, it became British policy to recruit only from those tribes whom they classified as members of the 'martial races', and the practice became an integral part of the recruitment manuals for the Army in the British Raj. According to Dr. Jeffrey Greenhut, "The Martial Race theory had an elegant symmetry. Indians who were intelligent and educated were defined as cowards, while those defined as brave were uneducated and backward." 

 

The British regarded the 'martial races' as valiant and strong but also intellectually inferior, lacking the initiative or leadership qualities to command large military formations. They were also regarded as politically subservient or docile to authority.  For these reasons, the 'martial races' theory did not lead to officers being recruited from them; recruitment was based on social class and loyalty to the British Raj.  

 

http://gopalakri.blogspot.com/2012/12/martial-race.html