Stop Anti-muslim Threads

[Babbar Shere]

There is something so flawed with all your arguments. One big factor is technology. This has largely led to less of a need for bravery and more strategic technical skills. It isn't the same situation today as a few hundred years ago.

Bottom line. If you don't apply some common sense to your thinking we may all suffer.

no paji, if WE dont apply some bani into what WERE thinging, then we may all suffer

[dalsingh101]

There it is clear to see. The dividing line.

On one side a camp which feels that in addition to spiritual matters there is a need to address worldly concerns with a realistic, logical approach grounded in reality.

In the other camp people suggesting that a strong concentration on prayer alone will resolve all issues.

Given the Miri Piri concept I know which one I feel is appropriate and realistic. The fact that the Gurus themselves took action to widen Sikhism to incorporate preparation and dealing with real life situations in addition to the core practice of simran sort of says it all to me.

Just a personal opinion that I don't expect everyone to share but in times of crisis I would rather have leadership that is prudent, intelligent and world aware than someone whose life centres on prayer alone (note that I'm not saying prayer isn't important)

This is the big problem some people interpret Sikhism in a way that produces all solutions through simran, however some think that world consciousness and dealing with what comes with that is also of crucial importance. It is like each side has a mental block to what the other is saying at times. But the purely practical side of what the camp that pushes the world consciousness is very strong and it seems that for some reason people adopt the most simple thinking that lacks any foresight as a result of their spirituality. Sikhs have been caught in soem really messy situations in the past because of really simple thinking. I guess we may well have to go through those again as we seem to have learnt nothing from them...oh well...

[Babbar Shere]

Just a personal opinion that I don't expect everyone to share but in times of crisis I would rather have leadership that is prudent, intelligent and world aware than someone whose life centres on prayer alone (note that I'm not saying prayer isn't important)

Maybe you just dont understand power of gurbani yet paji.

NOBODY ON HERE SAID ANYTHING ABOUT SITTING AROUND ALL DAY AND JUST DOING PAATH, OR SIMRAN. EVERYONE HAS SAID THAT PHYICISAL AND MENTAL STRENGH GO HAND-IN-HAND. BUT YOU HAVE NEVER AGREED TO THAT, EVERY ONE OF YOU POST YOU FIND SOMETHING NEW TO SAY.

Since you wanna look at it like that, fine, tell me what sant jarnail singh ji did that you would consider "prepareing physically", tell me how he was phiscally built and how that was a factor??

[rupinder singh]

If we were truly following dharma then we would realize that theres nothing prayer cant achieve. Have a discourse with any gursikh who has experienced the lowest of the lowest situation and ask them what got them out of it. Prayer even gives the strength, the focus, the strategy, the martial skills. In times of warfare Sikhs always kept the diwans going, from the times of Guru Hargobind Sahib right through to Bluestar, whatever was going on the Gursikhs ensure that the prayer, nitnem, simran, bani carried on. At the end of the day is that not what we are really defending?

[wjkk wjkf]

slok mÚ 3 ]

salok ma 3 ||

Salok, Third Mehla:

jgqu AigAwnI AMDu hY dUjY Bwie krm kmwie ]

jagath agiaanee a(n)dhh hai dhoojai bhaae karam kamaae ||

The world is blind and ignorant; in the love of duality, it engages in actions.

dUjY Bwie jyqy krm kry duKu lgY qin Dwie ]

dhoojai bhaae jaethae karam karae dhukh lagai than dhhaae ||

But those actions which are performed in the love of duality, cause only pain to the body.

gur prswdI suKu aUpjY jw gur kw sbdu kmwie ]

gur parasaadhee sukh oopajai jaa gur kaa sabadh kamaae ||

By Guru's Grace, peace wells up, when one acts according to the Word of the Guru's Shabad.

scI bwxI krm kry Anidnu nwmu iDAwie ]

sachee baanee karam karae anadhin naam dhhiaae ||

He acts according to the True Word of the Guru's Bani; night and day, he meditates on the Naam, the Name of the Lord.

nwnk ijqu Awpy lwey iqqu lgy khxw ikCU n jwie ]1]

naanak jith aapae laaeae thith lagae kehanaa kishhoo n jaae ||1||

O Nanak, as the Lord Himself engages him, so is he engaged; no one has any say in this matter. ||1||

[Babbar Shere]

If we were truly following dharma then we would realize that theres nothing prayer cant achieve. Have a discourse with any gursikh who has experienced the lowest of the lowest situation and ask them what got them out of it. Prayer even gives the strength, the focus, the strategy, the martial skills. In times of warfare Sikhs always kept the diwans going, from the times of Guru Hargobind Sahib right through to Bluestar, whatever was going on the Gursikhs ensure that the prayer, nitnem, simran, bani carried on. At the end of the day is that not what we are really defending?

hanji hanji!!

[Ranjeet]

It is important not to insult people of other faiths and ideologies.But we can be critical?

however we must also remember just because we as Sikhs are tolerant of others, it does not mean that others are tolerant of us.

Even though we should show no emnity to others, this does not mean others will not show emnity to us.

It is important to understand throughout history our people have been attacked for no other reason that us being Sikh.

I would personally just rather focus on Sikhi, however it is important to understand other religions and ideologies, understand their mindest, their motives, so we can counter them at every point, even to the point that we can anticpate what they will do next.

Remember, the price of being Sikh is eternal vigilance.

[dalsingh101]

Remember, the price of being Sikh is eternal vigilance.

People need to wake up to this and not jump around when things go pear shaped wondering "what the hell???"

[Babbar Shere]

It is important not to insult people of other faiths and ideologies.But we can be critical?

however we must also remember just because we as Sikhs are tolerant of others, it does not mean that others are tolerant of us.

Even though we should show no emnity to others, this does not mean others will not show emnity to us.

It is important to understand throughout history our people have been attacked for no other reason that us being Sikh.

I would personally just rather focus on Sikhi, however it is important to understand other religions and ideologies, understand their mindest, their motives, so we can counter them at every point, even to the point that we can anticpate what they will do next.

Remember, the price of being Sikh is eternal vigilance.

counter other faiths? no

becasue all faiths are here for reason, and are all right

for sikh, they are all equal. thats not what sikhy teachs "counter faiths, and anticpate what they will do next"

if we would acutaly read bani, you guys will see, that nowhere does guru ji say a faith is wrong, or does he say we need to counter them.

he tell us how each faith can become true to what it preaches.

never does he say that faiths are fake or false

he shows on how to become true to who you are.

its not the faith we can counter, as no faith can be countered.

its some people within that faith that might effect others from other faiths that need countering.

the price of being sikh? are you kidding me? wat is that suppose to mean?

i dont care who one is, or who they might claim to be. i dont care what one might have accomplished in life. or what one plans on doing. if it does not involve bani, its worthless. before anything, we are sikh, and that word means to learn, we are life long learners. and we learn from bani.....

[no_0ne]

I know this is off topic but do any of you know about this:

http://www.ummah.com/forum/showthread.php?p=1510823