Am I without Guru??

[rKr]

A little bit of advice, guidance please my piyari sangat ji.

This may seem silly and although I have tried to ignore it, I must say that for the past week a few things have been laying heavy on my heart.

It was New Years eve night, when I was at the Gurudwara Sahib that I got embroiled in a bit of a heated discussion with a Singh sahib who I have known for a very long time.

We were discussing Khalsa Raaj – and I advised him that we need to be the Khalsa before such raaj can happen – I personally could not even call myself an iota Khalsa, so how I expected Raaj was beyond comprehension.

I continued my conversation with Singh Sahib and said that having walked off the path of Sikhi when studying, I was just happy to have been accepted back by Guru Ji – knowing that it took just that one step from me, and Guru Ji walked those thousands of steps towards me.. I was so grateful. I had started back on the path of Guru Ji, and hoped that I too would be showered with the blessing or Amrit..

Anyway, Singh Sahib was unwilling to listen to me, and talked about that fact that I had not taken Amrit – by this I was quite shocked, he told me that I was unable to make any comment to him, and he was an amritdhari sikh, and I was nothing. I then proceeded to ask him about the time he came to take Amrit, and the fact that he was once like me also.

He told me that nothing matters – not the fact that I do my nitnem, go to the gurudwara or do any seva. He said none of these things are important if you have not taken Amrit. He believed that simply wearing the 5 gifts of Guru Sahib is enough.

I advised him that Amrit is a gift – the panj piyare did not take amrit and

neither did Guru Gobind Singh Ji – The panj piyare were given amirt by Guru Sahib, and Guru Sahib by the panj piyare –

gun gwvq qyrI auqris mYlu ]

ibnis jwie haumY ibKu PYlu ]

hoih AicMqu bsY suK nwil ]

swis gRwis hir nwmu smwil ]

Cwif isAwnp sglI mnw ]

swDsMig pwvih scu Dnw ]

hir pUMjI sMic krhu ibauhwru ]

eIhw suKu drgh jYkwru ]

srb inrMqir eyko dyKu ]

khu nwnk jw kY msqik lyKu ]7]

Chanting His Glories, your filth shall be washed off.

The all-consuming poison of ego will be gone.

You shall become carefree, and you shall dwell in peace.

With every breath and every morsel of food, cherish the Lord's Name.

Renounce all clever tricks, O mind.

In the Company of the Holy, you shall obtain the true wealth.

So gather the Lord's Name as your capital, and trade in it.

In this world you shall be at peace, and in the Court of the Lord, you shall be acclaimed.

See the One permeating all;

says Nanak, your destiny is pre-ordained. ||7||

Gauri Sukhmani m 5 289

When I will be given Amrit is already known by Guru Sahib, and only then will I be blessed with it. Until that moment, I am nothing, I know nothing.

Singh Sahib then finished with, “until the moment you take Amrit, no matter how much you pray, how many times you visit a Gurudwara or how much seva you think you do – you’re niguri”- Without Guru.

He said that I would never have the love of Guru Sahib like he does and that I had no Guru. I was without the love of Guru…

Now of course, even thou this comment cut through my like nothing had before, a part of me couldn’t help but feel a world of sadness… is this really the case? Coming from someone who has such great destiny and has given their head – it must be?

Is this all just a ploy for me to feel like I am walking a path? Am I truly without a Guru?

I’ve been unable to do my ardaas properly all week, and feel a fraud.. I’m in need of guidance… can you help? :wub:

[anjaan]

Vaheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!

Vaheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

wow. that is quite shocking! mmmmm i dont feel fit 2 comment now cus im not amritdhari myself yet but what i will say is that, in my opinion, this singh is kinda like on his high horse...end of day there are different 'stages' of being a Sikh i believe such as kesh dhari and amritdhari, i guess ur perhaps at the keshdhari stage now? whereby wit Guru ji's kirpa n God's hukam u will receive the gift of Amrit and too become an amritdhari sikh, i see it as though we are workin 2 change ourselves from manmurk to Gurmukh, for some people this change may hav already occured whilst 4 some it may be later, i really dont think u shud take it 2 heart, let it not knock your faith or belief or love, everything that you do and say matters, ur nitnem ur seva ur simran ur actions, everythin u do is being accounted 4....from what i can tell ur doing good......jst keep urself on that path......mmmm i hope this helps!

[Balait_da_Sher]

I also feel that the Amritdhari singh in this case is displaying a lot of hankar. A sikh should have a neeva mun, in another words a sikh should be humble.

To me sikhi is like a course that we study, Guru is the teacher we are the students. One can not study advance subjects like Amrit etc unless he/she has taken the prerequisits of naam simran and earnt the right to wear the 5k's.

What i am saying is exactly whats posted above by Anjaan that Sikhi is all about indvidual development. you cant jump right to the top without completing the stuff at the bottom.

Dont be disheartened by other people's comments, you have a guru and they love you for who you are and what you will be :TH:

[Singhstah]

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

THAT IS SO WRONG, GUROO SAHIB IS FOR EVERYONE NO MATTER WHAT RELIGION

[sevak]

veerji you keep on doing what you doing veerji.. don't pay attention to any one but guru ji

[ms514]

Sat Sri Akal:

Well, both of you have a point...but you friend seems to display a lot of ego. First of all, enrolling in the school of Khalsa by taking Amrit does not imply automatic graduation. Just as one must work hard, stay focused and disciplined to their syllabus, a Khalsa student must also work hard, stay focused and disciplined to Gurbani and their Rehat. Only then, if Dean Akal Purakh has bestowed mercy shall one achieve the degree of mukhti upon graduation, in which your mind will be one with the Dean itself....

However, one can only call themself a student of that school if they enroll by taking Amrit. You can attend all the classes and meet the pre-requisites, but until you pay the admission fee of your head to the Dean, you are not enrolled and therefore not part of the Khalsa school. That enrollment process of Amrit is your application form that must be accepted by the Board of the Panj Pyare for admittance to the Khalsa school, without which you are not enrolled. Your friend is indeed a student of the Khalsa school, but that does not mean that he is exempt from receiving a failing grade in Humility 101.

So yes, you are indeed without a Guru (in the Indian tradition of the Guru - Student relationship, the student committed an "entrance fee" to the teacher...for a Sikh, that is their head) until you have been admitted into that Khalsa school. However, rather than be all depressed about it, it should provide more incentive to join the Khalsa family. Don't be down...be motivated!!!

[SarabLoh]

He told me that nothing matters – not the fact that I do my nitnem, go to the gurudwara or do any seva.

every bit of nitnem, seva or good deed u do... does count ..... and ur friend is full of ego

but there is a limit to the spirituality u can have .... only amrit can break that limit

Dharey Kes Pahul Bina Bhaikhee Moorakh Sikh" ~ Guru Gobind Singh Ji Maharaj

"One Who Keeps Hair Without Taking Amrit Pahul Is a Fake and Stupid Sikh"

BHUUL CHUUK MAAF

[H4RPAL]

I think it is people like your friend who do much damage to Sikhi regardless of their own spiritual accomplishments and the like. It is such people who create divisions between Amritdharis, and non-Amritdharis rather than working to bridge such differences with a view to then helping others onto the path they have been allowed to find with the grace of Waheguru. I cannot see that your friend has done anything constructive here, and he should be reminded that not only does a Sikh have a duty to become Amritdhari, but also has the duty to help others become Amritdhari, not push them away when they are heading in the right direction.

Just my thoughts! :nihungsmile:

[H4RPAL]

Also, do not worry about your good deeds not mattering, they always matter. If nothing else, remember they will at laest help you in your next lives if you fail to achieve mukti on this instance of incarnation. Remember the words of Sri Guru Nanak in the Jap Ji Sahib-

karmi aavai kapra, nudri mukh duaar.

Your good deeds will in this way, at the very least earn you material things in the next life, although as the secoind part of this quote says, it is only with the Grace of Waheguru that salvation can be achieved, and the gate of the master can be reached.

[lakhvir]

WaheguruJi Ka Khalsa. WaheguruJi Ki Fateh.

One who follows the teachings and instructions of the Guru is a Sikh. Part of those teachings include Amrit. If we become selective of what instructions to follow and what not to, then we cease to be the Guru's Sikhs. We only dwell in manmat when we forsake Gurmat.

As a Sikh who is discovering (or rediscovering) the path to the Guru, even our smallest steps are recognised and recorded by the Him. If one is dedicacted to the path of the Guru, one will not hestitate to do all that the Guru instructs. Once we are on that sure path of Sikhi, an understanding will come where the Amrit is recognised as a vital tie to the Guru - which proves our dedication and ulitmate love for the Guru.

When we do prepare for war, we are indeed soldiers. But only those are the true brave who step up into the battlefield. Amrit is the entry to the battleground where the soldier utilises all the knowledge bestowed and earned through the Guru.

Please do not be discouraged by anyone who says that you are not a Guru's Sikh if you are not Amritshak. Forgive those that say things to hurt you, and instead pray for humility in all, including ourselves. Only then can we hold the blessings of the Guru.

As long as what you do (paath, simran, seva, sangat) is bringing you closer to the Guru, and is done in sincerity, humility and patience, nothing goes wasted. If we can do all that and know that it is true that nothing we do in love for the Guru goes wasted, then verily, one must not hestitate to accept and beg the Guru's Amrit.

You are blessed. The Guru is ever with you. He resides in those souls who nuture love and sacrifice for t

he Guru.

WaheguruJi Ka Khalsa. WaheguruJi Ki Fateh.