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I don't know what mental acrobatics you've performed to link these things? Hari Singh Nalwa taming an adjacent region that historically attacked his own native land and indulged in wholesale murder and taking away humans as slaves, is a world away from some white colonialists, travelling thousands of miles away from their homeland, to nations who have never been any threat to them, and then attacking and subverting them doesn't equate.

I have a lot of cats (3). I prefer them over dogs tbh. If you're in the UK it's best to get a cat. Low maintenance but still cute and fun. Having dogs is tiresome and I can't stand loud noises like barking. The worst a cat will do is meow. I don't know why some traditional desi families are so averse to animals, it's weird. Sometimes I've seen Punjabi families get dogs but they get those big guard dogs (German Shepherd, Pitbull, etc) and keep them outside all the time fenced up! It's sad and pointless imo. I remember when I would cry and one of my cats would always comes up to my face to touch the tip of my nose with her nose and sniff me, haha. ?

Agree with one of the posts. As a male you tend to put higher expecations on yourself. Especially when you rock a pagh, then your representing a whole community. This is when you realize you have to be thankful for what you have and just keep pushing forward. And when it comes to marriage just pray you get the proper partner. Our Guru's emphasized marriage life but if nothing is really coming your way despite you making an effort then whats the point? Arrange marriage?

The reality is that it is the daughter in law that does the looking after and the son is often left to negotiate the power play going on between his mother and wife. And it is often daughters that care more for their parents than daughter in laws as is being proven in modern times in the West where travel is easier. So there are no guarantees that the son will be able to fulfil his duties if his wife doesn't get on with his mother.

Here is another unpopular comment which is going to give some more downvotes. A mother will always favour a son over her daughter because historically her survival depends on it. You are going to invest more into a son who ( in thousands of years of tradition) is going to look after and protect you in your older age. Your daughter is going to get married off and live with another family. 50 years of feminism and blank state equalism cannot replace something that has been tried and tested and survived for thousands of years.

It will sound controversial, but I think our biological age for pairing, the late teen years, is the ideal time for getting married, or at least roka/engaged. The couple can live together, study, work, and eventually start a family by the time they reach their mid-twenties. Instead of fighting the tide, it’s better to surf it. Kids spend their prime sexual years engaging in wasted pleasures that still leave them at square one when they hit their late 20’s. All that time could have been spent maturing and satisfying their urges in a controlled and fruitful bondage. The older we get, the more difficult it is to pair up. Our expectations keep getting more refined and unreasonable, and past sexual adventures only screw up emotional pairing further. The other benefit I see from early hitching is that family can re-enter this traditional space like the old days and find matches for their children. I think the western model of chance is bullc&@p. We had better success in the old ways. Now you have kids and families with increasing anxiety as the kids edge towards their 30’s with no end in sight. We’ve changed the starting line way too far up.

I think it's because the systems for enabling it have been fractured. Parents prevent their kids from finding their own partner whilst relatively young (indirectly suggesting they will hook them up in due time), and then suddenly expect them to find a partner themselves in later age. By this time many have had secret relationships that have ended. What's left for them at this stage other than shaadi.com etc. and settling. Plus a lot of them will now have baggage about 'the one' that got away, and secretly pine for them.

You know what else we need. I'd say a dedicated group of about 2000 men and women, armed with assault rifles, whose primary job is to make sure that every last person studies, so we don't have more blockheads. There is no future in us having illiterate or semi-illiterate people, and there is no excuse for it in the 21st century. A culture of education needs to be encouraged and sustained. It's an embarrassment that we have semi-literate Sikhs in this day and age. Guru ji always encouraged literary pursuits and development. We should to stop making this shyte the centre of our culture.

Ok bhai ji. I think it's obvious that things can get really unpredictable in India. Personally (and I know I'm not the only one to feel like this) I wouldn't be able to trust some of these people we've been talking about in the event of conflict. I wouldn't want to risk myself or a loved one with such people. I doubt their motives. It is what it is. What's going to happen is going to happen. I pray it's for the best of the panth. Akaal Sahai.

Because India is the Homeland of Sikhs , Punjab is the homeland of Punjabi's be it Hindu , Sikh, Buddist Muslim , Christian' atheists etc. . Our fight is against the Government not India . and you are really praising the Taliban? they are cowards not fighters .

Let's not get hung up on the language thing. It's true I find Panjabi Sikh men speaking Hindi repulsive for some reason. Probably because they sound gay. But let's not forget that lots of our puratan granths don't use Panjabi but other languages, like Braj Bhasha.

Never. There is no excuse. I know cases where people have gone back to maharaj because they a have made a bujjar kurheat. They’re asked how many nitnem they have missed. The panj Singh tell them that they must recite all missed nitnem then come back. Then they’ll be given amrit. I know a Singh who had to recite 30 nitnem! He missed a whole month! I don’t think you did it on purpose, so just read 2 nitnems the next time. It’s important you get nitnem kant (memorised) then you will never miss it.

Sincere thanks for pointing out the inconsistency between the Arabic quote and the translation. This mistake was introduced during the translation of Sant Ji’s Punjabi manuscript into English. Sant Ji, in his manuscript, only included Punjabi transliteration and the Punjabi translation, and not the Arabic quotes (there were one or two exceptions). The translation team felt that the transliteration from Arabic to Punjabi (done by Sant Ji) and then from Punjabi to English (done by the translation team) may result in indecipherable Arabic phrases. As a result, an Arabic translator was hired to validate the transliteration and to supply quotes in Arabic script. This translator had only limited success, she mentioned that transliteration was poor and the language was old and had a mix of Persian in some places. In hindsight, including Arabic script was a mistake, instead of removing potential transliteration mistakes, it introduced new ones. The fact that the Arabic script quotes were added later is acknowledged by the editor’s footnote #12 on page 32 of the book: “Most of the phrases in the Arabic script in this book were not copied from Taajudin’s original manuscript. Saving just a few exceptions, Sant ji transliterated Arabic/Persian phrases into Punjabi in his handwritten manuscript. I used services of an Arabic translator to produce Arabic script from my English transliterations. It’s possible that some mistakes may have been introduced in these series of conversions from Arabic to Punjabi, Punjabi to English and then finally from English transliteration to Arabic script.” I agree that we should be skeptical, and validate any historical claims. Unfortunately, Sikhs have done a poor job in validating and preserving our history. The purpose of this book is to document these claims so that further research could be carried out. It’s encouraging that you have researched Arabian sources, we need to do more work in this area. The book references over thirty pieces of evidence including monuments, buildings, and literature going back to Bhai Gurdas Ji which corroborates many of Sant Ji’s claims (please see table below from Appendix A of the book). There are multiple monuments and buildings built in memory of Guru Ji, referenced by Sant Syed, which still stood until 1930, which were documented and visited by several other Sikhs and non-Sikhs. Also, there is a much photographed stone slab, from 1511 in Baghdad, with an inscription related to Guru ji (the slab was destroyed in 2003). For example, in addition to other sources, many of the building described by Sant Ji have been cooroborated by Giani Gian Singh, based on interviews with Hajjis, in Twareekh Guru Khalsa, Volume 1, p. 182 (authored in 1892): “Five very famous houses built in the memory of Guru Nanak in Aden, Jeddah, Makkah, Medina, and Baghdad. Four of these places were under the sponsorship of the Ottoman Empire. The priests and caretakers of these houses were employees of the Turkish ruler. Except for Aden, the other four served langar (free kitchen) paid for by the ruler. All the houses were shaped like a mosque with a golden dome. Inside each, there was a platform. The priests wore a blue kachh which covered the knee but not the calf.” The Giani based his account on descriptions provided by many Hajj travelers from Punjab which included Hajji Gulam Ali of Rangpura, Hajji Gulam Muhayudin Maulvi, Hajji Gulam Mohammad son of Ilahi Baksh of Sialkot, Hajji Fateh Khan, shipbroker from Bombay, Shahbaz Khan from Kabul, Hajji Kutab Din of Lahore and Hajji Imam Baksh of Delhi. We must look at Mushtaq Hussein’s (Sant Syed’s) credibility before we accept or discount his testimony. Mushtaq Hussein belonged to a very well-to-do and influential Syed family of Jammu Kashmir (Syeds are respected in Islam for being direct descendents of Prophet Mohammad). His grandfather was a cabinet minister, and his father was the highest religious leader (Pir) of Jammu. Mushtaq’s decision to adopt Sikhism came at a lot of peril and personal sacrifice for him. He lost his family and a comfortable lifestyle. As a Sikh, for decades he lived in abject poverty with people constantly making attempts on his life. Sikhism doesn’t quite encourage conversions. Mushtaq had to beg and cajole before he was initiated a Sikh. Mushtaq didn’t come up with these stories to justify his conversion after the fact. Before he became a Sikh, he shared his documented findings in the Middle East with Jathedar Achhar Singh and others in Lahore to convince them that he be initiated a Khalsa. While in the the Middle East, Mushtaq was in a much stronger position than most to research the Guru’s history. He was well educated. He spoke the local language. As a Muslim, he had access to people, places, and documents which people from other religions didn’t have. Above all, he was driven to seek out all and any information related to Guru ji in the Middle East. Important towns on Guru’s Route Monuments and Literature References Related to Guru’s Visit Talwandi, Sultanpur, Multan, Lakhpat, Karachi Meharban Janamsakhi, Historical Gurudwara at Lakhpat Hinglaj Puratan Janamsakhi, Meharban, Bhai Bala Janamsakhi, Historical monument at Hinglaj Aden Historical monument outside the fort Jeddah Monument of Nanak Shah Qalandar near the Tomb of Eve Makkah Taajudin – Sihayato Baba Nanak Shah Fakir , Zainul Abidin – Twarikhe Arab, Varan Bhai Gurdas, Puratan, Meharban, Bhai Bala, Makkahy Medina Di Gost, Dwelling of Nanak Shah – Guru’s Kharav (wooden shoe) was kept here (this dwelling is close to the Dwelling of Baba Farid), Another Memorial with a dome built in the middle of the city – Guru’s aasa (walking staff) was kept here Medina Taajudin, Bhai Gurdas, Meharban, Bhai Bala, Makkahy Medina Di Gost. A house where Guruji’s Kharav and Japuji Sahib pothi is kept. According to Mushtaq Hussein, he visited this house and talked to the owner Mehboob Ibne Jaffer who still followed Guruji. Amara, Kufa, Kai Kai Taajudin, Masjide Wali Hind in Amara, Memorial of Nanak Wali Hind outside Kufa in a cemetery near Karbala, Platform of Nanak Wali Hind in Kai Kai by Furat Canal – Karoon’s needle was kept here Baghdad Taajudin, Pir Abdul Rehman - Guniya-Ut-Salehin, Bhai Gurdas, Janamsakhi Bhai Mani Singh, Guru’s shrine in the cemetery, Guru’s well in the same cemetery, Stone slab with inscription (destroyed in 2003), Another stone slab with inscription about the Guru and Pir Behlol (seen by Swami Ananda Acharya) Khorram Taajudin wrote that he separated from Guruji in Baghdad and went back to Medina as Guruji and Mardana left for Khorram Kandhar Bhai Bala Kabul, Jalalabad, Peshawar, Tila Bal Nath, Talwandi Puratan, Meharban, Guru’s shrines in Kabul and Jalalabad

The first step is enlightening yourself with knowledge on how humans condition themselves and to understand false and true conditioning. The second step is to be conscious of both conscious and unconscious conditioning. We all have developed false conditioning behaviours in our lives without realising - start thinking about your thoughts and actions and why you have those ideas. The third is to move from 'thinking' to 'practicing' true conditioning, to live it, to form good habits and to be an example i.e. 'be the change, you wish to see in the world'. The final step is to teach and educate others. All true conditioning is for sarbat da bhalla i.e. for the goodness of the whole of the human race. So you must make others aware too, engage in conversation, dialogue. Most people haven't entered the first step of enlightening themselves with the knowledge or accepting or understanding that knowledge so that is your start. I would like to add that it is a long journey spanning all of life. It is a life time commitment where that knowledge is practised, refined and further deeper knowledge and understanding is developed through life experiences. But it is worth it for personal development and for creating a system that benefits all. If you seriously want to 'uncondition' or what I would rather call it is - living a life of true conditioning then start off by understanding yourself as a human, how you fit in the system, how the system fits in you. Then take small steps to change old habits and slowly do that to every aspect of your life and you will see the change. You cannot pick and choose when you want to condition yourself to false and when you want to condition yourself to true. You have to work at conditioning everything to the truth to benefit both yourself and others. Its like in japji sahib when it says we use soap to wash the dirt off our bodies - similarly we use naam or true conditioning to clean our thoughts i.e. we automatically get 'polluted' by the world and sometimes we don't realise or see the truth due to unconscious effects but by being aware and alert to these we can change ourselves for the better. Good luck.

I am a surgeon in the NHS and I wear my kara. As sikhs we are allowed to wear our kara - it is protected by law and you can sue the hospital for discrimination as they allow Christains to wear their wedding bands. Please be in touch with me and I can help you send a letter to infection control and if they don't listen we can take it to court. Normally when you mention that it is protected and that their policy is discriminating and how you will take it to court, they will leave you alone. About bare below the elbows - I show my elbows as I don't think we sikhs need to 'cover up' arm skin. Now, people can see the hair on my arm and they will stare because we live in a culture and society that has female bodily hair phobia. In my case my skin is snowy white and my hair is jet black. The rest of the human race seem to have arm hair that blends with skin tone eg blonde/light brown hair on white skin or black/dark hair on dark skin. However I, like most sikhs from north panjab, have white skin with jet-black hair - it is very much noticeable to everyone due to the contrast - people cannot help but to look! I have learnt that the first time you meet someone and when they look at your hair then you interrupt and tell them straight away why you have arm hair. In my experience if you do not tell them straight away, when they are staring, it can go wrong and affect working relationships because they walk away with weird thoughts that you are lazy for not removing it, unclean for having it, incompetent and weird for doing something that they don't understand etc. I use it as a way of educating them and patients on why we sikhs don't remove hair. Its not caused me any problems but I do enjoy catching them staring and telling them straight away. Some of them turn bright red. lol.

That can be reported to the UK police and will be investigated. The court will have to then argue it out as to which 'act' it falls under. Either way punishment tends to be based on the context rather than which category it falls under.

This is completely unacceptable behaviour. I would write an email to Tesco head office stating both the time and date and name of the worker in the incident. These things are taken very seriously in the work place and racism is not tolerated under various legal acts. A couple of years ago I received bad treatment from a checkout girl at waitrose. I voiced my concerns to the store manager who fobbed me off, so I went home and looked up the email address of waitrose head office and emailed them and put in the name of the store manager and the checkout girl. It was treated very seriously - I attended a panel and gave a statement and they were both put under 'retraining' and it was added onto their employment records. In my opinion there is no place for racist treatment and you need escalate and tell the head office straight away rather than writing on this forum. After this I was treated very well and I got a voucher to do free shopping at waitrose. Here is the form for tesco - https://www.tescohelp.com/tesco/forms/cs_form.html Please email them straight away and I am more than happy to help check your email because they would want accurate statements etc. If you have a witness please add that person to the statement. If you want me to check please PM.

I... this is so true I'm laughing. As a kid the only time I was mocked for having a joora was when I was on the school minibus on the way to the swimming baths or a random trip somewhere, and some white guy would do that 'Stan Laurel' head scratch as the minibus was zooming past, lol. I went to a predominantly white primary school and a mixed secondary school wirh a greater number of white and black pupils, and nobody ever gave me any grief... to my face at least. Aside from that I've never encountered any verbal abuse or anything like that. I'm a big lad so that probably has a lot to do with it. Other less imposing Singhs I know get it real bad unfortunately.

As far as I am aware there are various thoughts on the compulsory nature of the other two - its like how some people throw in Asa Di Vaar as a morning prayer too - which it is but its not compulsory unless your in certain circles. As far as I am aware according to the Sikh Code of Conduct there are only 5 compulsory banis. If people want to add the others then you follow the same method and time can be generated to do those too.

Old people are wiser and make great leaders.

Whats the meaning to life?

This is like asking- whats the point in living when we are going to die anyway so why do we bother with working, eating sleeping when none of it counts? The answer to this and your question put bluntly is that we have no choice. We have to live, we have to do good otherwise we are going to be going around in circles as energy keeps getting converted from one form to another. Now your probably thinking yeah but all the souls become one big pool and yes its true that the world is destroyed. But its also re-created again. The process of that is not understood but once you are destroyed its not the end...the cycle still repeats itself as the world is re-created and that pool is sent to earth again....but there is an escape which does not involve this destroy world and re-create world. So in this state of complete freeness you are not sent to live earth....now to free yourself completely you have to become a certain type of energy. Actually, I think its best if we imagine ourselves as energy. So in this life we are an energy. Energy is constantly changing. Some types of energy are destructive (lightening) whilst others are productive (heat). The next time you meet someone think what type of energy they are. With Humans our thoughts, intentions, words and actions amongst other factors make us a certain type of energy and there is a level which is reached where the energy is able to escape completely. So the aim is to make yourself as good as that makes you a better energy type and even if you don't escape completely your still close enough to being free. Its difficult for me to describe this fully but imagine if your thief who just cares about yourself. You become amazingly rich through exploitation. The world admires you but when you sleep in the night the subconsious reflects your true energy and it is this energy level which decides what happens next so there is no 'i will talk' my way out of it or one religion is better than another. Its all just down to you.

Hey everyone I found an item belonging to Daljit Singh Gill from Smethwick. He is in year 8 and used to go to Handworth Grammar School but recently moved/left the school! He also has a second older brother called Ranjit Singh Gill. If you know either of them then please send me a Private message so that I can return their things. Thanks

Anyone at Handsworth Grammer in year 8? Can they contact me.

Where is that said? Please point the exact tuk. har simaran keeou sagal akaaraa || For the remembrance of the Lord, He created the whole creation aapan keeaa naanakaa aapae hee fir jaap ||1|| Through His Creation, O Nanak, He meditates on Himself Do you think u could explain this.

I think I sould re-phrase the question. Meaning of life is subjective. I would like to know the purpose of existance. If our purpose is to find God how does one find God by chanting naam?

Its about how you are going to treat people. In western culture there is no concept of treating everyone as if they were family. Western culture is very self centred where it is me against them. My family versus your family. But in eastern cultures everyone is aunty, uncle, bro, sis. It does not mean they are literally family but it is used to symbolise your moral duty to give that same respect and love to all of humanity as if they were one of your own. This symbolises all of humanity being one family where we care and feel others pain as if they were our own family. This humanity reasoning is the why everyone is addressed as if they were family. But obviously you have to marry so we will all marry within the humanity family....if you know early on that you have another intention then you shouldn't call them bro/sis.....the words then are mangetar or hooneh wali/a. So in a nutshell people use family names like aunty/uncle/bro/sis to show humantarian love.

^^Could you please expand.

I have a National Express ticket which I booked a few days ago to leave Birmingham and arrive in London. It leaves Birmingham tommorrow morning (Wednesday 24th June 09) at 9.30am and arrives in London Victoria Station at 12.20. I do not need the ticket anymore, so it will go to waste. I would rather give it to someone who needs it. If you would like it please drop me a PM!!!

Looks like its gonna go to waste. Cannot blame me for trying!

I don't believe God or sikhi is as strict as that. God is antar jani. He knows everything. And ultimately its not about praying. Alot of people think this but I don't believe that it is that simple. Its about what you learn and put into practise from the prayer. And lets remember that Guru Nanak Dev Ji did not know all of the Guru Granth Sahib and all these extra bani's we talk about. Instead bani is a method for us to learn and remind ourself of God....if u can and have time then yes you should pray....its like the story i just said about giving money....if you 10hrs in ure life and u spend them playing games and only 10 mins praying then God knows u not prayed enough and are wasting..... but lets say ure a dr....and u are oncall....then even if u said waheguru that is worth more than the person who prayed for 10mins.....similarly what if ure a pilot.....In my view God does not care about the quantity of ure prayers. Its all about quality and how much that prayer is worth relative to ure life. So with the money story say a billionaire gave £10 but a poor person gave £5....the poor person however gave more when compared to individual worth of that money. Likewise prayer for me and i believe in sikhi is not the end point. If prayer was an end point then we would be told to live in the mountains and pray all the time, to have no gristi jeevan etc. Prayer in sikhi is rather an aid.....and how it fits into different people's life various....from some people one waheguru can be enough but from others it is not. I feel its part of the bigger picture ji. But like I said majority of ppl can fit in more prayers only few like drs are unable.

like ppl said..its about learning...no point in doing prayers if u don't learn and act on them. So why pray? To remind ureself of the message everyday so u can act upon it....its like a textbook....read it everyday u remember more and learn more cos prayer has deep meanings that everytime u read it u get different level of understanding...

Fateh ji I am doing A2 Level English Language and Literature and A2 History and need tuiton. Does anyone know someone in Birmingham who can give me private tuition for these two subjects. I really need a teacher. I cannot find anyone, so even if u only know a good teacher at school could u let me know because I can ring the school and ask them if they can help me out. Thanks so much!!

looool u guys get funnier and funnier nowadays i go imperial sikh soc first of all we are not associated with niddar singh or bob or fake nihungs ( we dont even have any nihung singhs dere lol). so mr militant singh, seems like u havent been dere recently and how u can make such a bold statement doesnt make sense. there are gursikhs helping in the running of this soc. so if i was the thread creator i wuld ask the president instead of making a pointless thread on this pointless website. i will personaly speak to the president and clear up any uncertencies. we are not hindus and we know that. so i suggest u guys go and do as much paath and seva u can. instead of worrying about a small sikh soc in imperial. mind you, i personaly believe our sikh soc is way ahead of other london sikh soc's, as we are going to start vichar on japji sahib and understand gurbani. unlike the typical sikh socs where dey argue bout meat, bhangra, alcohol, jhatka, caste every week. militant singh, i invite u to come on thursday 5:30 to 7, see what the sikh soc really is before u spread lies, and yes i expect an apology from you. it is because of people like you that there are so many divisions in sikhi. propogating false messages. and why do i have the feeling that your not going to come lol. ur lost mate bhul chuk maaf sangat ji

Fateh Huxley Veer ji There is a problem with my account and thus I cannot make posts. My usual username on this forum is Sitargirl so please feel free to run a search. I would like to start off by saying that I am a huge advocator of feedback so I look favourably on comments. If you have any feedback for Imperial Sikh Soc then the first thing you should do is get in touch with the current commitee of 2008-2009 as they have been elected to run sikh soc for this academic year. You can also email the new commitee on sikh@imperial.ac.uk. As you can appreciate direct communication via email or in person is the best option rather than posting on a website as the commitee have no idea about internet posts since they do not check websites; and therefore they would be unable to help you. Infact, it was only coincidental that I came across your post so you've been very lucky. Also as your aware posting here is to no avail as no one on sikhsangat can answer your question. Instead it appears they will assume unjustifiable things where you will have people like militant veerji saying we are linked to a person that we have never heard about. Since militant veerji is not part of Imperial University and furthermore has never attended a single Imperial Sikh Soc Simran or Homeless Food Run - the nature of his reply can only highlight the sad times we live in Anyways Huxley Veerji - drop the commitee an email or you can meet them at Simran. If you don't know, Simran happens every Thursday in SAFB. All are welcome. Fateh Ji Ex- President of Imperial Sikh Soc (2007-2008)