Jakara

[Suman]

Hi again...

This is a reply to 'daasn daas'...

I think that was exactly the point that I wished to make when you said: "Hmmmmm..... i have never seen anyone dance for the sake of dancing. Expecially not in the punjabi culture, where all the songs that r danced on have all wrong meanings to it. Look at what all songs are saying, LOve this guy, Dump This Girl, Look at this girls hips, look at that guys chaal....i mean ok just look, who would be not dancing without any bad intentions involved."

We live in a society where everything is really messed up and I don't think anyone actually truly remembers God when dancing to music with lyrics such as "Let's all go get drunk" and crap like that... I guess we gotta really think about why we're dancing to stuff like that and what we're trying to prove (to ourselves and to others)...

But what I was saying also was that there are some forms of dancing that does help you remember God (like some forms of classical dancing).... Tha'z why I said that I don't have a problem with all types of dancing.

[S1ngh]

the topic is SSA and the stuff they are supposed to do and the stuff they are NOT supposed to do :wub:

[Jassika]

there is nothing wrong with bhangra. my whole family likes to start dancing just sometimes when we have music playing at home or in the van and its a fun thing.

-culture shows include sikh related skits and information and baisakhi ALWAYS includes bhangra events.

-baisakhi was a time for farmers to celebrate harvesting their crops which they did with music.

-all punjabi people wear a kara and some have khanda necklaces.

-lots of sikhs that have turbans also shave.

-iampunjabi.com is also sikh related too.

-SSA programs can have punjabi culture related skits (like the one at saint soldier)

the point is that people have a mix of religion and culture and i think its best that way instead of being one sided. the reason people push sikhism away is because it doesnt seem to be open to some things so if it was people would be more encouraged to include it in their balance

[Mkhalsa]

jessika, everything you just described is total MANMAT!! :wub:

Its not best to have both worlds when one world (sikhi) STRICTLY forbids the other (punjabiyat, ie bhangra, drinking, womanizing etc etc)

[S1ngh]

Okay.. here's me

before 2002

I was lost

I was into Music VERY MUCH

I was into Bhangra (though i still will do it if i feel doing it)

I had no what-so-ever future plan in my spiritual life

I had no intention of follow khalsa life, cauz I was way busy with these cultural stuff it was a huge distraction

I was no where near to real sikhi except to my looks

After 2002

I came into reality

I know what i will be in next 20, 30, 40 yrs.. (depends if i live the next secon i have)

I know my future will be in sikhi and my future generation will be in sikhi too.. (again if i live that long)

I know the reason of my life (kinda)

So being in culture sooo much.. you will be lost.. If one wants to lead sikhi life then you got to sacrifice culture crap or put limit on it. If you doesn't want to lead real sikhi, then feel free doing all stuff (bhangra, daru, nachna, peena)

and btw.. ms514 version is REAL culture.. That's real culture !

[Mkhalsa]

yeah, in conclusion, im not here to tell you waht to do or how to live your life, but i will tell you what guru sahib says to do and how guru sahib says to live your life. the choice is yours.

take it from those of us who have taken amrit and know that its wrong from our hearts. this is the god given consience and knowledge between right and wrong that guru sahib gives us with bhagti.

Just trust us on our word that such things will only lead you to pain and suffering and will not help you in any way in this life or the next.

I only say the things i do to help my brothers and sisters out there.

[simmal tree]

vwihgurU jI kw Kwlsw!

vwihgurU jI kI &iqh!!

From the get go, I am very sorry if what I say in the following post hurts anybody. I hope and pray that what I say is actually in line with Gurmat . If I say something wrong please correct me. Guru bakshanhaar dayaal kirpaal pithaa jee baksh lain.

We've been saying keep Religion and Culture seperate.

In the same way people have said in the past keep Religion and Politics seperate.

Politics is the science of the control of power. It is so obvious that Sikhi requires complete knowledge of the science of control of power - if we didn't know this we couldn't effectively do raaj once Guru Sahib blesses the KHalsa with raaj.

Culture is, according to many people, a shared heritage, language, etc.

In my humble opinion gurmat is its own culture. Sikhi is a culture.

Wait, pause. Please think about this with an open mind.

Sikhi - the way of life of the Sikh, is a culture. The HIGHEST culture.

what are signs of a culture?

A unique language? Gurmukhi,

A unique dress? Bana,

A unique martial tradition? Guru jee's ShastarVidya (a.k.a. gatka)

A particular attitude towards life?

Chardee Kalaa,

A particular origin? Sach Khand,

A particular homeland?

Khalistan,

A particular army?

Khalsa Akaal Purkh Kee Fauj,

A particular food?

Santan kaa daanaa rookhaa, so sarab nidhaan,

A particular entertainment?

Mayray mun har har har har har jas ootam lai laahaa har man haseeai,

A

particular currency?

har raas mayree man vanjaaraa

A particular attitude towards women?

so kyo mandaa akheeai jith janmay raajan

A particular attitude towards youth?

joban jaanday naa daraa(n) jay seh preeth na jaa-ae

A traditional goal in life?

Bhaee praapat maanukh dehuriaa gobind milan kee ehi thayree bariaa

What are other signs of culture? Usually these stand out...

hmm...

Sikhi has everything that a culture has. Sikhi, i.e. Gurmat, is a culture.

So in my humble opinion, we - Sikhs - need to be most dedicated to our Sikh culture while being part of the worldly culture on a non-affiliation non-manmat basis. The lotus flower can't get up and leave the swamp, but the lotus flower doesn't drown in the swamp either.

There are wonderful, beautiful Gursikhs in all worldly cultures. They can't just get up and leave their worldly cultures - but they can surely stick to only that which is in line with their true culture, their true virsa, their true panth, kaum, marag, mool - Waheguru.

To the Gurmukh, staying true to your roots in the mayekee mandal (all this maya you see) is not really that important.

Keeping it real as far as your worldly roots is not really keeping it real - otherwise why would Guru jee say "jag rachnaa sabh JHOOTH hai jaan layhu ehi meeth"

Matter of fact is, our real culture, religion, way of life, path, occupation, education was supposed to be Sikhi, but we have moved away from it and become attached to our worldly culture, occupation and education.

Let's remember that we cannot abandon this all - our work, our school, our culture, our family - but we can't become completely absorbed in it either.

To those people who think they are missing out when they stop doing bhangra because they are forgetting their roots,

didn't you forget your roots the day you stopped remembering God?

:TH: think about that for a minute my friend.

Gurmukhs stay "achint" within "chinta", they do "udasi" within "maya," they are "layp alayp sadaa nirbaanaa," their chaal is "niraalee" and they are "niaaray."

I am a sacrifice to those Gurmukhs.

may guru jee bless me with the dust of their feet.

bhul chuk maaf karnaa jee

vwihgurU jI kw Kwlsw!

vwihgurU jI kI &iqh!!

[Jaspaul Singh]

Hi again...

This is a reply to 'daasn daas'...

I think that was exactly the point that I wished to make when you said: "Hmmmmm..... i have never seen anyone dance for the sake of dancing. Expecially not in the punjabi culture, where all the songs that r danced on have all wrong meanings to it. Look at what all songs are saying, LOve this guy, Dump This Girl, Look at this girls hips, look at that guys chaal....i mean ok just look, who would be not dancing without any bad intentions involved."

We live in a society where everything is really messed up and I don't think anyone actually truly remembers God when dancing to music with lyrics such as "Let's all go get drunk" and crap like that... I guess we gotta really think about why we're dancing to stuff like that and what we're trying to prove (to ourselves and to others)...

But what I was saying also was that there are some forms of dancing that does help you remember God (like some forms of classical dancing).... Tha'z why I said that I don't have a problem with all types of dancing.

Sorry again if i have said anythin wrong bhainji!!

But u got me curious again ............. classical dancing ??? in remembering god ??? Please tell me ... i didnt know there was an alternate route ..............

[deep]

are you serious? where do these questions go? how do you start with certain topics and end up in only god-knows where......too strange and too funny. does everyone here pretty much have the same opinion? how homogeneous and non-diverse?the cultural police strikes again.

[SarabLoh]

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

i am sry if it just me..... but have u guys listen to some of these lyrics? ..... the other day i was at a PUNJABI party and so much paap happened there.

some songs played .... " putt jatta deh" ..... encourges the cast system

"glassi bhar deh" and "apna punjab hovaa, apne SHARAB hove"..... this is encourging peep to go drink and u see a bunch od drunks who call them selves sikhs runnong to the dance floor with glasses full of liquor. I THINK IT IS WRONG to have parties like these under a sikh banner. i think it is WRONG to mix culture with religion. when guru ji made the khalsa brotherhood .... did he give u naam or give lustful, cast encouraging, drug incouraging BHANGra. i dnt mean to be disrespectful, and dnt get on me if u take this as an offence.... but who ever says punjabi culture should be mixed in with sikhi should get shot.

bhul chuuk maaf

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!