This Is Absolutly Embarassing!

[Guest KopSingh]

WJKK WJKF

hello guys was browsing through some youtube videos and came across a christian indian/pakistani videos, supposedly showing converts and miracles etc.

on various of these videos there seems to be a very worrying amount of sikhs who look like they have fallen into the trap of these scumbag missionaries and there fake healing. the christians as we all know are stooping so low, by practically bribing ppl into their religion, they have no shame.

but one thing that REALLY confused me was, WHY are these supposed converts converting on stage like some sort of tamasha, n yet they have turbans on still, with their karras on blatant show? AND THEN HAVE THE AUDACITY TO SAY " HALLELUJAH". WHY are they making a mockery of guru gobind singh's (THE KING OF ALLLLLL KINGS) pagri by wearing it, then becoming christians beforehand?

i kno what im gona say nxt is gona go down badly with everybody, BUT, if it were up to me, id kick all christians out of panjab, close all missionary schools/centres and make it difficult for them to spread their rubbish. its anti-sikhi, i kno, but its incredibly disheartening seeing the lack of love for kalgiwalia in his hoods (Panjab)

panjab is the only area where the indian govt is happy for christianity to spread, as these mugs wont ever fightback, and this will eliminate sikhi from panjab. whereas in south india they burn christians to death and rape their nuns, but in panjab its ok, coz a new religion is competing, and aslong as sikhi is dying, hindutva ppl wont mind. but where is badal on this man?

check this tatti esai stuff, im getting angry as i write, but at the same time, im thinkin to hell with these ppl.

wat u fink?

[singher23]

I mean I sort of understand why they are keeping their turbans and Kara's still on

I know this is wrong, but after 30-40 years of wearing a turban people stop seeing it as a "religious" item and more a part of "who they are". Their self worth becomes tied into the turban, regardless of whether or not they are actually Sikhs. And also, it must be hard to suddenly take it off after decades of wearing it.

Not agreeing with it at all, just maybe that's why they do it

[Wales85]

So take all your wealth and use it to start up some hospitals/charities/etc. in the punjab, and then the christians won't be able to convert others so easily. If all these rich sikhs donated money to opening orphanages etc. instead of buying fancy cars and big houses.... this would not be an issue. Its easy to preach about God, but if your brother is starving/sick and you do nothing... don't you think poor punjabis will think that your words ring hollow?

I left the church many years ago, but I can honestly say that christians do more to help the poor/sick than any other religion I know and by a wide margin. Or you could just do like the taliban and kill everyone that opposes your religion ( and turn the punjab into a third world <banned word filter activated> hole like Afghanistan or Pakistan)

Its easy to say I would burn this, or kill that , yada yada.... its a lot harder to spend the rest of your life serving the poor, the sick, and they needy and foregoing the flashy lifestyle that we all seem to want.

Harsh truth.

[singh1986]

I agree with Wales85, if Sikhs would take the principle of Daswand and seva more seriously there would be alot less poverty in Punjab!

I once watched a Gurdwara run by Baba Jaswant Singh (Ludiana) India... feed langar to me and my western family but deny it to the poor and needy that looked like they needed it! Felt bad, but I wouldn't blame them to turn to a church if that was the only option! On that occasion we Sikhs didn't help our own!

To make things worse they had built these flats/room for us westerners to stay in whilst the poor slept outside the Gurdwara Gate!

I have seen the denial of Langar in many Gurdwaray in India and even UK (Guru Nanak Gurdwara, Leicester) to the poor and homeless ... bad situation!

[ThunderousDominator]

wales is 100% correct

[Akal Warrior]

KopSingh....i see no difference between you and the taliban. This is 100% fanatic thinking on your part. You think that hindus were happy when Guru Nanak Dev Ji spread Sikhism and people were converting to Sikhism? Should Guru ji not have done that because he was in "hindustan"?

Gimme a break dude. There is this thing called freedom of speech. If we didn't have that, there would be no Sikhism. Think about it. Why does it matter to you if people are leaving SIkhi to join a different dharam? Are you God? You have no right to tell others how to think or what to believe. Why dont YOU go to punjab and do Sikhi parchar if you are so passionate about it? Maharaj says , 'Tin aap vishoria, Aap milaea" (he himself seperates, and he himself unites).

One more thing...since you are saying that they should not be practicing their religion in Punjab because it is "Kalgiwalias hood"..then should people living in UK stop preaching Sikhism, and shut all Gurdwaras since it is the "white man's hood"? Straight up bro...sometimes we get carried away with our emotions, and become just like the muslims/hindus who tried to stop Sikhi. FREEDOM OF SPEECH AND THOUGHT. Nobody is putting a gun to their heads... Seriously bro...just think about it.

[Guest KopSingh]

I know this is wrong, but after 30-40 years of wearing a turban people stop seeing it as a "religious" item and more a part of "who they are". Their self worth becomes tied into the turban, regardless of whether or not they are actually Sikhs. And also, it must be hard to suddenly take it off after decades of wearing it.

na nonsense my friend, its well calculated insult by pre-converting, then comin on stage WITH a SIKH ROOP (Turban/beard /karra), then shouting 'hallelujah'.

So take all your wealth and use it to start up some hospitals/charities/etc. in the punjab, and then the christians won't be able to convert others so easily. If all these rich sikhs donated money to opening orphanages etc. instead of buying fancy cars and big houses.... this would not be an issue.

I left the church many years ago, but I can honestly say that christians do more to help the poor/sick than any other religion I know and by a wide margin. Or you could just do like the taliban and kill everyone that opposes your religion ( and turn the punjab into a third world <banned word filter activated> hole like Afghanistan or Pakistan)

I agree with you on sikhs should do more in helping their own.

HOWEVER, dont try n imply that ALL sikhs r well off, middle class ppl, coz im from a poor background, growin up in rough neighbourhoods, NOR is my dad RICHARD SINGH BRANSON. growing up in poorer areas, you become more in touch with general life and reality. Besides you said christians help sick/poor ppl more than anyone else? LOOL yea, only because those christians want something back in return! THAT IS NOT SEVA! (selfless service). guru nanak revolutionised langar (free kitchen), which is at all gurdwaras for everyone, regardless of religion/colour, without wanting anything in return! during pakistan floods, it was found that christians were only helping victims of the floods (in panjab/sindh areas) if they would become christians in return. where is the humanity in that!? whereas the gurdwaras in india feed 6Million ppl EVERDAY!!!! for free, without anything given back.

I once watched a Gurdwara run by Baba Jaswant Singh (Ludiana) India... feed langar to me and my western family but deny it to the poor and needy that looked like they needed it! Felt bad, but I wouldn't blame them to turn to a church if that was the only option! On that occasion we Sikhs didn't help our own!

I have seen the denial of Langar in many Gurdwaray in India and even UK (Guru Nanak Gurdwara, Leicester) to the poor and homeless ... bad situation!

those parties that you have named, should be slapped for bringing sikhi in to bad light/disrepute.

KopSingh....i see no difference between you and the taliban. This is 100% fanatic thinking on your part. You think that hindus were happy when Guru Nanak Dev Ji spread Sikhism and people were converting to Sikhism? Should Guru ji not have done that because he was in "hindustan"?

Gimme a break dude. There is this thing called freedom of speech. If we didn't have that, there would be no Sikhism. Think about it. Why does it matter to you if people are leaving SIkhi to join a different dharam? Are you God? You have no right to tell others how to think or what to believe. Why dont YOU go to punjab and do Sikhi parchar if you are so passionate about it? Maharaj says , 'Tin aap vishoria, Aap milaea" (he himself seperates, and he himself unites).

One more thing...since you are saying that they should not be practicing their religion in Punjab because it is "Kalgiwalias hood"..then should people living in UK stop preaching Sikhism, and shut all Gurdwaras since it is the "white man's hood"? Straight up bro...sometimes we get carried away with our emotions, and become just like the muslims/hindus who tried to stop Sikhi. FREEDOM OF SPEECH AND THOUGHT. Nobody is putting a gun to their heads... Seriously bro...just think about it.

OH MY DAYS, so now ur comparing me to the taliban? if i was the same as the taliban, then i would of said, no hindus & muslims allowed in panjab either u prat. the reason why these christians r evil, is because they are converting ppl using genuine bribe, EG - offering to pay for a poor families bills/kids schooling, BUT ONLY if they become christians! how bowt helping them out regardless, just as human beings first and foremost, just like khalsa aid is doing in haiti/bangladesh/north africa etc.

When sikhs used to get hindu/muslim women back from captivity did the sikhs say to the families, we will only help if you all convert to khalsa? NO, thats not humane. Also how dare u use guru nanak as an example like u did, 1st of all, guru nanak didnt walk around villages, waving 20,000 rupees at ppl saying ill help u out n spiritually awaken u, but only if u convert, and take my money. NO! he said, 'hindus be good hindus, muslims be good muslims'.

Meanwhile these christians u may not be aware r using DIRTY tactics to convert ppl, one of them is disgusting. they give out leaflets/flyers, with the leading title on the top "Waheguru ji ka khalsa, Waheguru ji ki fateh"!? then they proceed by quoting lines from guru granth sahib, then saying how these lines are copied from the bible, and guru nanak is a newer avtar of jesus, and therefore, jesus is made to be superior. IS THIS NOT BEADBI?! by quoting lines from various angs of the Guru Granth Sahib, then claiming them to be plageurised from christianity. what is the difference in what they are doing, and what the RSS/bajrang dal/ hindutva groups etc are currently doing? i seem to remember Dr.Gurnam Singh from sikh channel saying this from his 'Panth Time' show, to which the sangat was shocked, as was i.

LOL then u talk rubbish bowt how maybe sikhi should be shut down in UK as we r in a "white man's hood", in a counter to my argument. OH PALEASE wat a pathetic point that was. panjab is the land of our gurus, and in those same lands we sikhs are tolerant of other religions n allow them freedom to practise, BUT we or atleast i dont tolerate those ppl to then mock our faith and our gurus by spreading this type of literature and do these kinds of mockery of our gurus, by having sikhi roop, then shouting pro christian stuff, pathetic! would these christians have the remotest guts to give this literature out if Bhindrawale was around? NO! coz when hindus tried defamin our gurus in the 80s, they were dealt with, (IE - jagat narain). this is beadbi.

your type of pappu flower power hippy sikhi is what is gettin sikhs bullied all over the gaff! When militant sikhs like some of us on this forum go on the offensive, you lot start crying n comparing us to taliban/mughal type of characters. pathetic, we r not denying anyone freedom of speech, but when those ppl in r gurus hoods' commit beadbi in various forms, then they should b dealt with.

[Kalsingh]

I agree with Wales85, if Sikhs would take the principle of Daswand and seva more seriously there would be alot less poverty in Punjab!

I once watched a Gurdwara run by Baba Jaswant Singh (Ludiana) India... feed langar to me and my western family but deny it to the poor and needy that looked like they needed it! Felt bad, but I wouldn't blame them to turn to a church if that was the only option! On that occasion we Sikhs didn't help our own!

To make things worse they had built these flats/room for us westerners to stay in whilst the poor slept outside the Gurdwara Gate!

I have seen the denial of Langar in many Gurdwaray in India and even UK (Guru Nanak Gurdwara, Leicester) to the poor and homeless ... bad situation!

*DELETED* Think more carefully before you write next time. I was at Baba jis gurdwara in India and saw a bus load of poor people coming in again and again being housed and fed. What are you on about? Why does Sikh Sangat allow nindya of 'real' saints.

[S1ngh]

First of all one need to understand the whole situation more clearly. Sikh Sangat around the globe are very shardalu/dayaman type of community. Our Gurdwara system is very practical in form to serve needy people. Situation is different when we see rare cases where human error is involved in denying something to needy people.

You also need to understand that some needy people in punjab are in habit of asking free stuff from people and they harass Sangat to full extent. One need to think that why we see beggars in front of Harmandar Sahib asking for money to eat food when a langar hall opens for them 24/7. They can do sewa in langar by washing dishes and no soul can stop them eating roti 3 times a day. However they choose to beg rather than doing work to earn roji roti.

Catholic Christians are in Punjab with us for the past 150 years.They have good schools, dispensary and hospitals. They go deep in rural villages of india and actually spend money trying to help them out and in return they want them to adopt their dharam, which is fair to say. Of course they do all of this in the name of jesus. There is nothing wrong in doing that.

HOwever in our community- middle class and poverty line families are more into giving dasvaandh and they are more likely to be god fearing folks; while rich aren't interested in anything relating to sikhi. While in christian dharam, it is total opposite; where rich folks donate in large sum and most of the time they leave their will worth in millions to church estate. That is why we see their system of missionary a solid strong as compared to our loose rusted system.

Above video tactics is very cheap and show the desperate attempt by them to recruit large number of followers. They are doing what their headquarters are telling them to do. Few of us are doing what our gurbani tell us to do.

[singh1986]

*DELETED* Think more carefully before you write next time. I was at Baba jis gurdwara in India and saw a bus load of poor people coming in again and again being housed and fed. What are you on about? Why does Sikh Sangat allow nindya of 'real' saints.

Your experience was different from mine! I didnt say Baba Jaswant was personally responsible... just an example of what stuck in my mind from India!