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Ravidassia


Jeevan
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vwihgurU jI kw Kwlsw!

vwihgurU jI kI &iqh!!

What are we arguing here? It seems like everyone agrees! :wub:

These were all people one with Waheguroo, otherwise they wouldn't have their bani in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Jee. However, "Guru" is a title, and this title was only bestowed upon 10 living and the one granth Gurus.

vwihgurU jI kw Kwlsw!

vwihgurU jI kI &iqh!!

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Matha tekna to paintings is simply what uneducated people do. Educate them but its not really that much if a crime?

Aso why do worshippers touch the stone stairs outside leading into SS gurdwara's?? Doesn't make sense but i guess the above applies in the same way.

Wether ravidass was a guru or not is not really relevant. It depends on the defintion of guru. I undersand guru to mean teacher. Hence we learn't lots from ravidass so why not say he was a guru?

Also many of the 10 gurus were selcted from family members. I don't think that is consistent with what a real guru should be. Ravidass came from no where, and established him self with no help from no one.

Also if the SGGS is a living guru, then by definition anyone who contributed to those holy scriptures should also be Guru.

Mathematically..

Living Guru(SGGS) = Guru+Guru+.......+Guru etc

Are you lot saying...

Living Guru (SGGS)= Guru+Bhagat+Guru+.....+bhagat etc... this would devalue the SGGS to living bhagat???

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Guest raajkaregakhalsa

ravidassias are ofter rude towards gursikhs they are not sikhs because

1) they say ravidas is a guru

2) they dont believe in gur maryada

3) they say jo bole so nirbhay guru ravidas maharaj ki jai

4) they cant decide if their hindu or sikh

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Matha tekna to paintings is simply what uneducated people do. Educate them but its not really that much if a crime?

Aso why do worshippers touch the stone stairs outside leading into SS gurdwara's?? Doesn't make sense but i guess the above applies in the same way.

Wether ravidass was a guru or not is not really relevant. It depends on the defintion of guru. I undersand guru to mean teacher. Hence we learn't lots from ravidass so why not say he was a guru?

Also many of the 10 gurus were selcted from family members. I don't think that is consistent with what a real guru should be. Ravidass came from no where, and established him self with no help from no one.

Also if the SGGS is a living guru, then by definition anyone who contributed to those holy scriptures should also be Guru.

Mathematically..

Living Guru(SGGS) = Guru+Guru+.......+Guru etc

Are you lot saying...

Living Guru (SGGS)= Guru+Bhagat+Guru+.....+bhagat etc... this would devalue the SGGS to living bhagat???

lol ok..lets begin..

"Also many of the 10 gurus were selcted from family members. I don't think that is consistent with what a real guru should be. Ravidass came from no where, and established him self with no help from no one."

If this was the case whyt was Guru Tegh Bahadur the 9th Guru rather than 7th? He would've been next in line if it was purely on family.

"Aso why do worshippers touch the stone stairs outside leading into SS gurdwara's?? Doesn't make sense but i guess the above applies in the same way."

Nope, its being humble as to touch the sangat's feet - To show that we are lower than the sangat.

"Wether ravidass was a guru or not is not really relevant. It depends on the defintion of guru. I undersand guru to mean teacher. Hence we learn't lots from ravidass so why not say he was a guru?"

His mission wasnt to teach. He reached Waheguru as a bhagat. What your saying implies that any mahapurash becomes a Guru as well.. :lol:

"Are you lot saying...

Living Guru (SGGS)= Guru+Bhagat+Guru+.....+bhagat etc... this would devalue the SGGS to living bhagat???"

No we saying Living Guru (aka Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji not SGGS) = Souls that merged with Akaal purakh - including Guru Sahib Ji. Guru Arjun Dev Ji ONLY added Bhagat's banis because they agreed with Gurmat.

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Can I just make a point here, that we instantly claim that all and everyone who go to a Ravidass Gudwara is somehow anti-Gurmat etc etc etc.

There was another post like this a few weeks ago...with the usual rants and rave for and against.

You can't generalise in such matters and for what it's worth...what does it matter anyway?

I for one believe the general consensus that there is only ONE Guru Ji...Bhagat Ravidass is VERY COMMENDABLE...and some part of me respects him as such and would include him in my idea of a ONE GURU JI....our family goes to a Ravidass Gudwara....and whenever I go my only concern is for Maharaji.

Some people, generally the OLDER generation, may place more weighting on Ravidass then on Maharaji, but that doesn't mean we should generalise and condem each and all who are of that particular 'caste'.

Just like we shouldn't distinguish between the Jats and Ramgharria etc etc etc...

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"Aso why do worshippers touch the stone stairs outside leading into SS gurdwara's?? Doesn't make sense but i guess the above applies in the same way."

Nope, its being humble as to touch the sangat's feet - To show that we are lower than the sangat."

If you really are humble get married to a lower caste or get married without even asking about caste. This is humble.

You just summed up a fake sikh trying to act out in front of others they are humble by doing this stupid act ''.LMAO. You might as wash your sins by going to the ganges as well...lol

Guru ravidass was no "ANY" mahapurash was he. He was accepted as an equal by the sikh faith.

If you add water to water it will be water. Add anything else it will become something else. Hence SGGS contributors are all Gurus.

Why are Guru ravidass holy scritptures in the SGGS if you people don't learn from them?? Are they just as fiction??

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definition of a sikh from sgpc.net

The Definition of Sikh :

Article I

Any human being who faithfully believes in

i. One Immortal Being,

ii. Ten Gurus, from Guru Nanak Sahib to Guru Gobind Singh Sahib,

iii. The Guru Granth Sahib,

iv. The utterances and teachings of the ten Gurus and

v. the baptism bequeathed by the tenth Guru, and who does not owe allegiance to any other religion, is a Sikh

you tell me where it says thats satkaar jog bhagat ravidaas jee were GURU rolleyes.gif

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"Aso why do worshippers touch the stone stairs outside leading into SS gurdwara's?? Doesn't make sense but i guess the above applies in the same way."

Nope, its being humble as to touch the sangat's feet - To show that we are lower than the sangat."

If you really are humble get married to a lower caste or get married without even asking about caste. This is humble.

You just summed up a fake sikh trying to act out in front of others they are humble by doing this stupid act ''.LMAO. You might as wash your sins by going to the ganges as well...lol

Guru ravidass was no "ANY" mahapurash was he. He was accepted as an equal by the sikh faith.

If you add water to water it will be water. Add anything else it will become something else. Hence SGGS contributors are all Gurus.

Why are Guru ravidass holy scritptures in the SGGS if you people don't learn from them?? Are they just as fiction??

What this person is saying is typical propaganda from the Ravidassia community that everyone mentioned in the Guru Granth Sahib is a Guru hence the reason why at the Guru Ravidass Bhawan on Union Row (off Soho Rd, Birmingham) has pictures of most of the bhagats in the Darbar Sahib with the labels of Guru Sheikh Farid, Guru Namdev etc.

Lets take a detailed look. Guru Nanak was the only person to have met with Waheguru when he went missing for three days. Guru Nanak was given the Gian by Waheguru to start the path of Sikhi. This therefore makes Guru Nanak, the first Guru. How can any of the Bhagats be Guru's I ask? The Bhagats were foundation layers of the Sikhi faith and THE FIRST GURU was Guru Nanak.

And I end by quoting Bhagat Ravidass from the Shabad 'Sachee Preet Hum, Tum Sion Jore':

Jahan Jahan Jahun, Tahan Teri Seva,

Bhagat Heth, Gaveh Ravidassa.

Here it is clear for all to see that Ravidass refers to himself as BHAGAT.

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa, Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh!

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No propaganda mate. These point raise some interesting thoughts. Guru or bhangat to me personally mean little. Its the contribution that counts. The truth is whatever is said defined in the SGGS is the last word. If there are 10 gurus and x bhagats so be it when you want a clear cut defintion of "Guru" in this context. However he is still a teacher and has made some very powerful statements that we can all learn from.

Is there an article I in the SGGS? If not it doesn't mean nothing, just man made.

"The Bhagats were foundation layers of the Sikhi faith and THE FIRST GURU was Guru Nanak"

Totally agree with this. But how many others do??

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Is there an article I in the SGGS? If not it doesn't mean nothing, just man made.
so according to you majority of rehat maryaada means nothing rolleyes.gif

all i was trying to say was that yes satkaar you bhagat ravidaas jee contributed to guru granth sahib. but we cannot single out his bani and make him guru. our guru is a COMPLIATION of bani's from all these great people. :lol:

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