A Question

[PSD]

some interesting points made below. vaheguru

lol calm down calm down mate! if you cant take a bit of humour and sarcasm then you really need to learn how debates work!

my point stands, did bhai gurdas ji preach the mantar to the people of the country. the people he preached to were not at the times sikhs of the guru. by learning about gurbani and vaheguru, they would have gone on to become sikhs of the guru. so very clearly guru ji and the parcharks told the world about the might and power of the mantar vaheguru so that people would repeat it and find akal purkh.

you say

at amritsanchars we get the naam introduced to us but even this isn't the actually naam that mahraj wants us to experience

yes so... what point are you trying to make? the discussion is about the mantar 'VAHEGURU'. You clearly have said that while we recieve this mantar, there is still more to it then that, the extra elements of bhagti and self relalisation and the powers that come from these, but the mantar itself is out in the open.

who is complaining about things being kept gupt? we are saying that this mantar is NOT gupt and that maharajh introduced it to save the world. i think you are getting your wires crossed.

ill speak with all the childish comments i like, thats my choice, ill even add some sense in them ifi choose to. show me where anybody has stated that by taking amrit alone you will get to sachkhand or become one with akal purkh?

we all know that there are many many mnay additional things you need to do after taking amrit, nobody is debating these! and yet are these things that you have mentioned gupt... no i dont think they are. gupt is somethig that is kept secret, nobody knows about it, or hears about it, but the thinsg you have mentioned are right here!! they are not gupt, its just we are blind and our eyes are closed to them. just because we havent reached the level of aath pehar avasta it doesnt mean its a secret, how can it be when guru ji has told us about it in gurbani. our guru is most compassioante and dayaloo he has given us everything and told us everything. whether we take it on borad or not is our own choice. guru ji has given us everything we need to merge with akal purkh.

and the points are made still stand valid. if vaheguru mantar was to e kept a secret, why did guru ji put it in the fathe, in gurbani and why is it in bhai gurdas jis varran?

thank you

o and phenji, please dont even go into the discussion about secret methods and ways of doing bhagti. theres loads ok. just leave it at that.

The word and mantar it self is there agreed for the world, but daas was talking on another level sorry for the mistake.

Waheguroo ji ka khalsa, waheguroo ji ki fateh!

[`KuMi´]

do you even know what were discussing here? you seem very lost?

Tel a goreo on the street the word waheguroo does that mean there ego has gone and now they will be able to reach sachkand.

maybe, maybe not? who are you to say? have you reached that level of kamai that you can say what power gurbani has or does not have? who are you to judge the shakti of the shabad Vaheguru?

what if you read the whole of guru granth sahib ji to somebody, and lets says 'nothing' happened, does that mean all of gurbani should/is gupt to!?

re-read the thread, i think youv gotten lost in there somewhere.

I think what Pwalla was talking about was the Gurbanee Tuk 'Vaheguroo Gur Mantar Hai, Jap Houmai Koe'.

Its true though, these things should be kept gupt, or otherwise who knows. But AK-47, if you dont think we should keep it gupt, Why do we have a Pehardhaar with a Buddi Kirpaan at an AmritSanchaar, if we shouldn't keep these things gupt we should have all doors open.

Just a thought? or is it?

In my opinion the personal repetition of gurmantar should be kept gupt, bhai gurdas makes it clear also that one should keep their bhagti gupt to aid the progress of their avastha. Secondly the technique for naam should be kept gupt as it is described in sau sakhi. And in addition, naam can only be given by satguru, so it would not be possible for a human to give Naam. So in my opinion although the gurmantar is not strictly 'Gupt' to openly show it is not helpful for ones Jeevan. The quote referring to Baba Nanak in Kaljug means that the Satnam mantar (Gurmantar) is available for all who wish to take amrit (Charan Pahul or later khanda da pahul)

[Guest Papi]

Its true though, these things should be kept gupt, or otherwise who knows. But AK-47, if you dont think we should keep it gupt, Why do we have a Pehardhaar with a Buddi Kirpaan at an AmritSanchaar, if we shouldn't keep these things gupt we should have all doors open.

Just a thought? or is it?

repetition of gurmantr should be kept gupt, as revealing it induces ego in ones' self, which destorys all kamai.

also, kumi, the reason we have a pehradaar at amrit sanchar is not cause its suppose to be gupt, its so ensure that no ones comes in and causes a disruption or chaos while amrit sanchar is going on. in india, amrit sanchaar's are also done outside sometimes, they aren't confined to a room.

vaheguru is guru's mantr, as bhai gurdaas ji says. and i think its clear from that tuk that just as guru nanak (waheguru) was/is/will always be, gurmantr is also forever. and just like guru nanak was PRAGAT jot of waheguru, waheguru is PRAGAT mantr

listen to katha of giani thakur singh ji at gurmatveechar.com about mool mantr, it'll help answer the question.

[rupinder singh]

me cant get my head around the gupt aspect! how can sumthing be gupt if we already know about it?

[AK-47]

me cant get my head around the gupt aspect! how can sumthing be gupt if we already know about it?

exactlly!!!

guru ji made it blatently obvious to us, so how can we still be saying no no keep it a secret keep it gupt/secret! guru nanak dev ji is said to have gone through 36 jhugs of tapasiaa in order to get the vaheguru mantar, and being so merciful he gave it to us.

and kumi how does an amrit sanchar have anything to do with whether the vaheguru mantar is a secret or not? the mantar is in gurbani, anyone can read gurbani and hear it. anybody walking into the gurdwara will hear the fateh and hear it, so how on earth is the mantar itself secret!?

as brother has said, you keep your bhagti to yourself, its liek that to keep your hunkar down, otherwise you get people who brag about how long their amritvela is and how much abhiyaas they do etc, and hunkar will drag them down. the techniques chalo whatever you say, you think there is one super duper technique, i think there are loads. i would suggest that as you only believe in one technique that this is then the ONLY technique you should use as all others are false.

but moving on, guru sahib has given us so much, but like fools we dont relaise its wealth.

alsoi think a lot of people are getting confused between vaheguru mantar and 'naam'.

[jassa]

they say only 5 peyare can pass u gurumantra .... it will not show kalla till its given to u by guru when u sit in front of them punj peyare and say make me a sikh ... they they gave u amrit and gurumantra .... thats why its called gurumantra ... given by guru sahib ....