Pakistan and Sikhs ....

[Jonny101]

what is the need for this, if you dont mind me asking?

To help the Saudi Government against it's own people. For the last few decades whenever Arabs have had domestic problems they have used Pakistani soldiers to suppress the population. In the recent arab spring, there were protests in Saudi Arabia to which the Saudi forces were unwilling or ill equipped to handle, so they used Pakistani soldiers to put down the protestors. They did the same thing in Bahrain where the Shia majority were about to over throw the Sunni royal family, but in the end the Pakistanis were crucial in suppressing the arabs in Bahrain.

What I find surprising is how the US and it's media media keep quiet when Arab dictators allied with the US suppress their people(Saudi, Bahrain) yet make all sorts of news reports and pretend to sympathize with the arabs who are fighting against dictators not allied with the US.

[Jonny101]

Having researched this further, it seems like an internet hoax, similar to the ones that Indian idiots publicise like '60% of scientists at Nasa are Indian'! Is there any Israeli verification of these kills by the Pakistanis? Or if they deny it then do you just take that to typical of the evil Joos?

Not that I want to take away anything from the pakistani air force, but the first time this claim was made of Pakistani pilots shooting down Israeli planes was just a few years ago by Zaid Hamid who said it was a "raaz"(secret), and also added "don't ask me where I got this secret information from." It is only AFTER Zaid Hamid made this claim, that Pakistanis began to exaggerate this myth of Pakistani pilots shooting down Israeli planes. I'm willing to change my view on this if I can see a neutral 3rd party source showing the Pakistani pilots shot down the Israeli planes before Zaid Hamid's brasstaks was aired.

Having said this, the Pakistani armed forces are a highly professional fighting force. In the entire Muslim world they are probably ranked amongst the top 3 along with Turkey.

[Mehtab Singh]

Zaid Hamid!!!!!!!!!!! I love his comical videos. You guys should watch them in your free time. Total entertainment!!!!

[Auzer]

Having researched this further, it seems like an internet hoax, similar to the ones that Indian idiots publicise like '60% of scientists at Nasa are Indian'! Is there any Israeli verification of these kills by the Pakistanis? Or if they deny it then do you just take that to typical of the evil Joos?

Let's be honest here, Muslims are quick to claim a victory even when the whole world knows they have lost. Remember Comical Ali from the Iraq war?

Oh yeah .... "researched" it further.... lol ...

4 Kills were confirmed by Israelis/Arabs.

Pakistani pilots claimed even more victories and Israelis confirmed them as well....BUT...Arabs didn't confirm it. Arabs said that it was their pilots and not the Pakistani one's...so leave it.

But 4 kills are confirmed by everyone....this also include shoting-down of a Miraage by Mig-21 ... So Pakistani pilots shot-down SUPERIOR Israeli aircraft with an INFERIOR Arab aircraft.....again they got lucky you know...By the way , I can also give you accounts of an American-trainer talking about F-16 training program in 1980-90s where Egyptian , Israeli , and Pakistani officers were getting their training for F-16s (All these nations had newly bought the aircrafts) ... According to him ,ALL Pakistani pilots were more aggressive than their Israeli counterparts...

So please , unlike brainwashed , delusional shuppa powaa indians , Pakistanis don't believe in Urban legends. Indians believe that they are a future super power.....60% NASA guys are Indians...and Pakistan is just a run-over for mighty Indian sena etc...Pakistanis don't believe such fantasies... I already mentioned that even Pakistani pilots who engaged Israelis told that Israelis were VERY professional , skillful , well-trained , and determined....

And "Muslims" don't need to claim any victories.... History knows whats what.....

Israel won 67' war hands down...no one claims otherwise.....

Get over yourself! You seem to implying that Pakistan has some sort of power in the middle east! What a joke,

No , I just told you that Pakistan does have a military presence in Middle-East .... Let me tell you this...Pakistan ALSO has a presence in China. I know about one Pakistani fighter officer who is deployed in China..He flys Chinese Su-30MKK ...Since IAF also has an aircraft similar to it...it would become pretty handy for PAF....All professional forces do that...Even IAF guys train against F-16s because PAF has 'em etc ...

I don't claim that Pakistani military presence is a sign of power-projection in middle-east....but military presence seves the interest of Middle-East and Pakistan alike.

your military gets it's but.t kicked by the Americans on a regular basis, remember when the US troops killed those 25 Pakistanis and all the Pakistanis could do was to stop NATO supplies through its borders! Those Pakistanis in the middle east are merceneries propping up Arab dictators. If like Libya there is these Arab dictators are taken down then just like the black mercenaries were lyched by the Libyans then no doubt these Pakistanis will also be lynched!

Well Pakistan Army can't go head-on with United States military....but what you think what we did to Soviet Union? Soviets also attacked our border posts many times...but in the end..who won? We don't want US to stay in Afghanistan...and we will provide them safe passage to exist Afghanistan in 2014... Regarding this part of butt kicking...this is just a rhetoric. Our greater strategic interests serves well when we AVOID confrontration with the US and keep fighting the secret war we are fighting with them.... So yeah...

Remember 2001 stand-off? India spent thousand of crores and deployed like million troops on the border...At the time..Pakistan was under-sanctions but yet you didn't dare to cross the border. At the end : India spent some thousands of crores , lost some 798 soldiers , and then unilaterally withdrew from the stand-off that it started! Hence another victory for Pakistan....

Why was it? Pakistan kicked India's bu.tt but yet no action? Even when Pakistan was at its historic weakest again India? Its all about interests...The war with Pakistan was not in interest of Indian state at that time..simple. Same goes with Pakistan and America...

[Mehtab Singh]

So how/why do you call it bu.tt kicking if it was in the best of the country's economic/strategic interest to refrain from war? I think these days wars are fought and won more or less based on economy. You want to destroy a country, you devastate their economy whatever way you can. Another weapon is the media (information warfare as our dear Zaid Hamid likes to call it), which involves misinformation, something India recently accused Pakistan of during the ethnic clashes in Burma and Assam.

[Jonny101]

Remember 2001 stand-off? India spent thousand of crores and deployed like million troops on the border...At the time..Pakistan was under-sanctions but yet you didn't dare to cross the border. At the end : India spent some thousands of crores , lost some 798 soldiers , and then unilaterally withdrew from the stand-off that it started! Hence another victory for Pakistan....

Why was it? Pakistan kicked India's bu.tt but yet no action? Even when Pakistan was at its historic weakest again India? Its all about interests...The war with Pakistan was not in interest of Indian state at that time..simple. Same goes with Pakistan and America...

Brother Auzer Jee, I'm not pro India in any way, but how was the stand off a victory for Pakistan? When India's parliament was attacked(which I supported by the way), India deployed thousands of troops on the border not to invade Pakistan but to scare Pakistan. The Pakistani army was leaving everything they could and started to deploy their forces across the border near India. I remember reading interviews of Pakistani soldiers at the time of how they all expected war to begin. It was Musharaf who began to give speeches assuring India that cross border terrorism would stop. After Musharaff's repeated pledges, India finally accepted Pakistan's word and agreed to end the standoff. India lost 789 soldiers, Pakistan till date has not released it's casualty figures. Years later, Pakistanis began to claim victory over this standoff for some unknown reason, actually both sides claimed victory to the stand off. One thing is certain, if there was a war, the only real losers would be the people living near the border in both India and Pakistan. Lets hope for their sake there is never a war between the two. I have family living in Amritsar and would not like to see war.

[Auzer]

Not that I want to take away anything from the pakistani air force, but the first time this claim was made of Pakistani pilots shooting down Israeli planes was just a few years ago by Zaid Hamid who said it was a "raaz"(secret), and also added "don't ask me where I got this secret information from." It is only AFTER Zaid Hamid made this claim, that Pakistanis began to exaggerate this myth of Pakistani pilots shooting down Israeli planes. I'm willing to change my view on this if I can see a neutral 3rd party source showing the Pakistani pilots shot down the Israeli planes before Zaid Hamid's brasstaks was aired.

Having said this, the Pakistani armed forces are a highly professional fighting force. In the entire Muslim world they are probably ranked amongst the top 3 along with Turkey.

I don't agree with this bro. Pakistani pilots shooting down Israeli aircrafts is a fact known from very long time. Yes , probably , Zaid Hamid exaggerated it...but atleast 4 confirm kills are on the record... Don't listen to Zaid Hamid...He is craving for Ghazwa-e-Hind hahah....

But here is you can check what happened.

This is from "Air Aces" website. This website is an encylopedia of ALL airwars of the world. They do not put anything in their site UNLESS they confirm it themselves from all parties involved. This site includes the names of Israeli pilots that were shot down , the seriel number of their aircrafts etc...And there is one other site too...known as http://www.ejection-history.org.uk ...but it is hugeeeeeeee...so navigating through it would be hard but this site also name 4 kills of Israeli air force at the hands of Pakistanis..

http://aces.safarikovi.org/victories/pakistan-middle.html

[chatanga]

To help the Saudi Government against it's own people. For the last few decades whenever Arabs have had domestic problems they have used Pakistani soldiers to suppress the population. In the recent arab spring, there were protests in Saudi Arabia to which the Saudi forces were unwilling or ill equipped to handle, so they used Pakistani soldiers to put down the protestors. They did the same thing in Bahrain where the Shia majority were about to over throw the Sunni royal family, but in the end the Pakistanis were crucial in suppressing the arabs in Bahrain.

What I find surprising is how the US and it's media media keep quiet when Arab dictators allied with the US suppress their people(Saudi, Bahrain) yet make all sorts of news reports and pretend to sympathize with the arabs who are fighting against dictators not allied with the US.

auzer, do you know about this?