Preethams Sweet Centre

[sikh_youth_uk]

Sometimes, we get things like samose and barfi from them because they are pure veggie.

Yeh but sikhs can eat meat as long its not made via ritual means.

[rupinder singh]

I dont want to make this an namdhari debate, if my post did, this wasnt intention. Before i cut and paste few points i manage to point out earlier in observation regarding namdharis. I genuinely want to point out bibek/suchmta namdharis beleive in is same than bibek tapoban or akj follow up, soo much so i wouldnt be commiting mistake if i say they even follow more bibek than tapoban or akj. How do i know this? I have a namdhari freind, who took me his house as a tour to clear up mis conceptions. He showed me via history/pratically they do full ishnan including kesi ishnan 3 am in the morning, also use sand to enhance their suchmta. Their nitneem is of das granthi- 5 regular banis along with sri akal ustat, ugardanti, chandi di //, shabad haazarie patsah dasvian, bachitar natak.

Few misconceptions hope to clear way-

people make it sound they deliberatly change the history same hinduphobia/rss the fact rss wasnt even there that time when they happen to misinterpret the history. on the issue of sri guru gobind singh ji disappearing- i genuninely think this beleif sir guru gobind singh ji being aloop was common around that time sri guru gobind singh ji did not hide but went Aloop(gupt) and people had no doubts that sri guru granth sahib ji was given gurship in hazoor sahib, sri guru gobind singh ji body being aloop it orginally came from nander, where still there is still an beleif in hazoor sahib ji- nobody could find sri guru gobind singh ji pavitar sirar, its was aloop, this account is very common within sachkhand hazoor sahib, there was angeeta(pyre) but body was not found.

Now issue sri guru gobind singh ji coming back as in baba balak singh ji. thats one major/twisted misinterpertation.

I dont think this beleif sri guru gobind singh came as baba balak was an act of person to cause divisions within panth, i dont think this was malicous act but an honest misinterpertations of people which turned into firm beleif now. You know if 100 people call false- true, they geniunely started thinking that as a gospel truth, same deal here.

Its a major misconception that they do beadhi of sri guru granth sahib ji- shabad guru, they may not follow 100 percent outer parkash maryada(which is sad because they used to in all namdharis gurdwaras) but regardless gurbani is on their lips both gurbani from sri guru granth sahib ji and sri dasam granth sahib ji. I dont find anything wrong with their emphasis more on shabad guru than physical form of guru. After all our main aim is to merge with nirankar with shabad guru.

What is bani?

Sri guru maharaj says:

Vaho Vaho Bani Nirankar Hai ||

Shabad Guru Surat Dhun Chela

They fully beleive that bani is only link with Nirankar. All their nitneem, naam simran all comes from sri guru granth sahib ji and sri dasam granth. They fully beleive in concept of shabad guru.

Even physical form of guru which is physical sri guru granth sahib is there to show you inside essence which is shabad guru. I dont have problem with them putting more emphasis on shabad guru which they do in their daily nitneem and monthly akhand patts. Only problem i have and i will ever have with namdharis is the sri gobind singh ji successcor lineage issue- i firmly beleive sri guru gobind singh passed his gurgaddi to sri guru granth sahib ji but they do otherwise, and i respect their beleif, leave that differences aside like all the other samparda's do and live like brothers.

Looking at the sad state of affairs right now modern days groups rejecting dasam bani, bhai gurdas ji varan , bhagata di bani, samparda's, doing nindya of real sants.. I appreciate namdharis more than them for keeping traditions alive along with nihangs and nirmale. Traditions like- Sri dasam granth akhand patt, gurmat sangit maryada, shastar vidya, observing strict daily maryada.

I do agree with namdhari gurmat sangeet have hindu classical music influence however this still does not negate- puratan reetiyan, promotion of classical instruments they have perserved seena-basina and they also beleive in nam dritha concept.

my 2nd post on namdharis:

I fully beleive in that, baba ram singh ji ji wrote letters that said that he was not a GURU, but you have to remember, all the great mahapursh from namdhari samparda they dont consider themselves Guru poran Avtar unlike radhaswami guru who twist gurbani to suit their own needs (eg- anand sahib puri on sant sajan bhai sarsaie ) or mock amrit sanchar intiation, or mock sri guru gobind singh potrait by sobha singh.

Namdharis fully beleive in shabad guru in tri form- aad guru granth sahib, sri dasam granth, sri sarbloh granth and dont have any their rest of guru's writing nor their claim that is gurbani but anmol bachan. Radhaswamis have pick and choose gurbani to suit their own needs(they claim guru amar das ji refered to their dera- sarsa in anand sahib), they add their guru's writing and claim it gurbani, they are simply creationg of arya samajis, in this regard- namdharis are far better more align with samparda's than radhaswamis who are heretic group.

- Namdharis follow strict amrit vela maryada, akhand patt maryada both sri guru granth sahib ji and sri dasam granth sahib ji, all are strict keshadaris, whereas radhaswami don't since they pick and choose from idealogy of sikhs.

- Namdharis traditions seems more consisent from their guru's to guru's than radhaswamis, traditions like- gurmat sangeet reetiyan going back to guru sahib time, naam dridh akhand patt of sri guru granth sahib ji, sri dasam granth sahib, chandi di // pats. Radhaswamis traditions gets changed as soon they have new guru.

- Namdharis have amrit sanchar intiation with panj singhs giving amrit and gupt naam which is vahiguroo anyway no mixture of mantars like radhaswamis pick one from gurbani and rest add their own, mix khalsa intiations and add their own- recent-pink sarbat which was outrageous too see.

- Namdharis especially their guru's in bhaini sahib had sri guru granth sahib ji fully parkash, i saw that picture myself which my freind showed, satkar was fully given, they all matha taik to first their guru then shabad guru because for them their guru is their ishat dev, gurbani is shabad guru in tri form.. i really wish all the namdharis gurudwara should have parkash of sri guru granth sahib as bhaini sahib, as i saw myself in the picture.. i am willing to even scan picture if people like to see.

- Namdharis as a group have always sided with khalsa panth from the history with an exception of 1984 time, they have always sided with sarbat khalsa- attain shaheediya read their history, help implement sgpc maryada which many sikhs followed, namdharis were invited along with nirmal, udasi, nihang, taksali , akj to implement an maryada. All the takth jathedars along with most sampardava's- nirmal/nihangs/udasi/sevapanthis, master tara singh, sri singh sahib yogi bhajan, bhai avtar singh ji raagi also have immense respect for namdharis. Sri hazoor sahib jathedar had immense respect for baba ram singh ji namdhari.

Namdharis are not heretic far from it, true they have innocently little misguided on lineage issue in my view, everything else they do, beleive, read, interact with is very much sikhi.

In essence, i would request others to follow singh 132 advise not to eat out at all, having moderate level of bibek as jaigaso is beneftical but personally since i eat out, I would without question go to namdhari resturants than going to gorreh resturants, we people have an tendency of assuming just because that person is gorrah/kala , we assume they are christian, therefore in beleif system, they might be atheist or Satan Worshippers for all you know which is even worst as gurbani points nirguraie ka hai naam boora. how do you justify your bias approach then?

yes yes yes namastang and we can make everything sound so wonderful by replacing the sat guru ram singh ji mahraj with baba ram singh namdhari. now it's all acceptable....yep yep.

[N30S1NGH]

yes yes yes namastang and we can make everything sound so wonderful by replacing the sat guru ram singh ji mahraj with baba ram singh namdhari. now it's all acceptable....yep yep.

for me he was baba(wise man), even hard core fanatics in the panth respect baba ram singh ji and parchar of sikhi when he was alive, resistance against british and his shaheedi, what you on about mate?

[Mehtab Singh]

I've heard they do keshi ishnaan twice a day, amritvela as well as before before evening paath. When I told my parents I am gonna cook my food myself they thought I had become Naamdhari.

[jss]

japmans and singh132's point about naamdharis claiming to be sikhs is not a very good one.

how so?...we have singhs who think eating meat is okay...they still claim to be sikhs...

we have a whole jatha that believes in a different kakkar from the rest of the panth....they still claim to be sikhs...

we have a jatha that has it in their maryada to not kill a cow....they still claim to be sikhs...

point is....we have A LOT of differences among jathas in our own panth....we have people who say that if you don't have dasam granth parkash as well as sarbloh granth parkas at your amrit sanchar, then your amrit is not valid....

every jatha thinks its their way or "you're not following gurmat"

soo many different concepts and interpretations...who made who the right one??????

and sarbloh said..that the naamdharis have affected the panth....

all i got to say is take a look around our houses, our gurughars....look at the mess our panth is in....none of that has anything to do with naamdharis....it's our OWN panth's leadership that is messed up...the SGPC is probably more anti panthic than any of these other organizations...

people will say...oh at least everyone believes in guru sahib as guru. therefore we're more panthic than the naamdharis...i think that's a farce...NOBODY believes guru granth sahib is guru...RARE are those GEMS, MAHAPURKHS...who actually believe that....if people believed it...why would thay have parkash in their houses, and still fight....why would gurdwara committees not allow samagams to take place, why would they be soo concerned about booking as many marriages as possible...why would people FIGHT with each other in their Guru's presence??? why would akal takt not allow bibiaan to do kirtan at harmandir sahib??? MOST of the issues that face the sikh panth today is that we have given ourselves this false sense of piety just because we matha tek to guru ji...or we have nice rumallay for guru sahib...and we do parkash everyday...therefore...we must be shardalu sikhs of guru sahib....

but our daily actions, the daily actions of the masands that have taken over the gurdwaras and say who can sing guru sahibs bani and who cant, what about those jathebandis that make websites and TWIST guru sahib's pavitar bani to push their particular rehit maryada (ie...using "meh gur mil ooch dumalra" as a way of pushing keski)....

we only exhibit such selfish, such bemukhi, behaviours if we don't actually have that respect for guru sahib in our hearts...all the outer showing of respect are useless when there is no inner respect...BOTH are NEEDED...

lets look at ourselves, look at our jathebandis, look at our own panth before we go pointing fingers elsewhere...

[chatanga]

at the end of the day , eat where you think youre lifestyle or beliefs will ot be affected. there ay no right or rong answer here. use common sense ok?

also to the person who started this thread. I want to ask if you were drowning in a river or something and the only people who could help were naamdharis , would you even bother? or would you drown so you know you would get to sachkhand becuz the shadow of a naam dhari never fell on you?

i aint no supporter of naamdharis. they is a bit messed up methinks , but they are nowhere as bad as the others rada swamis, darshan darsis etc.

get a grip of yourself.

[smartsingh24]

It is practically impossible to be bibek in western countries because of the modern advent of grocery chains. The same shops that take in vegetables and fruits take in other products like meat, and it's doubtful that the handlers would seperate the two, use gloves for one and not the other, and make sure that one never touches the other. Short of actually growing your own food (which is hard because you need farm land; not something that's readily available in western countries), you're left with the options of moving back to India where you can grow your own stuff, not eating anything at all, or accepting the predicament you're in, and doing the best you can do with what you have. In the end, who are we to say that we shouldn't eat at this person's place or that person's place because of who they are or what they believe, when the majority of food we're eating comes from people we don't know, who could be a million times worse? Now past hard evidence that these people are continually supplying their guru with money to convert and spread propoganda, is it that bad to eat at these people's shops?

[PAL 07]

YOU SHOULDNT BE EATING FROM ANY SHOPS......... JUST EAT WITHIN YOUR HOME OR GURU KA LANGAR

[Mehtab Singh]

YOU SHOULDNT BE EATING FROM ANY SHOPS......... JUST EAT WITHIN YOUR HOME OR GURU KA LANGAR

And how do I get the stuff that I am meant to cook? How and where do you get stuff for langar?

[Heera Singh]

maybe u shud buy 10 acres of land and start farmin.. so u can feed everybody here :D