Shall we start s debate on Christianity?

[dallysingh101]

10 hours ago, GuestSingh said:

do u happen to know why ਲ in its original, native form as a retroflex sound (in some dialects before 18th century) eventually became the english 'l' we know and use today? is there actually any historical evidence of whitey/muslims attempting to distort any of the sounds in our panti akhar? and should we really be pronouncing ਲ as used in previous times in our speech today? tried with a few words and it sounds more authentic and natural imo..and it still requires a tough jaw that makes our maa boli special..but u really don't seem to hear it anymore although some words are spelt with it e.g. goli.

and does any of that also explain why weve lost/changed our original and native 'throaty' ਹ? cuz it is or sounds farsi/arabic in origin? we know language evolves and always will but if these sounds were even close to what guru sahibaan used e.g. in their bani, then we should be making an effort to revive and recreate them dont u think? gurbani would be more shudh uchaaran too....

Look you have to factor in regional Panjabi dialects and the way indigenous Panjabis (nonmuslim ones anyway) adapt foreign loan word sounds - often to remove the harsh guttural phonemes. The word khyaal is a great example. Muslims often pronounce it with the throaty guttural 'kh' emphasis of the original pronunciation, Panjabi Sikhs have softened it. It's differences like this (which seem obvious to me) that makes me wonder how some apneean get conned by sullay into thinking they are apnay. But maybe it's because I can be a bit nerdy when it comes to things like that sometimes and pick them up? But we have to be careful now, not to give any devious tonday tips on how to improve their 'act' so I won't talk about it any more. Suffice to say - I often hear a big difference between how sullay talk Panjabi and how we do. Remember they are brought up learning Arabic and I believe pronounce some loan words closer to the originals pronunciation than us, who parse the words  because the original way sounds harsh to us. 

Also, our Gurus were well aware of this difference in regional pronunciation - we get umpteen variations (in spelling) of words in Gurbani for instance. 

With the Lalla. I think some words are pronounced with the retroflex and some not. That Lalla pairh bindhi is a new introduction to cover the difference because it wasn't around when I was a kid learning Panjabi. 

[Guest GuestSingh]

9 hours ago, dallysingh101 said:

It's differences like this (which seem obvious to me) that makes me wonder how some apneean get conned by sullay into thinking they are apnay. But maybe it's because I can be a bit nerdy when it comes to things like that sometimes and pick them up?

how many of em know or even bother to converse in panjabi anyway? apne especially in the uk who can speak it seem to much prefer using the corporate and soulless tongue of whitey....why?

if we're talking about grooming 'victims' then its fair to say many if not all probably aint been taught it so that thats not completely their fault...but then even if they were taught, how many girls seem to lose all sense of logic/intelligence and that 'awareness' (not nerdiness) after falling in 'love'?

and then lets think about if they even could speak it, u can imagine a dirty groomer paedophile $ulah slipping up on certain words and an apni laughing it off if the excuse was 'oh im still trying to learn the language' or 'oh ive got a cold/flu' etc... it sounds plausible in their mind cuz they aint as studious as some apne about these things....

With the Lalla. I think some words are pronounced with the retroflex and some not. That Lalla pairh bindhi is a new introduction to cover the difference because it wasn't around when I was a kid learning Panjabi. 

it is new since it was added in the mid-1900s and its also a native sanskrit sound so it wouldve been around in earlier/older panjabi - it would be good to know exactly when and why it started to lose its importance and change in pronunciation but not researched this too much myself so its probably already been explained somewhere....

 

[Guest]

On 2/10/2019 at 12:59 PM, dallysingh101 said:

You seem to have more language skills than most here. 

What do you make of Brij Bhasha? How does the language of DG strike you in this respect, especially in terms of vocabulary? 

I have not read all of Sri Dasam Granth sahib. So can't comment. 

*EDITED*

Brij Bhasha is a beautiful language as evidenced by works of Dasam pita.

The modern day "bhojpuri" spoken by some north indians  is a cheap relative of Brij . 

Jaap sahib has no parallel ! and same can be said of other prominent baanis of Dasam guru. 

[dallysingh101]

On 2/15/2019 at 1:38 AM, GuestSingh said:

how many of em know or even bother to converse in panjabi anyway? apne especially in the uk who can speak it seem to much prefer using the corporate and soulless tongue of whitey....why?

 

and then lets think about if they even could speak it, u can imagine a dirty groomer paedophile $ulah slipping up on certain words and an apni laughing it off if the excuse was 'oh im still trying to learn the language' or 'oh ive got a cold/flu' etc... it sounds plausible in their mind cuz they aint as studious as some apne about these things....

Using English as a primary communication medium is not a surprise to me. The younger generation wouldn't have the experience many (if not most?) of mine did, where parents/uncles/aunties didn't really speak English too well and most conversations were in Panjabi. They all have uncles, parents, aunties who are fluent English speakers too now.  Plus, you have to acknowledge the Panjabi vocabulary the ahhm bundha learns is severely limited in comparison to English. It looks like even the average adult indigenous Panjabis has a vocab range that equates to a 6/7 year old in English. I spent years trying to increase my Panjabi vocab so I could converse more meaningfully with my mother (amongst other things), but found that to have been wasted in that respect because they didn't know the words themselves. Recently I met some apnay who were graduates from back home and tested their Panjabi vocab - and even theirs was limited. What's that telling you? 

It's been proven that the language and range of expression contributes heavily to a person's cognitive abilities. If we've raised up kids with a very limited range in this respect - maybe this contributes to their cluelessness? I've taught and tutored lots of young kids and I have to say, a lot of apneean kids seem a bit guileless compared to others (say black girls or sulliyan).  

 

Quote

if we're talking about grooming 'victims' then its fair to say many if not all probably aint been taught it so that thats not completely their fault...but then even if they were taught, how many girls seem to lose all sense of logic/intelligence and that 'awareness' (not nerdiness) after falling in 'love'?

 

 

That losing your head when you feel a strong physical attraction to someone, or they fill some perceived need for attention is biologically based. Lots of blokes go through it as well. But we don't have groups of women looking to systematically abuse blokes like some men do to loved up, clueless girls. 

The most powerful thing to effect girls behaviour is peer pressure. I notice other communities kurian form tight groups. Apneean don't. They usually feel over the moon to be accepted by another peer group, who then influence them in various ways, often encouraging them to do things that probably ain't in their best interests given the rampant predatory and promiscuous behaviour out there. 

[dallysingh101]

8 hours ago, AjeetSinghPunjabi said:

I have not read all of Sri Dasam Granth sahib. So can't comment. 

*EDITED*

Brij Bhasha is a beautiful language as evidenced by works of Dasam pita.

The modern day "bhojpuri" spoken by some north indians  is a cheap relative of Brij . 

Jaap sahib has no parallel ! and same can be said of other prominent baanis of Dasam guru. 

I think we need a strong emphasis on Brij Bhasha amongst young apnay now. There appears to be a lot o secret strategic/political stuff in DG. Plus we have loads of puratan stuff (like Suraj Prakash Granth) in this language. 

We need a Gurmukhi- Brij Bhasha dictionary. Mahan Kosh can help in this but we need a full one. Transliterate existing ones from Devnagri to Gurmukhi etc. 

[Guest GuestSingh]

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[Guest GuestSingh]

On 2/17/2019 at 12:59 PM, dallysingh101 said:

Using English as a primary communication medium is not a surprise to me. The younger generation wouldn't have the experience many (if not most?) of mine did, where parents/uncles/aunties didn't really speak English too well and most conversations were in Panjabi. They all have uncles, parents, aunties who are fluent English speakers too now.  Plus, you have to acknowledge the Panjabi vocabulary the ahhm bundha learns is severely limited in comparison to English. It looks like even the average adult indigenous Panjabis has a vocab range that equates to a 6/7 year old in English. I spent years trying to increase my Panjabi vocab so I could converse more meaningfully with my mother (amongst other things), but found that to have been wasted in that respect because they didn't know the words themselves. Recently I met some apnay who were graduates from back home and tested their Panjabi vocab - and even theirs was limited. What's that telling you?

they have no idea how so blessed they are to have it as their maa boli - theres an endless amount of of treasure i.e. knowledge to be gleaned from katha/dhadi/books/historical manuscripts/granths/rehitname etc.

do u really consider ur efforts to have been in vain considering the amount of translation work youve been able to do? would u  even be who u r here without that love to have taken it further?

It's been proven that the language and range of expression contributes heavily to a person's cognitive abilities. If we've raised up kids with a very limited range in this respect - maybe this contributes to their cluelessness? I've taught and tutored lots of young kids and I have to say, a lot of apneean kids seem a bit guileless compared to others (say black girls or sulliyan).  

academically or in general? maybe they just struggled with a certain subject? what do u teach? guessing english language?

imo all these girls are strongly likely to be exposed to similar environments/experiences in some way either back home or outside in school/work? so what else could make certain apniaan 'special case' i.e. childlike/dumb? r u just being harsh and expecting more from em? perhaps older generations still expect their kids to be 'streetsmart' and learn for themselves in order to be 'modern'/'progresive' or how they once had to do when young?

a lot of our older generations and young ones now too still cant strike even a reasonable balance between when to keep things simple and when take it further for already well-known mental, physical and spiritual benefits...so a lazy/laid-back lifestyle especially with strong new/modern panjabi culture is surely bound to influence and dumb down the kid in some way even with own personality....that must be a main cause? itd confuse any other kid let alone ours.

you know when we look at the life dasmesh pita ji...each skill/ability helped with at least one if not two or even three of mental, physical and spiritual benefits at the same time...but a lot of us still wanna live like whitey and complain about life...

the teacher has already set the example yet we still fail to learn and pass the tests thatll always come our way...

That losing your head when you feel a strong physical attraction to someone, or they fill some perceived need for attention is biologically based. Lots of blokes go through it as well. But we don't have groups of women looking to systematically abuse blokes like some men do to loved up, clueless girls.

difference is us blokes can snap out of it and not dwell too much whereas women just seem to obsess and obsess and what can appear like selfishly enclosing themselves in a bubble and just shut off from the rest of the world without thought for anyone or anything else...dunno what goes on in their head of theirs but just how unloved and unworthy does someone have to feel to do that?

anyway, they say a woman can talk to a man, stare at another and think/dream about someone else completely all at the same time....so lets leave that there.

The most powerful thing to effect girls behaviour is peer pressure. I notice other communities kurian form tight groups. Apneean don't. They usually feel over the moon to be accepted by another peer group, who then influence them in various ways, often encouraging them to do things that probably ain't in their best interests given the rampant predatory and promiscuous behaviour out there. 

this has gotta come from parents/family relatives/friends in either having bad experience growing up and leaving a bad impression on all of us or just feeling the need to also have 'status' and show-off/impress others?

 

[dallysingh101]

8 hours ago, GuestSingh said:

they have no idea how so blessed they are to have it as their maa boli - theres an endless amount of of treasure i.e. knowledge to be gleaned from katha/dhadi/books/historical manuscripts/granths/rehitname etc.

do u really consider ur efforts to have been in vain considering the amount of translation work youve been able to do? would u  even be who u r here without that love to have taken it further?

I think I maybe didn't express myself clearly here. I was just talking about how increasingly my vocab didn't help with bettering my relationship with certain family members - in that I thought being able to articulate my feelings more accurately would help. 

I don't think learning and improving my Gurmukhi language skills has been in vain at all. It's been majorly transformative to my life (for the better). In terms of knowledge and identity, it's taken me to a place I never knew before; given me knowledge and experiences I would not have been able to obtain otherwise. There is a LOT hidden from us that we discover, especially since the dominant Singh Sabha lehar of the last century felt compelled to hide quite a lot of stuff from the masses for whatever reason (come on, it was under the political/cultural influence of the colonialists at the time). 

I honestly can't figure out why anyone who has a genuine affinity with their faith/culture wouldn't want to do it themselves? But then I know that in certain respects I have been blessed in that I can study, I don't have any known learning difficulties and have always enjoyed reading since I was a child. It was a feeling that I was very proficient in English and needed a bigger challenge that played a big (but not only) part in my focusing on developing my Gurmukhi skills. It was like: "Well, I can read this Charles Dickens (and other) stuff even most English people around me seem to struggle with, and I love it. I wonder what is in my own culture?" Coming from a humble background made me feel that our culture (and consequently language) was somewhat simple and unsophisticated. If I didn't go through all the effort to improve my Gurmukhi and study, I'd still be under that illusion. What I've learnt from this is that our people have largely jettisoned our true, sophisticated, challenging, intellectual, literate culture - as given to us and developed by our Gurus (especially in the Dasam Granth) and early Singhs - and replaced it with the most base, simpleton facade of a 'culture' (and I use that word very loosely here!) that could only turn us into 1diots. And it shows, especially to outsiders...... and this explains A LOT of our problems. 

Quote

academically or in general? maybe they just struggled with a certain subject? what do u teach? guessing english language?

Nah, it's been science and maths. I couldn't teach English. By guileless I meant socially. Girls who struggle academically seem to get serious self-esteem issues and then turn on themselves and convince themselves they are stupid - and start playing up to this. But you can make big changes to this if you get to intervene early enough, and if the kids learning obstacles aren't too big. 

 

Quote

imo all these girls are strongly likely to be exposed to similar environments/experiences in some way either back home or outside in school/work? so what else could make certain apniaan 'special case' i.e. childlike/dumb? r u just being harsh and expecting more from em? perhaps older generations still expect their kids to be 'streetsmart' and learn for themselves in order to be 'modern'/'progresive' or how they once had to do when young?

I think a lot of the girls are really closeted, and infantilized by their parents (a LOT of boys are too actually - puppoos). A lot of the conservative families are really....how can I put it.....bland. It's not really stimulating. To put it bluntly, the kids seem lulloofied compared to others. They just want to seem to belong and be accepted all the time - whilst other more streetwise kids couldn't give a toss. 

Even the mouthy girls, who go on like they have some strong personality - don't have real street acumen and are usually the first to end up with some tonday or whatnot. Guys pick up on their inflated egos and manipulate them - and it has to be said - Jut girls are the worse at this - I think it's because their egos have been blown out of proportion from all the buckwaas they hear from their families about how great they are. Also, instead of trying to form strong bonds with other apneean of other jaats in groups, they often try and exclude them or demean them, which starts messing with those girls self-esteem. So it's self-perpetuating. 

All of these girls seem totally unaware of the predatory nature of many males, and how other communities commonly try and  compete and try and undermine each other - especially through females. Other girls seem more clued up about this aspect of social interaction and are wary about it. If one girl in group is wandering, the others pull her back in and prevent her doing a sl@ggy move.   

 

Quote

you know when we look at the life dasmesh pita ji...each skill/ability helped with at least one if not two or even three of mental, physical and spiritual benefits at the same time...but a lot of us still wanna live like whitey and complain about life...

the teacher has already set the example yet we still fail to learn and pass the tests thatll always come our

 

I keep saying it but people don't want to hear it. I do believe it's because rural simpleton barn-dance culture has been made to replace all the sophisticated, social, political, military, spiritual stuff in the Dasam Granth or say Prem Sumarag. I think that was one of the points of these granth - to make us not like exactly how we are today. I think the promotion of that simpleton culture itself has its antecedents in the colonialist period, where goray (for obvious reasons) where very keen to have Singhs move away from the self-empowering, militant faith of Sikhi and have them working on farms (which made a fortune for goray). A sort of facsimile of Sikhi called Sikhism, which is nothing like SIkhi outside of superficial external appearances - was promoted instead. That thing is weak and has all manner of outside protestant, casteist, racialised, victorian prudery embedded within. 

 

Quote

 

difference is us blokes can snap out of it and not dwell too much whereas women just seem to obsess and obsess and what can appear like selfishly enclosing themselves in a bubble and just shut off from the rest of the world without thought for anyone or anything else...dunno what goes on in their head of theirs but just how unloved and unworthy does someone have to feel to do that?

anyway, they say a woman can talk to a man, stare at another and think/dream about someone else completely all at the same time....so lets leave that there.

 

CP in DG says something like that. That loved up women are unable to tell what is good for them and what isn't. Women are intrinsically emotional and 'relational' creatures. Feeling something that makes them feel warm, loved and fuzzy inside is like crack to a crack addict to them. Men of other cultures know this, and know how to fake that bond with these girls to reel them in. Our lot routinely go like lambs to the slaughter to this. Again it's that social lullooness. It looks like it stems from infantilizing and having a serious taboo about sexual matters in our community to me? And this prudishness is obviously not part of Sikhi because look at CP! Older apneean don't help either. You'd have thought that they would have been at the forefront of preparing young girls for the world in these matters, but I don'tr know what buckwaas preoccupies their heads to the extent that they totally forget to do this? Probably to busy thinking about the shiney shoes and suits they want to buy for the next wedding they are going to or something? 

 

Quote

this has gotta come from parents/family relatives/friends in either having bad experience growing up and leaving a bad impression on all of us or just feeling the need to also have 'status' and show-off/impress others?

That's all its dwindled down to right now. Showing off. Being an an egotistical bubble whilst all manner of evil crap is surrounding and trying to eat away at your community. Apathy on a community level. And that rural caste thing of status  and petty one-upmanship on each other plays a big part in this too. People need to keep it real and face up to these things or we'll never deal with them. 

 

[Guest GuestSingh]

1 hour ago, dallysingh101 said:

I think I maybe didn't express myself clearly here. I was just talking about how increasingly my vocab didn't help with bettering my relationship with certain family members - in that I thought being able to articulate my feelings more accurately would help.

got u bro.

I don't think learning and improving my Gurmukhi language skills has been in vain at all. It's been majorly transformative to my life (for the better). In terms of knowledge and identity, it's taken me to a place I never knew before; given me knowledge and experiences I would not have been able to obtain otherwise. There is a LOT hidden from us that we discover, especially since the dominant Singh Sabha lehar of the last century felt compelled to hide quite a lot of stuff from the masses for whatever reason (come on, it was under the political/cultural influence of the colonialists at the time). 

I honestly can't figure out why anyone who has a genuine affinity with their faith/culture wouldn't want to do it themselves?

think it really comes down to our own individual personality - we feel way more 'sensitive' than others to our identity..our current environment..certain experiences and exposures..stuff that dont actually 'fit in' with our own thinking from young?

from my own experience, feeling alone and isolated from all of it with no interest from family to reconnect to any of it growing up only served to invoke an interest thats manifested itself into a passion of mine...the absolute uniqueness in sikhi and our history man...there just aint anything else like it - at least thats how it feels for myself.

But then I know that in certain respects I have been blessed in that I can study, I don't have any known learning difficulties and have always enjoyed reading since I was a child. It was a feeling that I was very proficient in English and needed a bigger challenge that played a big (but not only) part in my focusing on developing my Gurmukhi skills. It was like: "Well, I can read this Charles Dickens (and other) stuff even most English people around me seem to struggle with, and I love it. I wonder what is in my own culture?" Coming from a humble background made me feel that our culture (and consequently language) was somewhat simple and unsophisticated. If I didn't go through all the effort to improve my Gurmukhi and study, I'd still be under that illusion.

noticed some older ones who wanna learn gurmukhi e.g. reading gurbani seem to struggle a bit with motivation - its as if they think learning it is either just too difficult to learn and understand or its a chore that wont be worth it in the end when they could be doing other things that brings satisfaction in the 'here and now' more quickly...the english translations dont help at all - rather theyre taking us away from the true meaning but for some reason its not seen like that in the mainstream - its deemed 'good enough'...but the fact is it aint good enough...its laziness to move beyond whats 'expected'.

learnt it in a week myself after watching the 5-day crash course from sangat tv and it never felt like a chore or hassle - more like fun and very enjoyable...but thats only cuz of my deep interest/love/passion about something thats felt hidden away just as u mentioned....

What I've learnt from this is that our people have largely jettisoned our true, sophisticated, challenging, intellectual, literate culture - as given to us and developed by our Gurus (especially in the Dasam Granth) and early Singhs - and replaced it with the most base, simpleton facade of a 'culture' (and I use that word very loosely here!) that could only turn us into 1diots. And it shows, especially to outsiders...... and this explains A LOT of our problems.

keeping up with society is the only thing on their minds...and when ur comfortable and content in life then nothing else matters - we've lost the old and current generations so the questions gotta be how do we get the younger ones interested in learning and keeping their minds stimulated while kaljug takes more of a hold and gets worse more slowly?

Nah, it's been science and maths. I couldn't teach English. By guileless I meant socially. Girls who struggle academically seem to get serious self-esteem issues and then turn on themselves and convince themselves they are stupid - and start playing up to this. But you can make big changes to this if you get to intervene early enough, and if the kids learning obstacles aren't too big. 

I think a lot of the girls are really closeted, and infantilized by their parents (a LOT of boys are too actually - puppoos). A lot of the conservative families are really....how can I put it.....bland. It's not really stimulating. To put it bluntly, the kids seem lulloofied compared to others. They just want to seem to belong and be accepted all the time - whilst other more streetwise kids couldn't give a toss. 

theyre not given any trust, confidence or self-worth growing up so they learn the hard way and even then theres never any guarantee they'' realise cuz one wrong mistake and theyre gone forever - and thats coming from personal experience.

Even the mouthy girls, who go on like they have some strong personality - don't have real street acumen and are usually the first to end up with some tonday or whatnot. Guys pick up on their inflated egos and manipulate them - and it has to be said - Jut girls are the worse at this - I think it's because their egos have been blown out of proportion from all the buckwaas they hear from their families about how great they are. Also, instead of trying to form strong bonds with other apneean of other jaats in groups, they often try and exclude them or demean them, which starts messing with those girls self-esteem. So it's self-perpetuating.

agree with all of that and seen it in my own family...theyre no doubt masters of being fake and easily putting on an act when needed as 'protection' from the world and to fool whoever they like cuz deep down they still feel vulnerable and like a scared, little girl..the danger, as u say, is that it can only go so far within its limit until its smashed to pieces.

and they definitely feed on praise to boost their ego - from my experience it comes from those who expect it cuz they did the same things too and cuz its what everyone else does...again if ur achieving what society sees as 'successful' then other opinions/insights no matter how full of obvious fact and wisdom just aint deemed good enough, relevant or important to em. more fool them.

I keep saying it but people don't want to hear it. I do believe it's because rural simpleton barn-dance culture has been made to replace all the sophisticated, social, political, military, spiritual stuff in the Dasam Granth or say Prem Sumarag. I think that was one of the points of these granth - to make us not like exactly how we are today. I think the promotion of that simpleton culture itself has its antecedents in the colonialist period, where goray (for obvious reasons) where very keen to have Singhs move away from the self-empowering, militant faith of Sikhi and have them working on farms (which made a fortune for goray). A sort of facsimile of Sikhi called Sikhism, which is nothing like SIkhi outside of superficial external appearances - was promoted instead. That thing is weak and has all manner of outside protestant, casteist, racialised, victorian prudery embedded within.

remember reading an old post of yours that asked how do we get ourselves out of this comfort zone were now buried in...cuz thats what were up against now - its just easy for folk to live a cheap and tacky lifestyle than it is to live in a bit of pain and make difficult choices...even when health dangers and benefits are presented and widely acknowledged, no-one wants to change their ways - it also goes against the deeply-ingrained and almost indelible thought of 'status'...the younger generations will have to realise this and act.

CP in DG says something like that. That loved up women are unable to tell what is good for them and what isn't. Women are intrinsically emotional and 'relational' creatures. Feeling something that makes them feel warm, loved and fuzzy inside is like crack to a crack addict to them. Men of other cultures know this, and know how to fake that bond with these girls to reel them in. Our lot routinely go like lambs to the slaughter to this. Again it's that social lullooness. It looks like it stems from infantilizing and having a serious taboo about sexual matters in our community to me? And this prudishness is obviously not part of Sikhi because look at CP! Older apneean don't help either. You'd have thought that they would have been at the forefront of preparing young girls for the world in these matters, but I don'tr know what buckwaas preoccupies their heads to the extent that they totally forget to do this? Probably to busy thinking about the shiney shoes and suits they want to buy for the next wedding they are going to or something? 

or watching bollywood dramas on tv or maybe too much gossiping/focusing more attention on what others do than their own...

seriously its not just the mothers but fathers too and thats why its never gonna make sense in my mind - if u really loved ur child and have their personal health, well-being and welfare at heart then why aint u taught em about the world and not to make the mistakes that others have made and keep making today? it goes beyond obvious and common-sense - from the outside it looks like they care dont at all...and then they cry/contemplate suicide when the inevitable happens....this might sound harsh but dont really have any sympathy for em - ur children r ur blood, ur legacy...u show them the way on land that aint what u were brought up on as a kid....

That's all its dwindled down to right now. Showing off. Being an an egotistical bubble whilst all manner of evil crap is surrounding and trying to eat away at your community. Apathy on a community level. And that rural caste thing of status  and petty one-upmanship on each other plays a big part in this too. People need to keep it real and face up to these things or we'll never deal with them. 

theres no community spirit until something happens in ur own home - thats when they wake up and realise but until then its all just 'fun and games' among our own.

 

[dallysingh101]

On 2/20/2019 at 5:33 PM, GuestSingh said:

think it really comes down to our own individual personality - we feel way more 'sensitive' than others to our identity..our current environment..certain experiences and exposures..stuff that dont actually 'fit in' with our own thinking from young?

from my own experience, feeling alone and isolated from all of it with no interest from family to reconnect to any of it growing up only served to invoke an interest thats manifested itself into a passion of mine...the absolute uniqueness in sikhi and our history man...there just aint anything else like it - at least thats how it feels for myself.

Yeah I think individual differences play a big part. Our conception of identity. What resonates with us. I mean you can get brothers brought up in the same household who have completely different worldviews. 

What I found was that when I was younger, it was the stirring narrative of our history that made me proud to be Sikh. Later, in my 30s, I suddenly realised that behind all the macho warrior stuff was something else. Sikhi. The meditation, prayers, the high culture (with its high ethics) that our Gurus developed and passed to us. 

It's actually really useful, to destress and centre ourselves, especially if we've had 'colourful' pasts and upbringings.

Just out of interest (I'm presuming you're 3rd generation?), why do you think your parents were indifferent to passing on your heritage to you?

On 2/20/2019 at 5:33 PM, GuestSingh said:

remember reading an old post of yours that asked how do we get ourselves out of this comfort zone were now buried in...cuz thats what were up against now - its just easy for folk to live a cheap and tacky lifestyle than it is to live in a bit of pain and make difficult choices...even when health dangers and benefits are presented and widely acknowledged, no-one wants to change their ways - it also goes against the deeply-ingrained and almost indelible thought of 'status'...the younger generations will have to realise this and act.

I think many of the younger generation are realising this. Okay, not enough, but from my perspective a lot has been achieved. Seeing my grandparents generation who were largely illiterate, and seeing youngsters today reading Gurbani and ithihaasic texts and translating and discussing them is a great thing. Seeing a lot of social issues finally being addressed is a great thing too. Yeah, people still stick their heads in the sand like ostriches, but slowly and steadily we'll change that.