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Majority Of Uk Sikhs Upset With Yesterdays Live Show On Sikh Channel (And Dadu Sahib Wale) For Speaking Against Panthic Leaders And Jathebandia!


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PLEASE KEEP THIS TOPIC HERE SO ALL CAN SHOW THEIR SUPPORT TO THE PANTHIC LEADERS & JATHEBANDIA WHO HAVE DONE SO MUCH WORK OVER THE LAST 25 YEARS+

Most people in the UK will have watched tonights live discussion show on Sangat TV in which many Panthic leaders who have done sewa for the last 25 years+ came on live TV (along with many phone calls) to show how hurt and upset they were with the discussion show that happened yesterday on Sikh Channel - absolutely disgusting.

In that show, members of the newly formed International Panthic Dal, some gurdwara committee members (Guru Arjan Dev Gurdwara Derby and stage secretary of Guru Tegh Bahadur Gurdwara Leicester - not committee), old ex members of jathebandia (eg Raghbir Singh) and Baba Baljit Singh Dadu Wala (who has flown in to the UK from India especially to support Sikh Channel and attend Dastar Day) etc were all sitting there for two hours, basically putting down the drain 25 years worth of work of respected panthic leaders and jathebandia.

This was not a normal discussion show, this was beyond civilised and respectful discussion where phone calls were set-up and every person was pretty much speaking against panthic sikhs as if they are enemies. The likes of Sikh Federation, Sikh Council, Babbar Khalsa Singhs, AKJ leaders, Bhai Joga Singh, Bhai Kuldip Singh Chaheru (brother of Shaheed Bhai Manvir Singh Chaheru), Bhai Amrik Singh Gill, Bhai Avtar Singh Sanghera, Jathedar Bhai Balbir Singh Babbar, FSO, GNNSJ and Bhai Sahib, Bhai Dabinderjit Singh, Dr Inderjit Singh, pretty much every single panthic Sikh and leader out there was called a traitor....

Okay, I don't agree with some of these people, but there is no doubt they have done good work for the Panth over the years in their own capacity. The Sikh Channel presenter (forgot his name?) basically sat there laughing and waiting for the panel and audience to speak more negativity and nonsense. They said that whoever does not support the Sikh Channel Dastar Day is not a Sikh at all. They said these Sikh organisations are asking for 3 years of accounts for Sikh Channel, but they ask them for 25 years worth of accounts from the jathebandia who have taken all the money (even the good ones!!!). This is what was said on a Sikh television channel and live to the world as well. Baba Baljit Singh Dadu Wala sat there listening and supporting them all. In the end he even said what everyone said was really good?????? Most of the things said cannot be repeated but the discussion show was disgraceful.

A recorded broadcast was shown from India of Baba Harnam Singh Dhumma of Damdami Taksal who has supported Dastar Day, along with the traitor Jasbir Rode who has recently gone public and now openly supporting Akali Dal of traitor Badal. These recordings were brought by Baba Baljit Singh Dadu Sahib Wala from India (as he is close to both of them).

Apparently an email sent from Mr Bal of Sikh Channel to Sikh leaders about Dastar Day was read out on Panjab Radio two days ago and Bal had said that no "anti-Indian element" or any talk of "Sikh Sovereignty" (ie Khalistan) would be allowed at Dastar Day (D-Day). What is this saying???

On todays Sangat TV discussion show the Sikh leaders cleared their points. Many phone calls sympathised with Sangat TV and the jathebandia about what was said at yesterdays discussion show on Sikh Channel. Some phone calls came in from people who were directly trying to speak against Sikh Channel and their presenter and those who were at the discussion show, but Sangat TV presenter Kulwant Singh had respect and did not allow this and even cut calls off. Hats off to him and Sangat TV for taking a more professional, civilised and Gurmukh approach. Callers, panel and audince on Sangat TV today were disgusted at Sikh Channels show and those involved (new to the Panthic scene, congress type people or those kicked out Gurdwara committees and jathebandia). Everyone was particularly upset and angry with so-called "Sant" Baba Baljit Singh Dadu Wala who has took one side and also spoke against panthic people and jathebandia (he supported all those who did this) and people asked why was here as he does not know anything about Dastar issues in UK/Europe. Someone also questioned his close links with traitor Paramjit Sarna of the Delhi Gurdwara Parbandak Committee who has also given a siropa to the grandson of the enemy of sikhs Lala Jagat Narain (he was killed by Sikhs years ago)...etc.

Please all post, not to speak against Sikh Channel and those present in their discussion show as enough has been said now, but to support the Panthic leaders and jathebandia who have been and are doing a great job for the panth, in their own particular way - those like AKJ, Babbar Khalsa, Sikh Federation, Damdami Taksal, FSO, Sikh Council, GNNSJ etc.

Also, if one does not support and attend Dastar Day, it does not mean they are not a Sikh but an Indian Government agent! That was a ridiculous statement as well!!!

Most Sikh Youth in UK are clear on their stance!

(Also see this topic which is interesting about D-Day - http://www.sikhsangat.com/Index.php?/topic/63373-great-news-for-panth-sikh-council-sikh-federation-have-already-secured-dastar-rights-in-italy-like-uk-should-be-announced-on-monday-congrats/)

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Majority of UK Sikhs were busy getting drunk in clubs or at home watching BBC 1 , FACT

Those Sikhs involved in the Panth - were happy with the show facts came out about certain ex sikh channel presenters

Baba Daduwal Zindabad -

Rode Dhumma being with Badal - well the majority opposing D Day are with Sant Samaj and applauded Rode n Co for joining Badal on one hand ppl say Baba Daduwal is Sarna then the next they say Badal - Make your mind up Sikh Fed, BSC and what not are all with the Sant Samaj traitors .

Whats Panthic about these leaders who are filthy rich - Pardhaans and what not have any of them put £1mllion to Sikhi parchar in the UK of Sikh Freedom Movement - NEVER have they given birth to Multi Million Gurdwara projects YES!

As long as they get a Gurdwara they dont care about anyone or anything

The filthy Panthic politics in the UK is clear now all the Dera Baba Jathe followers on one side

Average Panthic Sikh who follows no Dera,Baba or Jatha on one side -

All leaders of Dera Baba Jatha groups are aligned fully with Sant Samaj whos with Badal - all Sangat Trust is with Badal FACT

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While I understand your frustration that so called leaders and jathe were slandered, it wasn't as if sangat was not doing it either. In fact they started it off. They thought we will bring big names down in terms of jathebandiya and get them to tell the sangat we are nit with dastaar day and sikh channel should have approached us first etc etc.

After a few days of bashing sikh channel live on air, trust ive been watching, sikh channel have decided to retaliate.

I think the jathe and so called leaders found out really what people think of them and they felt hurt by that, why? Because maybe people are fed up with jathe and committees and leaders because all they are remembered for are causing trouble and splitting up the panth with their own views and opinions.

And this dday is a classic example of what jathe and leaders are about because they are not getting recognized for it they go agianst it. It's all politics and the average sikh gets confused at what do and say. Before you say that the members form sikh channel that day are badal fans take a closer look at joga and co they are fans aswell, they're all fans both sides.

As fir the youth stance I know alot of youth from the midlands are preparing thier own coaches with the sangat help and support and no matter what you do and say DDay is going ahead it's gonna be a success with mahraaj ang sang.

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The scary thing is that the amount of effort they are putting in to slander the event, why if you don't agreewith it don't go, like some people don't agreewith 84 they don't go to protest either, but they don't go to the extent of slandering the event.

I think the rise of the Khalsa will put death to these jathebanidya, bring them down a level because in their homai they think we the sangat owe them something.

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Yes its all very strange. Same with any event, if you don't agree, don't attend. It seems more like a jostle for power. I doubt any of those attending have been on the receiving attend of airport security disrespecting the dastaar. I was subjected to such treatment in Italy 6 years ago. I am glad some people are taking the step to raise the profile of the dastar. We have a lot of work left in the UK as well as abroad.

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Many Jathebhandis spent the last 25 years disconnecting themselves from the mainstream Sikh Comnunity which has given the impression they don't do anything. Can you really blame the sangat for so easily beleiving that they are "chauder de pukhay" people? Jathebhandis need to raise their profile in the Sikh Community by getting involved in Community projects, Parchaar, dealing promptly with local Sikh issues and showing a professional structured side. Simple quick wins!

At the moment the hot topic in the Sikh living rooms is how useless or petty our leaders are. So, wake up Jathebhandis and build up your panthic profiles in your own community and you will get the "pats on the back". Otherwise keep watching a virtual sangat rebellion on Sikh Channel against the Jathebhandis, because that's what today's D Day is going to end up being.

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And I guess sangat tv have played no role in this then?

It was they that started this with discussion shows by Rana when they slandered sikh channel and sikh presenters.

It seems like everyday they have a discussion show putting down sikh channel.

Do they not expect sikh channel to respond? Anger has boiled over on both sides and done nuksan to the panth, from the outside it looks like sangat tv started this. This should have been discussed behind the scenes and not aired on tv.

I think majority of youth are behind this event. The turnout seems to be good and another great bonus is that money veers have worn dastars for the first time in their lives!

Both channels have made mistakes. Both channels need to accept this. Some elders and leaders of our community have unfortunately set a bad example for the youth.

Hopefully after this event all can be forgotten and both channels can continue to do parchar without slandering each other. I hope both channels continue to air and do parchar of Gurmat.

Satguru Panth Nuu Chardi Kala Baksho.

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Some jathebandhis do so much good work, yet fail to communicate it out to the main sangat. They definately need to raise their profiles and improve their communication wings.

The Sikh Channel show was an absolute joke, disgraceful, all staged. If some jathbandis do not turn up for a particular event, so what. They have attended and hosted many other events that the slander-ers didnt turn up to.

The Bal guy in Sikh Channel really worries me. Even though Sikh Channel is a registered charity now, he still makes all the main decisions. He's from a business backgorund and primarily cares about money. He can definately be bought and gotten to by the Indian agencies.

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Not that much Sangat has turned up at d-day from the looks of it. Definately no where near the amount of Sangat that turns up to the June event, it's like 15% of that, but that doesn't matter. Speeches are all mostly in Punjabi as well and doesn't look like much awareness is being created at all. However, a good effort by Sikh Channel and good work. At least the event has happened peacefully and it is all good and at least Sikh Channel made an effort to do something (although perhaps not the right approcah in my opinion, but that is my opinion). Hopefully everyone can work together in the future and everyone will be freinds again now!

Also, unfortunately "Bob Singh" (nornally with "Kamalroop") of the anti panthic Niddar Nang crew managed to get the opportunity to speak on the stage, that was very dissapointing!

Rest were okay I think.

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Just wanted to know on what basis you are speaking for most of the youth. Most I have spoken with are supportive. Furthermore wouldn't it just be easier to not attend Dastar Day if you don't agree with the way it was initiated.

Not speaking on behalf of all the youth. However, it was clear there wasn't much youth there.

Correct me if I'm wrong but don't think any of the main youth jathebandia supported the event or attended it like BOSS, Sikh Youth Project, Young Sikhs, Babbar group, AKJ youth, Taksal youth, Satkaar campaign sewadars, etc etc etc??? Correct me if I'm wrong but in general it looked like a large group of older Singhs and bibiya.

At least its all done and went well.

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Not speaking on behalf of all the youth. However, it was clear there wasn't much youth there.

Correct me if I'm wrong but don't think any of the main youth jathebandia supported the event or attended it like BOSS, Sikh Youth Project, Young Sikhs, Babbar group, AKJ youth, Taksal youth, Satkaar campaign sewadars, etc etc etc??? Correct me if I'm wrong but in general it looked like a large group of older Singhs and bibiya.

At least its all done and went well.

D Day turnout was around 2500-3000. Not massive but alot larger than I thought after all the confusion and mixed messages that were given. There were a proportional amount of youth but what was really evident was that the turnout was a diverse cross-section of the sangat from kids to women to elders.

The general discussion amongst the youth who gathered was that the leadership has never stood up to being accountable. It was a bit of leadership bashing day and that's unfortunate but not surprising.

The winner in all of this was unfortunatly Bal and the Sikh Channel, they have come across as the Sikh voice of the downtrodden. They cleverly gave stage time to anyone who was willing to go on. The group International Panthi Dal managed to build their profile on the gathering and telecast, indirectly offering the idea of a new leadership which the general sangat think they now need. I think the turnout was London/South England strong, which in a way was good to see as it broke the Midland monolpoly of stage limelight. In a way the exercise has propelled some new personalities and possibility of new jathebhandis formalising. Whether that's good or bad, time will tell!

All in all an uplifiting day. Networks were formed, a lot of interaction and exchange of ideas. When we were doing Ardas at the end, I almost fell over with emotion, it felt unreal puting this all into context. We were standing in Westminister London what was once the most powerful centre in the world. The echos of jaikara and panthic naray in Westminister which once rulled over the Sikh world. Who would have ever thought this would happen one day!

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The turnout seemed very south england. I think there was not much youth from midlands. They are clearly still swayed by the

'leadership'.

The actual issue at hand needs to be dealt with. Clearly Sikhs are getting trouble across the globe at airports. This is an international issue that needs ekta.

I am not sure if i am with the jathebandian on this one. They say they are in talks with the government but seems to be having little impact.

Good to see there are still so many people who don't need the green light from a jathebandi to support what is a Panthic issue.

My brother is always getting treated differently from others in a queue at airports. Amasing how he is always picked out for the random search! He is forever having to explain away his existence.

Is the swab really a good idea? In America they let you touch your own Dastaar and then you touch a tissue paper. This is less degrading than a swab. Why have the Jathebandian not picked up on this? If it is ok for the big almighty US then why is it not ok for the little poodle UK?

I think all Sikhs need to have a central point to communicate their experience at an airport and then where things are really bad the tv channels need to pick up on it. This way Sikhs feel supported.

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Puraatan,

I was prsent athe the rally and here are some facts for you:

1. The turnout was huge. It was obviously less than june rally but they are not both same issues and the turnout was expected to be less.

2. One of my friend called me in the evening and told me that BBC evening news on TV showed the event coverage and also showed interviews with couple of people from there. Judging by this it was great success as many people watching BBC will now know what Dastaar is for sikhs. Coverage by BBC is important and just for context June rally has never been covered in BBC this way. Not that I am against June rally or anything. If someone has the BBC clip please post it here.

3. There were lot of youth. Khalsa Aid people were there. satkaar committe people were there. manvir singh khalsa was there. And in general lot of young people could be seen around. Lot of young dastaar weaaring bibiyan were there. Lot of small kids with fancy dastaars were there, celebrating their Dastaar.

4. The fact that the event was held simultaneously in different europian countriesand was shown live will definitely put some pressure on governments and will also raise awareness about Dastaar in general.

About the live telecasts of sikh channel and Sangat TV, I saw both and I have following to say:

1. I agree sikh channel presenters should not have let people take names and slander anyone but Sangat TV was much worse when Ranjit Singh Rana started it all. just couple of weeks before the event. And even in the latest live teleacast from Sangat TV , even though , Kulwant Singh Dhesi started with saying that Sangat TV will never slader anyone like that, couple of minutes later he himself did the same thing and so did the people on the show.

2. Amrik Singh Gill and some others raised that Baljit Singh daduwal shouldn't have let people take names in his presence. Today in hisinterview Daduwal cleared that he just came couple of days back and wasn't aware of all the background. I personally think he was not at fault even though the presenter should have intervened. But I think Amrik Singh Gill (and JOga Singh)has mistakes on his hands as well like sharing stage with Badal people and Akal takht Jathedar at Sangat TV anniversary.

3. I think even if there were differences those could have been sorted out later. and those who didn't want to attend could have just missed it . Why so much campaign against it just two weeks before the event?

4 Finally I think that probably there are oppurtunists on both sides but I think Sikh federation(Amrik Singh Gill) , FSO (Joga Singh) and well intentioned sikhs on Sikh channel like Sadhu Singh, Gurnam Singh etc all want to do good things for panth. They should put their egos in bin and start afresh and patch up. daduwal also mentioned this in his interview on sikh channel today. But please be aware of Sangat TV unless it distances from Badal's clan.

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