Its That Idiot Again

[SaRpAnCh]

http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/sunny_..._democracy.html

[Sarbloh]

http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/sunny_..._democracy.html

Go in the comments sections, discuss in a rational manner and prove him wrong! He's based some of his assumption from reading threads on sikhsangat.com, which he openly states in some of his previous articles/discussions.

www.pickledpolitics.com

www.barficulture.com

[SikhSpeak]

http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/sunny_..._democracy.html

Go in the comments sections, discuss in a rational manner and prove him wrong! He's based some of his assumption from reading threads on sikhsangat.com, which he openly states in some of his previous articles/discussions.

www.pickledpolitics.com

www.barficulture.com

Im with Sarbloh on this one, I have emailed him (as my sign up to the blog wont work) DISUCSS IT RATIONALLY...we can sometimes lead to our downfall, although I appreciate this is due to passion rather than anger - it's not going to help!

here is my reply...

Dear Sunny Hundal,

Hope you are well. Sorry for using this email address, I can't seem to register on the Guardian's blogs. I wanted to ask a few questions about the article:

http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/sunny_..._democracy.html

I have read the article, my questions, being a young professional British Sikh are in response to the comments,

"Young Sikhs, for example, have followed a broadly similar trajectory, becoming more religious than their parents and even expressing desire for a Sikh homeland (Khalistan) based on Sikh values. But there is an important question to be asked here: how much of that desire for shariah or Khalistan is a result of a rational discussion and exploration of what it might mean in practice, and how much of it is simply a connection based on the search for identity?.."

I find some of these comments illfound and a matter of opinion rather than fact. I would like to know are these based on any statistical analysis or simply your opinion? If based on any facts, I do not see how this is so, as Sikhs aren't even monitored under their own ethnicity for a start. Did you know that British Sikhs is a recognised ethnicity, which alot of Sikhs DO IDENTIFY with. The search for identity stops here within Sikhs, as our identity is our heritage - our religion, hence BRITISH SIKH. We only have to look no further than Monty Panesar playing for England.

Secondly, comparing S. Law to "a Sikh homeland on Sikh values" is quite frankly showing a lack of understanding of basic tenants. Can you please tell me what these "Sikh values are?" If, some Sikhs, desire a homeland namely Khalistan, this is built on foundations of HUMAN RIGHTS and years of genocide and persuction, namely from their own Government. You simply have to contact amnesty international to find out that after the persuction of Jews in Nazi Germany Sikhs have been the victims of the worst persecution WORLDWIDE, with numbers not even known, so the extent could be worse. I find the link between both S Law to Khalistan rather ill found. There are members of the UK public who want the BNP in charge, does this mean a demise of British democracy?

Surely, defining someone as "more religious" is open to interpretation, what I deem as religious may be nothing to someone else. After all, how do you measure "being more religious?"

My point is that by illogical comparissons and simply stating opinion, this may do more harm than good, I appreciate you are entitled to your own opinion, and I can respect your views, I hope you can do the same for my counter arguements. I simply feel dividing up and boxing communities is the wrong step forward.

Take Care,

Kindest Regards

Editor@SikhSpeak.Com

[84_Survivor]

Great Reply :TH:

[(S Singh)]

Sunny Johal seems to be one of those people who try to become famous as quick as possible. They do this by dissing their own community in front of westerners. Now days, it is popular for these types of turn coats to compare religiously observant Sikhs to Muslim fundamentalists.

These types of upcoming turn coats are just following the footsteps of the likes of Ujjal Dosanjh, Balwant Gill, Tara Hare, Sukhjinder and Ramuwalia's younger brother (forgot his name). These guys are the big names in the list of sell outs in our community. Sunny Johal in comparison is still just a beginner. The list of sellouts in our community is long, while the loyal ones are few.

[jassa]

guys like him who created that website ....they dont want to know what happened and whats happening .... no matter u discuss with them even prove them wrong they will still stick to what they think is right for them its just fun nothing else .... instead of talking on net .... find his location .... and then some danda prade ....

[N30S1NGH]

No one can deny growing fanaticism within sikh panth, especially sikh youth culture,,, eithero socalled katar panthis youths on sikhsangat or katar panthis who suffer from hindu parnoia syndrome..they spent all their time passing death threats to hindus, on the mission to cuss/diss hindu culture all day along on the forums.

If thats kinda image we are potraying to others, hows that its their fault?

true soo called sikh sharia panthis youths are not terrorist but they have every intent to be- these soo called fanatics if they were given freedom and gets ak- 47 in their birthday. these idiots will do great damage to image of sikh panth and western soceity where hindu, muslims and sikhs are leaving peacefully.

its naive to suggest that sikh panth do not have fanatics with terrorist intent, i say get all the sharia panthis together from all the panth- christian, sikh, hindus, muslims, get them together lock them in room.

I dont know about others, but my nature is always been is try clean up junk and set backs of my people of my own community before pointing fingers on others. Not that i am comparing myself of great sant sipahi- sant jarnail singh khalsa bhindranwale but i m just trying to follow his foot steps, he himself in his speeches have spoken against soo called gyanis who would remove kirpans and drink alchohol off the stage.. he didnt go out blame it on third party ie- congress, rss, hindu mat and all the rubbish, he recnognize its a fault of sikhs not any phalna phalna for not following guru mat (gurmat idealogy set by guru's).

Khalsa panth is lot better off away from these soo called wanna be soorma's , i was going to make a long post on concept shaahedism in sikhi that guru's taught on sikhsangat by looking at the sad state of affairs in the youths last week but didnt get a chance, i ll do soo soon. may be that will give sangat better idea which angle i m coming from.

[Sarbloh]

No one can deny growing fanaticism within sikh panth, especially sikh youth culture,,, eithero socalled katar panthis youths on sikhsangat or katar panthis who suffer from hindu parnoia syndrome..they spent all their time passing death threats to hindus, on the mission to cuss/diss hindu culture all day along on the forums.

If thats kinda image we are potraying to others, hows that its their fault?

true soo called sikh sharia panthis youths are not terrorist but they have every intent to be- these soo called fanatics if they were given freedom and gets ak- 47 in their birthday. these idiots will do great damage to image of sikh panth and western soceity where hindu, muslims and sikhs are leaving peacefully.

its naive to suggest that sikh panth do not have fanatics with terrorist intent, i say get all the sharia panthis together from all the panth- christian, sikh, hindus, muslims, get them together lock them in room.

I dont know about others, but my nature is always been is try clean up junk and set backs of my people of my own community before pointing fingers on others. Not that i am comparing myself of great sant sipahi- sant jarnail singh khalsa bhindranwale but i m just trying to follow his foot steps, he himself in his speeches have spoken against soo called gyanis who would remove kirpans and drink alchohol off the stage.. he didnt go out blame it on third party ie- congress, rss, hindu mat and all the rubbish, he recnognize its a fault of sikhs not any phalna phalna for not following guru mat (gurmat idealogy set by guru's).

Khalsa panth is lot better off away from these soo called wanna be soorma's , i was going to make a long post on concept shaahedism in sikhi that guru's taught on sikhsangat by looking at the sad state of affairs in the youths last week but didnt get a chance, i ll do soo soon. may be that will give sangat better idea which angle i m coming from.

I have to agree with Namastang on this one!

This specific forum for example is so often hijacked with juvenile postings which only enhance the fanatical image that many of our own Punjabi/Indian community want to label us. One thing an elder veer told me once, was that Singhs need to be strategically correct in this day and age. I personally believe the recent fad of producing video promos and uploading them on youtube.com has not helped matters especially with the way Maha Gursikhs like Sant Jarnail Singh, Babber Singhs and the other Saheeds are sometimes portrayed in the popular Gangsta/Don image, with drum n base tunes as background music and comments like “Bhindrawala was the don” or “Sant Jarnail Singh was the original gangsta”. Using terminology like militant, ak-47, wearing T-shirts showing an ak-47 around the nishan sahib only adds fuel to the fundamental image which we then complain about.

Before we write articles, protest against beadbi, produce a video, design a t-shirt, do anything, we should inadvertently be thinking about how we are portraying Sikhi and how we may be misinterpreted. More long term strategic thinking required

[Guest Dancing Warrior]

Personally I think we as a people have gone too far to make any saving return. The idiocy, stupidity and intolerance are too deep imbedded. There has been too much distortion on reality of what the faith is, what the real message was. We have become the very thing our Gurus fought against; we are our own enemies, consumed in our own self propelled elitist righteousness. We are too far gone this is the reality we have lived of our history but dont have the balls to add anything to it. The real Sikhi has gone killed off by us.

You only have to read some of the crap that gets posted on this forum to know how brain dead people are. Our way of life that real people died for is going down the toilet, and all people can shout about is “beadbi campaign” “do I burn my discarded hair or dump it” “dont celebrate this, dont celebrate that” “I dropped my kanga will I go to hell?” “My veggie burger was contaminated by an atom” The list of endless although amusing to read they reflect the real uneducated mass of the future panth. This is across the board in our people and in our institutions.

Khalistan and Hindu phobia all part of the mass of todays nonsense that spew out of youngsters, as Sikhs we are so up there how can we be part of stone worshipping cave people. To those people I say invest in the space programme and take your nonsense with you to start your own whiter than white space colony.

Wake up people stop living of our history be that a doctored one in all reality, be part of history in the making, contribute to the betterment of humanity, tolerance and justice.

We have comes from the most advanced society of people and civilisation. We come from a land where kings have given up their kingdoms to contemplate on the master, where wealth had no value, where a people have never invaded another nation.

It is said that the human species continuously evolves, why do we devolve?

An elderly gentleman a devote Hindu said to me the other day “Gone are the days where the elder son of a Hindu family would be given to a Guru to become a Sikh” he continued “The problem today is Hindus do not recognise the unquestionable and immense input of Sikhs throughout time, The immense sacrifice the Gurus made”, he continued “The Sikhs today have elevated themselves to say to Hindus we are better than you, and we a separate people, you are inferior” The gentleman was very elderly and continued to tell me about his childhood “when my brother and I went to boarding school in Bombay we were taken to the train station by my father and would have to make the very long journey ourselves” “My mother used to say to my father” “Find a Sikh, a Sardar who is going the same way ask him to watch over our children,”

“gone are those days”

[Guest militant singh]

we aint terrorists or sepratists we r da resurgance of the calls for freedom and nufin mre Khalistan isnt nonsense its a goal ......KHALISTAN ZINDABAD traitors and h8ers like sunny hundal will always exist we hve jus gta learn to hw 2 put up wth them