Krishan Is Called An Insect In Sri Dasam Granth

[Matheen]

this much I can gather from responses by various members and some external reading from internet sources.

Forget learning from internet forums or internet sources. If you want to learn the truth about the Sikhi that GUru Ji revealed, then the only reliable sources are Guru Granth Sahib Ji, Sri Dasam Granth, Sarbloh Granth, Bhai Gurdas' vaaran. For the non-religious development, historical books like Suraj Parkash, etc are very useful.

Satpunga- the Maryada at Hazur sahib has been inluenced by local customs, so it isn't faultless.

The Maryadas of our traditional groups e.g Damdami Taksal, Nihang Dals, Bhai Daya Singh Sampardas etc are very similar with minor differences. Their interpretation of Scripture is identical.

The reason for vice in Punjab, or anywhere else, is ignorance. Most of the people who engage in crime haven't got a clue about Sikhi, or any other dharm.

What weird sanatanic or Aghori rituals do traditional Sikhs engage in?

By the way, the Singh Sabha actually fought against the British, rather than work with them. The British had control of most Gurudwara since the 2nd Anglo-Sikh wars up to the Singh Sabha movement.

[Nehmat]

Yes the word ਕੀਟ means insect, but that does not necessarily mean that Krishna is being called an insect.

ਕਿਤੇ ਕ੍ਰਿਸਨ ਸੇ ਕੀਟ ਕੋਟੈ ਬਨਾਏ ॥ ਕਿਤੇ ਰਾਮ ਸੇ ਮੇਟਿ ਡਾਰੇ ਉਪਾਏ ॥

Another POSSIBLE translation may be that just as God has made many many insects he has also made many many Krishna's.

He made Krishnas, He also made many insects. Yes, this makes much more sense.

So basically, Maharaj Ji is telling us that God is capable of making 'anything' of any size, shape, or form.

Thank you TUBELIGHT!

You know, you sound like a cute little kiddie in your posts

I was going to say a cute little girl, but then I would have gotten hate mail in my Inbox. Not just any hate mail, SS style hate mail Oh wait I said it anyway...hmm...chalo I'll make sure I keep a bucket of freezing cold water handy when I read the hate mail.

Hah! SS style hate mail? :lol:

Nahin Ji, I don't hate anyone. No matter what happens.

Freezing cold water? Whoa... What's the evil plan here? :umm:

A kiddie? Seriously? Oh thats why... this one person never takes me seriously, 'unless' they say they want to. Gee... :rolleyes:

[jassa]

Here kalgidhar pita is doing upma of akal purkh ... read the whole tukk ... atleast one page before and one page after ... and read it with copen mind ... in his bani guru sahib did upma of akal purkh ... but they also have respect for avtars as well the respect which ever individual should have for avtars and prophets of other faiths ...

looking at the specific lines guru sahib called krishna a worm when they are doing upma of alakpurkh ... this is more a comparison of krishna an avtar and akalpurkh ... in comparison to akalpurkh everyone is a worm sant mahatams papi bhagats hindus muslims who is not a worm in front of akalpurkh ??? ... even in bachitar natak guru sahib called whose ever worship him will go to narak ... thats guru sahib when they compared themself to akalpurk ... try and understand what guru sahib is saying ...

when guru sahib did upma of an avtar they even called ram katha jug jug atal ... and before people start abusing me with stuff like guru sahib never did upma of avtar ... in chaubis avtar katha guru sahib wrote i m not writting katha because i follow them but because they have same jyot of akalpurkh ...

respect and worship is different ...

guru sahib worshiped only akalpurkh

guru sahib respected all

guru sahib sees everyone nothing more then dust in front of akalpurkh ...

but where are sikhs going ... we are forgetting the meaning of akalpurkh yet we claim to worship him ...

we dont even respect religious people from other religions ... when we see a hindu with a big tilak ... a muslim with a white topi or a christan with a big cross ... we started fearing in our minds ... he is here to harm sikhi only...

we see our family sant mahatams or our jathedars no less then akalpurkh ... i belong to abc jatha or dera or gurudwara or political party or what ever and my jathedar is no less then akal purkh ...

[Sukhdeep Singhh]

you see, many names have different meanings in sikhi. e.g. brahma is a name for the hindu diety AND for God. as is vishnu, as is Shiva. Shiva is used for God in a passage from Chandi Charitra, Sri Dasam Granth Sahib Ji; Deh Shiva Bar Moh Ehe...

here Guru Gobind Singh Ji is asking God in his warrior aspect, as Shiva in Indian history is a personicication for a warrior. hence the diety Shiva who too is a warrior.

Mahakaal is a name for shiva, but also a name for God. Mahakaal meaning the Great Death. relating to shiva as being the mythological "destruction of the world", as a name for God, as being the destroyer of EVERYTHING.

in Sri Sarbloh Granth there is a quote "Mahakaal Jagdees Hai, Sarbloh Avtar" meaning that Mahakaal (God) is the creator of the world (jag-world, dees-creator), and his form is of sarbloh (pure-iron).

Yes, I thought so too.

but what I understand from this is that the Nihangs practice a more puratanic form of Sikhism, which veers away from the more modern form of sikhism which was established after the 'Tat Khalsa' movement which grew in the patronage of British. So the group that went with mainstream Sikhism began to develop a silent or rather unspelt animosity with the Nihangs and the Udasis who were considered more pro-sanatanic and which directly derived vocabulary and inspiration from the dharmic-lexicon ?

It is also fascinating for me personally to note the large extent to which the british penetrated the Indic society and how the vestiges of their rule haunt us to this day. If the Mughals were purely barbarity, the British were barbarity mixed with deep cunning and manipulation of human psyche to meet their own ends. Truly they set out and screwed the country nice and proper.

And this ego clash within Sikhism between the sanatanics and the modernists is what is breeding the anti-Hinduism because the Sikhs as a community can't settle this amongst themselves since they can't raise their sword against brothers. It is weakening it from within.

this much I can gather from responses by various members and some external reading from internet sources.

indeed you have done you research.

wha is now collectively known as "mainstream sikhi" is what was created by the SGPC (Singh Sabha). to actually encounter a tangible existance of the puratan snatan sikhi you will have to venture to Sri Hazoor Sahib Ji. here the original maryada is preserved, much to the unliking of the Tat Khalsa of Punjab.

for more reference on this, invest in a book called "In The Master's Presence, the Sikhs of Hazoor Sahib". in this book there is the complete history of the true snatan sikh maryada which has been carried out since the time of Guru Gobind Singh Ji.

Lol, slaughtering Animals, performing Aarti, worshipping Babey. This is what you call puratan Sikhi? Are you a chela of Niddar?

If you want to see the true side of Sikhi go to Sri Harmandir Sahib. Home of celesital shaheeds that protect Gurmat Maryada.

Langar is only prepared by Amrit Dharis, whole complex is packed with sevadars doing seva 24/7. Naam Simran /Gurbani going on through out the day. That is true Sikhi which is based on Seva, SImran, Sadh Sangat, and Sacrifice. Not a sacricing an innocent goats head to please Shiva, Durga or whatever Hindu God.

[jassa]

Langar is only prepared by Amrit Dharis

*edited* we have forgotten ... food becomes langar only when its offered to guru sahib ... and any one can do seva in langar ... i have seen many sikhs of a specific jathebandis not even eating langar even at gurudwaras they are proud not to eat in gurus pangat and walk away ... they are more worried about who prepared it instead of its sheet parshad of guru ... no matter how big tapasvi rehatvan amritdhari sikh is he cannot prepare langar without guru sahib ... and no matter how big papi the cook is when his prepared food is offered to guru sahib and later mixed with other food and distributed to sangat its now gurus food ... far better then any other food in this world and independent of who prepared it ...

sorry for going of topic ...

this is what i think sorry if i offend any one

[Inder Singh]

Raju is just spoiling this thread with his RSS views about how Britishers and the singh sabha movement abrahamized sikhi.

its a fact. read the history. singh sabha (SGPC) were a british backed organization, started to dilute the strength in history. when the singh sabha to over Takht Sri Akaal Bunga Singh (Akaal Takht), "master" Tara Singh threw Sri Dasam Granth Sahib Ji out of the window onto the Parkarma, shouting "now you dirty dogs can take your filthy book with you".

singh sabha along with the british introduced the view of superstition into sikhi aswel, and shanka on baani.

but this is all for another topic.

Master Tara singh did nothing like that. Dasam granth was in parkash at akal takhat till 1942.

It was reoved in 1942 when Mohan singh was presiden of SGPC and also akal takhat jathedar.A

Thee was akhnad path Dasam granth at akal takhat and then it was removed.

[apnepart2]

Inder Singhji can you please specify if Krisna is being refered in the context of insect/worm or servent?

[apnepart2]

* ਕਿਤੇ ਕਿਸਨ ਸੇ ਕੀਟ ਕੋਟੈ ਉਪਾਏ, ਉਸਾਰੇ ਗੜੇ ਫਿਰ ਮੇਟੇ ਬਨਾਏ॥

* He hath Created millions of Krishnas like worms. He Created them, annihilated them, again created them, again destroyed them.

uh. sorry just found it.