New Article: Bibek

[Demonic Warrior]

I also dont accept it.

I dont feel it, i think of it as a little bit superstitious.

Can anyone give quotes from Guru Granth Sahib with page regarding this.

Firstly, your mind will not want to accept this fact. Secondly, Guru Granth Sahib Ji says bebek is a must - the shabads are in the article, are you blind! THE PROOF IS THERE!! PUT YOUR GLASSES ON!

DONT PRACTICE IT IF YOU DON'T WANT TO, BUT DON'T QUESTION GURU JI'S REHIT AND CHANGE IT FOR YOURSELF!!

Heres a few out of the many in Gurbani:

igRih swkq CqIh pRkwr qy ibKU smwn ]2]

grihi saakath shhatheeh prakaar thae bikhoo samaan ||2||

The thirty-six tasty dishes of the faithless cynic, are just like poison. ||2||

Guru Arjan Dev Ji

Raag Bilaaval

811

Another,

iDRgu Kwxw iDRgu pYn@xw ijn@w dUjY Bwie ipAwru ]

dhhrig khaanaa dhhrig painhanaa jinhaa dhoojai bhaae piaar ||

Cursed is the food, and cursed are the clothes, of those who are attached to the love of duality.

Guru Amar Daas Ji

Raag Prabhaatee

1347

Another,

nwnk ij nwmu n cyqnI iqn iDgu pYnxu iDgu Kwxu ]1]

naanak j naam n chaethanee thin dhhig painan dhhig khaan ||1||

O Nanak, those who do not contemplate the Naam, the Name of the Lord - cursed are their clothes, and cursed is their food. ||1||

Guru Amar Daas Ji

Raag Sorath

646

Another,

ijs qy aupjy iqsih n cyqih iDRgu jIvxu iDRgu KweI ]1]

jis thae oupajae thisehi n chaethehi dhhrig jeevan dhhrig khaaee ||1||

He does not even think of the One, from whom he originated. Cursed is his life, and cursed is his food. ||1||

Guru Raam Daas Ji

Raag Malaar

1265

And many many many many MOOREEEEE!!!

THe shabads above say that the one who does not worship God has a cursed life and whatever he touches is cursed. Only one who is spiritually blind won't take it literally when so many Saints in the past have practiced it; few are Sant Narajan Singh Ji, Bhai Sahib Randhir Singh Ji, Bhai Jeevan Singh Ji, Bhai Fauja Singh, and especially GURU JI THE MASTER OF THE SAINTS.

[ocelot]

But it did not say eating with such person you loose your Kamaee.

I just dont get it, if i say that in langer there can be many wrong people, is eating with them have any influence on your Kamaee? food can be made and served by bad guy or made from money devoted by some murderer.

How can one know or finds if other is good or bad, so which food to eat.

If one accidentally eat then is it sin :D

Is it sikhi?

How many such guys will you actually find in this world.

Is this mean that a person jaap naam lives accordingly and accidentally eats food of a bad guy losses all his kamayee, do you really feel it.

Regards

[Gurbar Akaal]

Demonic Warrior you quoted

naanak j naam n chaethanee thin dhhig painan dhhig khaan ||1||

O Nanak, those who do not contemplate the Naam, the Name of the Lord - cursed are their clothes, and cursed is their food. ||1||

Does this mean Sikhs cant wear clothes which are made by non Sikhs?

[Guest Narinder Singh]

I got one word for all this...BHAMANWAAD!

This has no place in sikhi, so saying its a "sikh" practice is an insult to my guru.

Fateh.

[Singhni MiriPiri]

Gurbar Akaal,

This article is not regarding what clothes we wear.

Ocelot,

I just dont get it, if i say that in langer there can be many wrong people, is eating with them have any influence on your Kamaee?

kuVImwr msMd jo mIxy kw pRswid ley ju ien ky hwQ kw jnm gvwvih bwd]20]

kurreemaar masa(n)dh jo meenae kaa prasaadh leae j ein kae haathh kaa janam gavaavehi baadha||20||

Do not eat food made by those who are excommunicated from the Panth The life of those who take from their hands will go avail.

Rehatnama Bhai Desa Singh

kbIr swkq sMgu n kIjIAY dUrih jweIAY Bwig ]

kabeer saakath sa(n)g n keejeeai dhoorehi jaaeeai bhaag ||

Kabeer, do not associate with the faithless cynics; run far away from them.

bwsnu kwro prsIAY qau kCu lwgY dwgu ]131]

baasan kaaro paraseeai tho kashh laagai dhaag ||131||

If you touch a vessel stained with soot, some of the soot will stick to you. ||131||

food can be made and served by bad guy or made from money devoted by some murderer. How can one know or finds if other is good or bad, so which food to eat.

Bhai Sahib Randhir Singh jee used to eat only from Bibeki Amritdharis but he has written that the minimum bibek required in Gurmat is eating from amritdharis. Eating from non-bibeki amritdharis is acceptable and the minimum bibek required. There are two levels of bibek, the first one is eating from other Amrit Dharis who wear 5 kakaars, abstain from 4 bujjer kurahits. The second, higher level of bibek is to only eat from other Bibekis. In Bibek you use only raw materials like sugar, flour, grains, vegetables and salt etc. If someone can do more, that is far better. The whole idea is to do what you can. Anything processed in any form shouldn't be consumed. Therefore, there is no way one can accidentally eat from a bad guy.

[Guest Akirtghan]

Use your "bibek budhi"...do a research on Rehitnameh's written by Gursikhs from Guru Gobind Singh Maharajs time.

Guru Sahib says in Gurbani:

kabeer saakat sang na keejee-ai dooreh jaa-ee-ai bhaag.

Kabeer, do not associate with the faithless cynics; run far away from them.

baasan kaaro parsee-ai ta-o kachh laagai daag. ||131||

If you touch a vessel stained with soot, some of the soot will stick to you. ||131||

The article above just says a Rehitvaan Gursikhs should not consume food prepared by a NIGURA(faithless cynic)....

BUT...

In the Gurbani line above Guru Sahib clearly say we should not even do the sangat of a NIGURA...

So you will show this attitude>>> <<< to Guru Sahib too?

Guru Sahib clearly says in the line above that we should stay away from NIGUREY/SAKATS...

taking food prepared by such people is just out of the question.

dont put words in my mouth, when did i say the ENTIRE article was wrong

i'm not gonna bother debating about this, you have your views i have mine. i would just like to point out that taking literal translations of gurbani should be avoided at all costs. bibek is required, no doubt, but when you use literal translations to prove that guru granth sahib ji says it is required, thats not right.

what do you make of this tuk? try to go deeper than what the literal translation says :nihungsmile:

PrIdw mnu mYdwnu kir toey itby lwih ]

fareedhaa man maidhaan kar ttoeae ttibae laahi ||

Fareed, flatten out your mind; smooth out the hills and valleys.

AgY mUil n AwvsI dojk sMdI Bwih ]74]

agai mool n aavasee dhojak sa(n)dhee bhaahi ||74||

Hereafter, the fires of hell shall not even approach you. ||74||

mhlw 5 ]

mehalaa 5 ||

Fifth Mehla:

PrIdw Kwlku Klk mih Klk vsY rb mwih ]

fareedhaa khaalak khalak mehi khalak vasai rab maahi ||

Fareed, the Creator is in the Creation, and the Creation abides in God.

mMdw iks no AwKIAY jW iqsu ibnu koeI nwih ]75]

ma(n)dhaa kis no aakheeai jaa(n) this bin koee naahi ||75||

Whom can we call bad? There is none without Him. ||75||

[B4ND4]

In Bibek you use only raw materials like sugar, flour, grains, vegetables and salt etc. If someone can do more, that is far better. The whole idea is to do what you can. Anything processed in any form shouldn't be consumed. Therefore, there is no way one can accidentally eat from a bad guy.

Sugar, flour aren't raw materials madame. The best would be to grow everything ourselves as the veggies, grains and salt are handled by the people who aren't amritdhari and most prolly are smokers.

[Singhni MiriPiri]

In Bibek you use only raw materials like sugar, flour, grains, vegetables and salt etc. If someone can do more, that is far better. The whole idea is to do what you can. Anything processed in any form shouldn't be consumed. Therefore, there is no way one can accidentally eat from a bad guy.

Sugar, flour aren't raw materials madame. The best would be to grow everything ourselves as the veggies, grains and salt are handled by the people who aren't amritdhari and most prolly are smokers.

If someone can do more, that is far better. The whole idea is to do what you can since it is not possible for everybody to go that far.

[B4ND4]

If someone can do more, that is far better. The whole idea is to do what you can since it is not possible for everybody to go that far.

Totally agree with you.

If someone does less doesn't mean he is a not a sikh. Circumstances can't be ignored and as you stated its not possible for everybody to go that far.

[AK-47]

agree with akirtghan, while bibek is fine and good, some of the translations used to back this argument probably need to be understood a bit deeper then purely the literal meanings.

as gurbar akal points out ..

O Nanak, those who do not contemplate the Naam, the Name of the Lord - cursed are their clothes, and cursed is their food. ||1||

while the original thread is not about clothing, by posting this literal translation and using it to argue that eating food from such people is wrong ... you must accept that wearing clothes made from such people is also wrong.

i am aware that there are some singhs who do in fact make their own clothes. so again its not a big deal. but please as singh has said, dont just think because the line has the word 'eat' or 'food' in it that it means what u think it does!

for example, the story given about draupadi in duryadons court. when i read that the saint says 'my mind became clouded by darkness as i had eaten at duryodans house' it doesnt neccisarily mean that his mind went dark cus he had eaten dal and roti! i would think that it to mean that he had taken many favours from duryodan, that he had been entertained and kept there, that he had been treated as a guest there etc. and that having recieved all of these favours and gifts etc, he could not stand up and oppose him for his wrong deeds. in modern day terms it would be like 'i couldnt skank him after i chilled with him and he did me all these favours'.

of course i could be totally wrong, and his mind may have gone dark cus there was too much mirch in the dal (joking)! but from what i have been told 'to eat with someone' in gurbani often means 'to keep their sangat', in some cases at least.

but yeh bibek is great, but think before using translations to back a point ... it can often make a strong and valid point become weak.