Destruction Of Sikhi By The Uk Youth

[THE WARRIOR]

Just to respond to some of the comments which have been made, which I feel I need to give clarity on.

I want to know what have you done about it? have you approach the couple on stage? why are you letting this happen if you know about it and if your older enough.

Seem people of your age are quick to point the finiger at others.

Removal of hair we need to support our sisters and give them the courage to continue in there rehit.

Again with B/F and G/F thing if you see this happening talk to a gursikh who knows them or approach them with pyar.

Sikhi is still growing stronger as it was then singh ji but people like you want something to say and want to be looked up to but just full of nindiya and hunkar i think.

Why not give soultion on how you would like to improve things lol

Morakh Ji. As I said in my post I along with others have approached numerous people with pyar yet we are faced with the fact that these actions are considered normal and as such we are challenged in reverse as to how dare we say anything. Because they are considered the norm everyone is accepting of those actions. My intention is not to point fingers hence why I have not referred to any individuals within the posting.

My intention is also not to speak for the sake of speaking but to highlight a huge problem which we all know exists, but for some reason are silent on these points. I do not recall doing any nindiya in my post and I am humbly seeking guidance as to why we are in the situation we are faced with today.

I am also very pleased that THE WARRIOR has also given his view since in the response below are the key excuses given by those who are doing all these things. To respond to his acquisition of distorting Gurbani, that is not my intention and if any thukh has been used out of context then he should highlight it. The thukh guramukh rom rom har dhhiaavai || referes to bibia and singh not just one party. From sakhia I have read and heard with respect to spiritually enlighted individuals, this thukh is not metaphorical but it is literal. In that you can hear gurmantar from their raum. If the language was metaphorical what is it that Guru Ji is trying to refer to then, what updesh is being given?

I don’t have any Gian, but I do have some common sense,

Very well, one example

guramukh rom rom har dhhiaavai ||

The Gurmukh meditates on the Lord with every hair of his body

This is metaphoric language, its got nothing to do with Bibia and what they decide to do with their body hair. Its not literal. It’s this sort of mentality that put people off.

Nothing the poster has enlightened on here has dug any type of hole for me, how people choose to live is entirely up to them, consciously or unconsciously freedom of will is fundamental no two persons Karma is alike therefore what applies to one does not necessarily apply to others.

If you want to reach out to people it should be unconditional, anything else is false.

Above I perceive we have an example of the type of belief which is leading to the current endemic. I have heard numerous times from people who I have approached to discuss their actions how it is their own karma. However in Sikhi when we give our head we loose our freedom of will or don’t we? Karma refers to previous deeds. This is where Guru Nank Dev Ji States:

jo mai keeaa so mai paaeiaa dhos n dheejai avar janaa ||21||

Whatever I did, for that I have suffered; I do not blame anyone else.

Sikhi is also not unconditional. There are numerous conditions given when we take amrit. There are also numerous handwritten Hukamnamae from the Gurus which also give orders on what Sikhs should do. So how can applying conditions be false? The biggest condition we have is from Guru Ram Das:

gur sathigur kaa jo sikh akhaaeae s bhalakae out(h) har naam dhhiaavai ||

One who calls himself a Sikh of the Guru, the True Guru, shall rise in the early morning hours and meditate on the Lord's Name.

You still continue to push your agenda by quoting Gurbani, I sincerely would suggest you address this. Rather then dismantle your whole argument piece by piece I’ll go straight for the kill, because that’s how warriors work ,metaphorically speaking

Your comment

“Karma refers to previous deeds”

Obviously clueless, here the spiritually enlighten individuals who explained the concept of “guramukh rom rom har dhhiaavai” which they claim literally to be “The Gurmukh meditates on the Lord with every hair of his body” failed to explain how the Karmic Structure works, possibly you may have forgotten to ask but fundamentally your very existence is based on this…….by even trying to deplete a type karma you also create a type of karma…it is all karma…your doing it right now and you don’t even know.

You may want to ring up a bhai sahib somewhere and get an opinion on this.

Anyways me got no more time for this…. Me out Jamming to Iron Lion Zion!

[Guest militant singh]

ppl lke niddar nang & his chele lke dancin warrior and bomb dwn his crappy akhara fing chat crap and confuse da youth,do a search on da forum abt da fingz he does,da warrior we knw who u r

[THE WARRIOR]

ppl lke niddar nang & his chele lke dancin warrior and bomb dwn his crappy akhara fing chat crap and confuse da youth,do a search on da forum abt da fingz he does,da warrior we knw who u r

Thank you for your positive review, you may know who I am, but obviously you still don’t know how to spell.

JAH!

[bhai sahib ji]

You still continue to push your agenda by quoting Gurbani, I sincerely would suggest you address this. Rather then dismantle your whole argument piece by piece I’ll go straight for the kill, because that’s how warriors work ,metaphorically speaking

Your comment

“Karma refers to previous deeds”

Obviously clueless, here the spiritually enlighten individuals who explained the concept of “guramukh rom rom har dhhiaavai” which they claim literally to be “The Gurmukh meditates on the Lord with every hair of his body” failed to explain how the Karmic Structure works, possibly you may have forgotten to ask but fundamentally your very existence is based on this…….by even trying to deplete a type karma you also create a type of karma…it is all karma…your doing it right now and you don’t even know.

You may want to ring up a bhai sahib somewhere and get an opinion on this.

Anyways me got no more time for this…. Me out Jamming to Iron Lion Zion!

WARRIOR Ji

I am not attempting to push any agenda. All I want to know is why is the current activity acceptable within the youth. A very simple question which I think you may have the answer to. Please do not run away just yet since you have not managed to go for the kill.

With regard to karma you are utilising the Hindu definition, as you know if you go to Wikipedia numerous religions have numerous definitions. But let us see what Guru Ji has to say.

Guru Nanak Dev Ji states:

karamee aavai kaparraa nadharee mokh dhuaar ||

By the karma of past actions, the robe of this physical body is obtained. By His Grace, the Gate of Liberation is found.

Whereas a shabad by Guru Amar Das Ji makes it very explicit:

hukamae karam kamaavanae paeiai kirath firaao ||

According to the Lord's Command, people perform their actions; they wander around, driven by the karma of their past actions.

hukamae dharasan dhaekhanaa jeh bhaejehi theh jaao ||

By the Lord's Command, they behold the Blessed Vision of His Darshan. Wherever He sends them, there they go.

hukamae har har man vasai hukamae sach samaao ||5||

By His Command, the Lord, Har, Har, abides within our minds; by His Command we merge in Truth. ||5||

hukam n jaanehi bapurrae bhoolae firehi gavaar ||

The wretched fools do not know the Lord's Will; they wander around making mistakes.

manehat(h) karam kamaavadhae nith nith hohi khuaar ||

They go about their business stubborn-mindedly; they are disgraced forever and ever.

a(n)thar saa(n)th n aavee naa sach lagai piaar ||6||

Inner peace does not come to them; they do not embrace love for the True Lord. ||6||

guramukheeaa muh sohanae gur kai haeth piaar ||

Beautiful are the faces of the Gurmukhs, who bear love and affection for the Guru.

sachee bhagathee sach rathae dhar sachai sachiaar ||

Through true devotional worship, they are attuned to Truth; at the True Door, they are found to be true.

aaeae sae paravaan hai sabh kul kaa karehi oudhhaar ||7||

Blessed is their coming into being; they redeem all their ancestors. ||7||

sabh nadharee karam kamaavadhae nadharee baahar n koe ||

All do their deeds under the Lord's Glance of Grace; no one is beyond His Vision.

jaisee nadhar kar dhaekhai sachaa thaisaa hee ko hoe ||

According to the Glance of Grace with which the True Lord beholds us, so do we become.

naanak naam vaddaaeeaa karam paraapath hoe ||8||3||20||

O Nanak, the Glorious Greatness of the Naam, the Name of the Lord, is received only by His Mercy. ||8||3||20||

So please rather than referring to Hindu definitions lets stick with what Guru Sahib has said to us and you cannot get more clearer than what Guru Amar Das has stated. The shabad also answers your point in relation to "If you want to reach out to people it should be unconditional, anything else is false" in that Guru Ji states "The wretched fools do not know the Lord's Will; they wander around making mistakes" Therefore by living within Guru Ji's will there is a condition.

I would welcome your thoughts on this, which I am sure you will provide since with being a Warrior and all I don't expect you to run away.

[fauji07]

just behappy there is still sikh youth. i think its fine that people act on there own accord so that there will be more sikhs. because if there are more sikhs then it will be easier for the gurmukhs who want to practise sikhi strickly because sikhs will become recognised by the larger society. im just happy when i see a sikh i don't start judging them on rehet but then again im from the states where there arn't many of us.

[THE WARRIOR]

You still continue to push your agenda by quoting Gurbani, I sincerely would suggest you address this. Rather then dismantle your whole argument piece by piece I’ll go straight for the kill, because that’s how warriors work ,metaphorically speaking

Your comment

“Karma refers to previous deeds”

Obviously clueless, here the spiritually enlighten individuals who explained the concept of “guramukh rom rom har dhhiaavai” which they claim literally to be “The Gurmukh meditates on the Lord with every hair of his body” failed to explain how the Karmic Structure works, possibly you may have forgotten to ask but fundamentally your very existence is based on this…….by even trying to deplete a type karma you also create a type of karma…it is all karma…your doing it right now and you don’t even know.

You may want to ring up a bhai sahib somewhere and get an opinion on this.

Anyways me got no more time for this…. Me out Jamming to Iron Lion Zion!

WARRIOR Ji

I am not attempting to push any agenda. All I want to know is why is the current activity acceptable within the youth. A very simple question which I think you may have the answer to. Please do not run away just yet since you have not managed to go for the kill.

With regard to karma you are utilising the Hindu definition, as you know if you go to Wikipedia numerous religions have numerous definitions. But let us see what Guru Ji has to say.

Guru Nanak Dev Ji states:

karamee aavai kaparraa nadharee mokh dhuaar ||

By the karma of past actions, the robe of this physical body is obtained. By His Grace, the Gate of Liberation is found.

Whereas a shabad by Guru Amar Das Ji makes it very explicit:

hukamae karam kamaavanae paeiai kirath firaao ||

According to the Lord's Command, people perform their actions; they wander around, driven by the karma of their past actions.

hukamae dharasan dhaekhanaa jeh bhaejehi theh jaao ||

By the Lord's Command, they behold the Blessed Vision of His Darshan. Wherever He sends them, there they go.

hukamae har har man vasai hukamae sach samaao ||5||

By His Command, the Lord, Har, Har, abides within our minds; by His Command we merge in Truth. ||5||

hukam n jaanehi bapurrae bhoolae firehi gavaar ||

The wretched fools do not know the Lord's Will; they wander around making mistakes.

manehat(h) karam kamaavadhae nith nith hohi khuaar ||

They go about their business stubborn-mindedly; they are disgraced forever and ever.

a(n)thar saa(n)th n aavee naa sach lagai piaar ||6||

Inner peace does not come to them; they do not embrace love for the True Lord. ||6||

guramukheeaa muh sohanae gur kai haeth piaar ||

Beautiful are the faces of the Gurmukhs, who bear love and affection for the Guru.

sachee bhagathee sach rathae dhar sachai sachiaar ||

Through true devotional worship, they are attuned to Truth; at the True Door, they are found to be true.

aaeae sae paravaan hai sabh kul kaa karehi oudhhaar ||7||

Blessed is their coming into being; they redeem all their ancestors. ||7||

sabh nadharee karam kamaavadhae nadharee baahar n koe ||

All do their deeds under the Lord's Glance of Grace; no one is beyond His Vision.

jaisee nadhar kar dhaekhai sachaa thaisaa hee ko hoe ||

According to the Glance of Grace with which the True Lord beholds us, so do we become.

naanak naam vaddaaeeaa karam paraapath hoe ||8||3||20||

O Nanak, the Glorious Greatness of the Naam, the Name of the Lord, is received only by His Mercy. ||8||3||20||

So please rather than referring to Hindu definitions lets stick with what Guru Sahib has said to us and you cannot get more clearer than what Guru Amar Das has stated. The shabad also answers your point in relation to "If you want to reach out to people it should be unconditional, anything else is false" in that Guru Ji states "The wretched fools do not know the Lord's Will; they wander around making mistakes" Therefore by living within Guru Ji's will there is a condition.

I would welcome your thoughts on this, which I am sure you will provide since with being a Warrior and all I don't expect you to run away.

Thank you for your recommendations but I don’t use Wikipedia for any knowledge.You haven’t disproved anything I’ve stated your simply continuing to do the exact same thing again and again you're totally oblivious to your actions, you continue to quote Gurbani totally out of context. Whose actions are more negative yours or those you judge and criticise?

There is no difference between Hindu Karma, Sikh Karma, Christian Karma, Karma is Karma. There are no separate processes they all are fundamentally the same.

reread the sentence

"If YOU want to reach out to people it should be unconditional, anything else is false"

Let me explain this to you, what it means is if you were genuine and truly concerned you would reach out to people unconditionally, you wouldn’t care what people have done are doing, who are you to judge anyone? Your actions are false simply because you have chosen to judge certain people you don’t live according to your standards, your “high jeevans” how can you know anyone? You don’t even realise its absolutely wrong to misquote Bani to suit your argument.

“The wretched fools do not know the Lord's Will”

THE LORDS WILL, NOT YOURS!

You are not a bailiff for the Lord, sorry but you are not the chosen one. This may be a shocking revelation but it’s the truth.

[guptveer1469]

cool arguements

[OhTwadi]

.

[kaur_khalistani_lioness]

sabh nadharee karam kamaavadhae nadharee baahar n koe ||

All do their deeds under the Lord's Glance of Grace; no one is beyond His Vision.

jaisee nadhar kar dhaekhai sachaa thaisaa hee ko hoe ||

According to the Glance of Grace with which the True Lord beholds us, so do we become.

naanak naam vaddaaeeaa karam paraapath hoe ||8||3||20||

O Nanak, the Glorious Greatness of the Naam, the Name of the Lord, is received only by His Mercy. ||8||3||20||

do those last words count for anything? maybe im not understanding the whole shabd correctly?=(

isnt that the answer for this whole thread?

---

anyhow

ur question why has this become a norm?

(jus some of the things discuused amongst some of my "friends")

because youth these days see the hypocrisy of some of the so called "ck" people they looked up to earlier and dont wanna be like them.

then there is lack of understanding (of sikhi)...

another is seeing many people get away with their wrong doings...without understanding if those peeps are really happy inside.

g/f or b/f ...because many of the youths' parents arent amritdhari thus its acceptable (in their fam) to have such relationships to find a life partner.

the biggest and most common reason>>> cuz they the YOUTH! in jaawaanii's craze there are only few who think of their actions. in jaawaaani...as wise(siyaanay) have said a person thinks no ones watching um, we feel we can do anything...and yes we can lol (but thn we regret the wrong done when we get old), ...i guess thats why its also refred to as "Jawwaanii da Nasshaa" by some :s

basically ..sometimes spiritual significance of the things we do isnt given...thus we do what we do

these are jus some thoughts from a very narrow perspective i guess...

so forgive me for writtin them down...

lets help each other out and live a life guru sahib wants us to live....free of fear(this could be debated what knd of fear?) and filled with LOVE AND COMPASSION

may waheguru bless us with the good virtues

bhul chuk muaff karni...

[NIHANG_AK47]

they'll be telling niddar on friday in the akhara how they told us all on sikh sangat how extreme our views r. hoping that nang niddar will give em a pat on the back. i used to see em wen i went LOL stupids nangs. go ask ur boys how they got beat up at oldbury gurdwara and how niddar ran away to his car while his chela got beats and how they all went and told the police. so much for the vanguard.