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There is quite of diversity of drinking tea in the panth. Some of sikhs drink tea and some of sikhs don't, tea topic should be last topic for a sikh as there is bigger things to worry about..It all depends on your perception, if you feel simple cup of tea in the morning will break your sikhi then don't drink it, if you take simple cup of tea in the morning as a refreshment nothing more or nothing less as long you are not addicted then its fine as well. But over addiction of tea talk, great avtar of 20th century- sant baba nand singh ji maharaj- started chaah da bhog to Sri guru nanak dev nirankar every morning. This still happens at nanaksar in morning at 3:00- 4 am every morning. This further re-inforces, tea itself is not a issue but rather than perception while drinking tea- some make/drink tea as parsad (fully acceptable in the panth), some make/drink tea every morning as if they are addict, every morning is fine but being addict is contary to Gurmat (be honest with yourself you will know the answer), some don't drink tea at all consider it as poison which is fair enough as obviously it does not help in their sikhi. There are equal amount of mahapursh (sant baba nand singh ji - sant isher singh ji rara sahib, sant harnam singh rampur kher wale etc) who drank tea and who don't drink tea (sant gurbachan singh ji bhindranwale, bhai randhir singh ji, sant kartar singh bhindranwale etc) as i said earlier its not the tea but perception behind it what matters..!! To tea lovers: If you are addicted to tea admit it within yourself, try to skip weeks without it and see where you stand..any addiction but naam addiction is against gurmat.!! To tea haters: Rise above, don't wrap your head around it, if small cup of tea can break your sikhi then you have long way to go people..!! I have wrote all of above while drinking tea..lol..hehe..go ahead - sue me..!!!!!! :lol2: :lol2: :lol2:

This is what everyone with your opinion says. Its has nothing to do with ego! Unless its affecting yours? After reading your replies i think what your are saying is just ridiculous. If thats what you want then its no longer langar, it goes against the whole idea of langar and seva. Preparation of langar has conditions but it is not reserved for anybody, langar is not exclusive. Although i respect your opinion what you want is not gonna happen. Recently during an rainsbhai at Leamington Gurdwara the organisers and many people attending wanted the langar to be made by Amritdharis only and they ended up causing alot of problems. Eventually the normal sangat and committee said fine go ahead, tusi langar banao, sirf tusi langar khao! If you want us adhere to your conditions then no one else is going to eat langar! They told them as bluntly as you told HKaur16 Ji. Ive seen Gursikhs who have very high jeevans eating langar like everybody else and they didnt seem to have any problems. Hopefully you will use your consciousness and put it to good use and improve your Gursikhi jeevan but... you're not very conscious are you Daas "Consciousness" Waheguru...

I just investigated why Sikh Federation broke up . Some members wanted to drink tea, others felt it was wrong, Hehehehe.

why don't you just drink hot milk.... much better. never been a fan of cha. but if you want cha drink it. but don't get addicted or dependant on it.

This Shabad is by Guru Nanak Dev Ji in Siree Raag on Pannaa 17 isrIrwgu mhlw 1 ] Awvhu BYxy gil imlh AMik shylVIAwh ] imil kY krh khwxIAw sMmRQ kMq kIAwh ] swcy swihb siB gux Aaugx siB Aswh ]1] krqw sBu ko qyrY joir ] eyku sbdu bIcwrIAY jw qU qw ikAw hoir ]1] rhwau ] jwie puChu sohwgxI qusI rwivAw iknI guxNØI ] shij sMqoiK sIgwrIAw imTw bolxI ] ipru rIswlU qw imlY jw gur kw sbdu suxI ]2] kyqIAw qyrIAw kudrqI kyvf qyrI dwiq ] kyqy qyry jIA jMq isPiq krih idnu rwiq ] kyqy qyry rUp rMg kyqy jwiq Ajwiq ]3] scu imlY scu aUpjY sc mih swic smwie ] suriq hovY piq aUgvY gurbcnI Bau Kwie ] nwnk scw pwiqswhu Awpy ley imlwie ]4]10] Siree Raag, First Mehla: Come, my dear sisters and spiritual companions; hug me close in your embrace. Let's join together, and tell stories of our All-powerful Husband Lord. All Virtues are in our True Lord and Master; we are utterly without virtue. ||1|| O Creator Lord, all are in Your Power. I dwell upon the One Word of the Shabad. You are mine-what else do I need? ||1||Pause|| Go, and ask the happy soul-brides, ""By what virtuous qualities do you enjoy your Husband Lord?"" "We are adorned with intuitive ease, contentment and sweet words. We meet with our Beloved, the Source of Joy, when we listen to the Word of the Guru's Shabad.""||2|| You have so many Creative Powers, Lord; Your Bountiful Blessings are so Great. So many of Your beings and creatures praise You day and night. You have so many forms and colors, so many classes, high and low. ||3|| Meeting the True One, Truth wells up. The truthful are absorbed into the True Lord. Intuitive understanding is obtained and one is welcomed with honor, through the Guru's Word, filled with the Fear of God. O Nanak, the True King absorbs us into Himself. ||4||10|| This is the katha of this Shabad starting at approx 22.30 mins. I was listening to this today, and it reminded me on a now closed topic, about whether the Farid was Shakkar OR al-Sani. In it Sant Gurbachan Singh tells of Guru Nanak Dev Ji going to Pakpattan and meeting al-Sani, who asks Guru Nanak Dev Ji onhow ot acheive Mukti. Some posters were of the opinion that it was al-Sani's bani that Guru Ji included in SGGS.

It is a deep question but I think he is getting confused here. Akaal resides everywhere, in all beings, in all animals, in all plants; there is no place He is not. He resides in each and every one of us when we have our heads covered or not, when we sing His praises or when we curse one another, when we do sewa or when we hurt one other. This is not the issue. The issue is should we therefore abandon all our rehat maryadha? Guru Ji made the maryadha that we remove our shoes when we enter gurdwara, do we abandon this? Is not God there whether we remove our shoes or not? No, it is a matter of adhave and respect of our Guru, that is why we do it. We cover our heads because when we go do darshan of Akaalpurkh saroop Guru Granth sahib Ji we do it with utmost humblness, and for a Sikh this requires covering of his/her head and to remove shoes and go bare foot. Even before Guru Granth Sahib ji was given Guruship, Guru Arjan Dev Ji used to sleep on the floor while the saroop of Adh Granth Sahib Ji was on a higher palang. Did it not matter then? Was not God present if Guru Ji slept higher then Guru Granth Sahib Ji or lower? The point is that for our Guru we show the utmost respect and we show humbleness, this is the reason why we go barefoot and cover our heads at Gurdwara. So this person has fed his hunkaar by scoring points at darbar sahib by saying ‘does it matter to cover one’s head or not?’ but by doing this what did he gain from going to Harmandir Sahib Ji if he himself was not humble?

Not sure how many people have already heard this, but this was a wake up call for me, so thought I'd share it with you all

Wow all this for a brother who came to ask a few questions. Whats with the hatred guys? Bringing Islam into every topic of discussion asthough Auzur somehow represents the Islamic nation?. His points are valid on the quotes some of the sites give supposably from the Qur'an. Why support the Christian missionaries by using their BS to justify yourself? Did our Guru Sahibaan ever quote the Qur'an to find faults or contradictions? And they are our Guru Sahib!! What knowledge or understanding have we that we dare to quote or question another faith? "shaj ta bole, shaanani ki bole jis vich shati-soh shake ne?" If you think his intentions are wrong, report him. Ignore him, get on with your life. Be the bigger better person. But dont stoop to such a level at which you find yourself questioning anothers faith. Pul chuk maaf ji

Take a week or so to go through all that has been fed to you. Don't jump already. There is a lot coming your way so get ready to get busy. Make sure to go through what Gurbani says about Islamic practices. I expected way too much from your reading skills as well as speed. Anyways, keep going my friend. We'll talk soon, possibly next week or before once you're done reading/watching/listening. Until then, I guess we won't have much to talk about. See you around.

Osho - Philosophy is a game for people who are not thirsty. Religion is the journey of those who are thirsty. Therefore philosophy plays with words; not so religion. Religion takes cognizance of the hints the words give and follows them. When the quest is for the lake, what can the word lake do? When the search is for life, the word life alone sounds hollow. Let us understand a little about a profound question facing the philosopher. A tourist comes to India and he is given a map of India. What is the relationship between India and the map? If the map is the same as India then it must be as vast. If it is exactly like India, it would be useless, because you couldn't carry it in your car, much less put it in your pocket. If it is not like India, how can it still be useful? The map is a symbol. It is not like India and yet by means of its lines, it conveys useful information about India. You may roam the whole of India without ever seeing a map of India. Wherever you go you will find India; the map is nowhere to be seen. But if you have the map with you and understand it and use it, the journey will be made easier. By either keeping the map in your pocket, or by looking at the map and never leaving your room, you will not learn a great deal. Both together make for the fullest understanding of the experience. Religious people the world over hold the maps to their chests as if the maps were the actuality, the totality. Scriptures, holy books, images, temples -- all contain hidden pointers that keep the maps from being just a burden. The Hindu is carrying his load of maps, the Mohammedan his, the Christian his. The maps have become so numerous that the journey is now almost impossible, so weighted down are you by maps. The maps should be short, abridged, and they are not to be worshipped in themselves, but to be utilized on the journey. Nanak drew his essentials from both the Hindu and the Mohammedan religions. He cannot be called Hindu nor Mohammedan; he is both or neither. It was very difficult for people to understand Nanak. There was a saying: "Baba Nanak is the king of the fakirs. He is the guru of the Hindus and the saint of the Mohammedans." He is both. Of his two special disciples, Mardana and Bala, one was Hindu and the other a Mohammedan. Yet Nanak has no place in the Hindu temple or in the Mohammedan mosque. Both doubt his position and do not know where to place him. Nanak is the confluence of the two rivers, of Hinduism and Islam. He harvested the essence from both. Therefore the Sikh is neither Hindu nor Mohammedan; they must be both or none since their religion arises out of their junction. Now it is difficult to understand this confluence; when there is a river on the map it is clear-cut, but here two rivers have become one. Some words relate to Islam while others reflect Hinduism, and together they became hazy, but gradually the fog clears when you enter into the experience. If you keep Nanak's words on your chest as you do other scriptures, it becomes like any other holy book -- and we do find the Sikh worshipping his words as if they were the guru. Is it not astonishing how we repeat our mistakes? Nanak went to Mecca. The priests there told him to be careful not to point his feet toward Kaaba while he slept. As the story goes, Nanak's reply was that they should turn his feet where God was not, and, it is said, the holy stone of Mecca turned wherever they turned his feet. The symbolism means only this: wherever you turn your feet, there God is. Where will you put your feet if He is omnipresent? I was invited to the Golden Temple at Amritsar. When I went they stopped me at the entrance saying I must cover my head before entering the place of God. I reminded them of the incident with Nanak at Kaaba and asked them, "Does it mean that right here where I stand with my head uncovered, there is no God, no temple?" We keep on repeating our mistakes. I further asked, "Then please show me a place where I can be without a head-covering. And don't you remove your turbans while bathing, and while sleeping? Then isn't that also an affront to the Lord?" Man's foolishness is the same everywhere. Whatever Buddha says, his followers paint with their own brush to suit them. And so also with Nanak. The same web is woven once a master has pronounced his words, because man's foolishness has not changed, nor has his deafness improved. He hears, but he draws his own individual conclusions which he then follows accordingly, never putting into practice what he actually hears. Nanak says, no matter how many songs are sung about the lord, nobody has covered it completely. Different people sing different songs because there are many paths to reach Him. However antithetical their songs may seem there is no contradiction anywhere because they all contain the same message. The Vedas say exactly what the Koran says, but the method by which Mohammed reached is different from Patanjali's approach. Buddha also says the same thing but his method is entirely different. Infinite are the gates to His abode. Whichever way you go leads to His gate. Once arrived you can begin to define the gate through which you entered, and describe the path you have trodden. Another person will likewise describe his own door and his road. Besides, it is not only the path that differs, but your understanding, your perception, your emotional attitude all play a significant part. When a poet enters a garden, he sings in ecstasy; an artist would paint a picture; if a flower-merchant comes along, he will think in terms of sale and profit; a scientist will analyze the flowers or soil to find out their chemical composition and why they grow; a drunk will be oblivious to the beauty around him, he will not even know that he went through a garden. Whatever you see passes through the windows of your own eyes which impose their own color on everything. Says Nanak: Some sing the praise of His power -- He is all powerful, omnipotent. Some sing of His benefaction and munificence -- He is the supreme giver. Some sing of the glory of His attributes, His beauty -- He is the most beautiful. Some cll Him truth, some call Him Shiva, some call Him the beautiful." Rabindranath has written: "I found Him in beauty." This says nothing of God; rather, it tells of Rabindranath. Gandhi says: "For me, He is truth -- truth is God." This speaks of Gandhi rather than of God. Rabindranath is a poet; for a poet God resides in beauty, supreme beauty. Gandhi was no poet, he is practical, and it is natural that such a mind sees God as truth. From the point of a lover -- He is the beloved. How we see Him reflects our insight. He is everything simultaneously and also -- none of these. In this context Mahavira's reflection is wonderful. He says, "Unless and until your sense of vision drops, you cannot know Him." For whatever you will know, you will know through your own seeing; it will be your view of knowing. Mahavira calls his method no-view. Seeing only occurs when all vision drops. But then you will lapse into silence, because how will you speak without a viewpoint? When you are freed of your vision, you will become like Him; because you will be so extensive, so comprehensive, you will be one with the open skies. How will you speak? You will no longer be separate unto yourself, but one with the absolute. A viewpoint means that you stand apart from what you see; to have a viewpoint means that you are separate from Him. Therefore Nanak says that all the viewpoints are correct but none is complete; when the partial is proclaimed as complete and perfect, the illusions begin. Any sect or organization claims one particular incomplete vision as perfect. One sect stands against another, whereas all sects are different aspects of religion, and no one sect is a religion. If we were to amalgamate all possible sects that have been, that are and that will be, then religion would be born. No sect on its own can be called religion. The word for sect in Hindi, sampradaya, also means the path, that which takes you to the goal; whereas religion, dharma, means the destination. The destination is one, the paths, many.

lol@JasSinghKhalsa

I was not agreeing or disagreeing. I just stated a point. Stop talking so much about Bramghianis. Relax with this obsession. Not trying to be rude. But every thread you talk about Bramghianis. Clearly here you are saying Bhai Randheer Singh is not one. That is disrepectful. And then say Baba Nand Singh was bramghiani as if you are bramghinai yourself. you could be though. not saying your not. But if you are not self realised, then relax with your views on bramghianis. I too was the same, then I realised that everything is Bramghiaan.

If thats what bhai randheer singh thought, so be it..!! With all due respect to bhai sahib ji- perception of bhramgyani - bhramgyani considers both poison and non poison as amrit as sukhmani sahib 8th asthpadi says...thats how baba nand singh ji perceived it as presented tea to guru sahib for parsad every day!! Student of bhramgyani with that kinda of perception (seeing everything ek ras as amrit), naturally would rise above from rubbish talk of drinking tea - be for it or against it...!!

I have read somewhere that Bhai Randheer Singh said that tea is like horses pashaab, and coffee like the pashaab of a donkey. And asked if people would drink pashaab.

Yeah, i guess depends on how much one drinks too @ Singh559. My grandmother used to drink quite a few cups a day, "khaarkeh desi chaa", but when she didnt drink on one day, used to be so gusse, and start shouting at us lolz. I dont drink more than 1-2cups a day. I guess it can get addictive if u dont drink it in moderation. But coffee is not good at all, not had coffee in years, gives headaches, like coka cola.....

Take your fiance with you when you ask her, and make sure you have 2 thick wooden sticks, 1 for each of them. And yes, Iodex, Bengay they all help with pain.

Sounds like the guy is from back home. Only they use the word "proposed" in this context. Does my head in.

lolol you goonda this is jokes of course sikhsangat members gonna say no and do ur besti also....if you really wnna be 'friends' with her then talk but lol pata ni tera if you wanna be just friends or hurrr hurrr....lol banda ban jaa,,ni ta hor vi tareekay onde ne lol and you had ''purposed'' her two times lol what type of purpose was this for/asking

It is always disappointing when individuals leave an organisation to set up another organisation. This is true of Bhai Charan Singh leaving the Sikh Federation (UK). There can be all sorts of pressures exerted on individuals when they decide to leave to set up something new. It was interesting watching the programme last night on the Sikh Channel about the new organisation and how it will focus on Dharam (great), but I was surprised by the negative/dangerous comments about Rajneete, given what our Gurus have said about the need for Raj. However, the most important thing is having a new organisation promoting Dharamic issues is no bad thing, but more importantly the work of the Sikh Federation (UK) will continue as the aims and objectives (including establishing a Sikh homeland) and history of the organisation that can be traced back to Shaheed Bhai Amrik Singh Ji and the legacy of Sant Jarnail Singh Ji (attack by the Indian army on the Darbar Sahib Complex laying the foundation stone for a Sikh homeland) are much more important than any number of individuals. The Sikh Federation (UK) as part of the International Coalition for a Sikh Homeland is entering into an interesting phase regarding progress towards a Sikh homeland, so it makes it even more interesting this announcement of a new organisation is happening now. Suspect as we make even more progress to a Sikh homeland new challenges will emerge, but strangely we should see this also as a positive sign.

keep your skin moisturized. don't wash it too much, leave the bodies natural oils in there. eat healthy (lots of fruit, apples, bananas, avacados, peaches, lemons have lots of vitamins that help skin) use some desi tel, best tel out there :D. also visit a doctor. but..... i used to have very bad skin on my nose when i was 4-5years old, it was growing and getting worse. no medicines or creams were working. i went amritsar while on holiday, and had ishnaan at darbaar sahib. trust me, this worked. i have had no problems since then. best medicine ever. :D. also this is off topic but i thought i 'd say this. i got really ill last time i went india. puking headaches. i asked if i could go anandpur sahib, when i got there i went around drinking the water from the sarovars and where sangta wash their feet (:D) and it worked! i don't know what happened but i recovered a few days after, thought i'd have to leave early, but guru kirpa i got better.

posting 'facts' about religions can be insulting. but since when are radhasoami, jhoota sauda, narakdharis etc religions?? their sole aim is to gumraa people, take them away from Sikhi by distorting facts about it. they are government funded organised groups out to demean, insult and undermine Sikhi

I dont quite think that you have the right to tell me that no offense. The Gursikhs that know me would speak otherwise. Someone who is not an amritdhari, their nitnem could be far greater than that of an Amritdhari. This sort of attitude is what drives youth away from Sikhi. I am not weak, I'm trying to achieve at a slow pace. Who are you to tell me that I cannot do Seva at my Guru's ghar? What makes food holy? Its one thing to stop people from making langar who indulge in wrongful activities and its another to stop someone who is working to fix their jeevan. I am not being unfair to any Amritdharis. I expected a more sophisticated and intellectual response. Not a response bashing on why I am weak and I will cause harm to others gursikhi jeevan.

I do not say, go to the Temple or the Mosque, O mystic! Whichever way you go , there is the Beloved, O mystic!

Here are some resources you might find useful to gain knowledge about Sikhi. http://whyichosesikhism.com/ http://searchsikhism.com/islam.html http://www.searchsikhism.com/si3.html http://rampurkhera.com/audiobooks/Se_Kinehiya-ENGLISH/chapter-063.mp3 Others please add more. Our friend is blessed with the habit of reading a lot. I wish I had that kind of patience and time to revive my long lost love of reading as I did in childhood. Auzer, please make sure you read everything. If in doubt, please get back to us. We are not scholarly like yourself (or rather, as you claim to be) but can try to respond.

do you want english veechar or punjabi?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OhrLA6dND9k Enjoy !!!!!!!!!!! :biggrin2: :biggrin2: :biggrin2: :biggrin2:

Would muslims eat meat that is not halal?

keep doing simran penji. ur doing gr8, more than i am. dont let this kalyug dunia get to you. there is always goin to be somebody that will be an obstacle, but u have to show u can do it. Believe in Waheguru and u will.

Why don't people bother to just read the guidelines? You're provided those things the moment you become members. It clearly says not to badmouth any religion. That part is absolutely a false allegation on us. We have always criticized/condemned anyone who has proven to be a foe of the Panth. Lets not forget, facts need to be backed up with reliable and authentic sources. Tomorrow if you post a news article from Times of India which calls Sant Baba Jarnail Singh Ji Khalsa Bhindranwale a terrorist, we assure you it will most definitely be trashed. I understand you are desperate to paste-post your stuff (which you have anyways, more than once) which is seen by some as anti-Islamic. But it only makes you look like a fool if you keep doing it in every thread again and again. You had your chances, the discussion was concluded, forget it and move on man. Don't keep pasting the same stuff in every reply. Come up with something new but in the relevant thread. How would you feel if you were discussing rocket science and I started telling you how much I love Tom & Jerry? So please, I am requesting you panther ji, quit using this forum to enhance your anti-Islamic and/or anti-Pakistan campaigns. Sikhs don't consider either one to be an enemy, neither Muslims nor Pakistanis. Its the mindset of some folks which wishes harm upon Sikhs that we need to unite and fight against. Think of how can we kill this disease instead of killing the patient/victim.

One Guy says that Nihangs are the original Khalsa and another says they've used to soldiers in the army of some mythical Godess!

Badal in effect is an amazing statesman and politician. He does represent Punjabis which is the sad part. Fools will elect a fool. The corrupt and wicked elect the corrupt and wicked. The problem is many people aren't aware of what they're doing and lack serious education.