Jump to content

B4 The British Took Over Punjab


Recommended Posts

iv been thinking about this for a long time, b4 the British took over the mother land, was we all amritdari?

so as time has progressed we allowed it?

waheguru jee ka khalsa, waheguru jee kee fateh..

Put simply...NO.

A prime example of which was the great Maharaja Ranjit Singh, who buy all accounts partoke in hunting, eating meat, taking multiple wives and patronising hindu temples and Gods. Even the Khalsa Dal's succide squads, the Nihangs, can only be losely described as being amritdari wrt the 20 century construct of the rohit marydaya.

:gg:

Link to post
Share on other sites
iv been thinking about this for a long time, b4 the British took over the mother land, was we all amritdari?

so as time has progressed we allowed it?

waheguru jee ka khalsa, waheguru jee kee fateh..

Put simply...NO.

A prime example of which was the great Maharaja Ranjit Singh, who buy all accounts partoke in hunting, eating meat, taking multiple wives and patronising hindu temples and Gods. Even the Khalsa Dal's succide squads, the Nihangs, can only be losely described as being amritdari wrt the 20 century construct of the rohit marydaya.

:gg:

With one example you can't label that majority of our forefathers weren't amritdhari.. Veerje, your example doesn't justify anything :)

Khalsa Dal's succide squads
I seriously doubt that there was any sucide group. Every single person in mom/dad's grandparents were all amritdhari and they were far more liberal type of common farmers.. So my guess is that majority of the pop. were Amritdhari before and after Ranjit Singh's Raj. The decline started in early 70's
Link to post
Share on other sites
Every single person in mom/dad's grandparents were all amritdhari and they were far more liberal type of common farmers.. So my guess is that majority of the pop. were Amritdhari before and after Ranjit Singh's Raj. The decline started in early 70's

i've posed this question about how many Amritdhari's there were back in the day to both my grandmother and my mum and this is what i got from both:

My grandmother (84 years old) states that she had never seen or even heard of that a woman could be Amritdhari and that its only the 1970's that she even saw an Amritdhari bibi...she states that in her younger years she had only ever seen 2 or 3 Amritdhari even after marriage but what she did know whas that those 2 or 3 were pakke singhs...they'd NEVER wear a pajami...even if it was freezing cold...and that everyone respected them big time. She said she had never heard any parchar at all and had not even heard of Sri Darbar Sahib!!!

My mum (52 yrs old) states that up until marriage she had not even been told a sakhi about any of the Guroo's...she knew not what Vaisakhi was but was constantly narrated tales of the Hindu Gods and that her entire pind had sharda in the mandir and not the Gurdwara..she says no parchar was ever done in the Gurdwara, only sangrand nu matta tekna..other than that all parchaar was done at the mandir. She states that from what she can recall that this was that case for all the villages that her cousins villages from too. She says anything she knows about Gurmat was when she came to UK and that Sikhi on a mainstream level only happened after 1975+ and that before while everyone one was proud to be 'sardar' but looking back they could quite easily be refferred to as being Hindu.

The above is not my opinion..its just what i've been told

Link to post
Share on other sites
Every single person in mom/dad's grandparents were all amritdhari and they were far more liberal type of common farmers.. So my guess is that majority of the pop. were Amritdhari before and after Ranjit Singh's Raj. The decline started in early 70's

i've posed this question about how many Amritdhari's there were back in the day to both my grandmother and my mum and this is what i got from both:

My grandmother (84 years old) states that she had never seen or even heard of that a woman could be Amritdhari and that its only the 1970's that she even saw an Amritdhari bibi...she states that in her younger years she had only ever seen 2 or 3 Amritdhari even after marriage but what she did know whas that those 2 or 3 were pakke singhs...they'd NEVER wear a pajami...even if it was freezing cold...and that everyone respected them big time. She said she had never heard any parchar at all and had not even heard of Sri Darbar Sahib!!!

My mum (52 yrs old) states that up until marriage she had not even been told a sakhi about any of the Guroo's...she knew not what Vaisakhi was but was constantly narrated tales of the Hindu Gods and that her entire pind had sharda in the mandir and not the Gurdwara..she says no parchar was ever done in the Gurdwara, only sangrand nu matta tekna..other than that all parchaar was done at the mandir. She states that from what she can recall that this was that case for all the villages that her cousins villages from too. She says anything she knows about Gurmat was when she came to UK and that Sikhi on a mainstream level only happened after 1975+ and that before while everyone one was proud to be 'sardar' but looking back they could quite easily be refferred to as being Hindu.

The above is not my opinion..its just what i've been told

woah, i'm in complete shock!

and people ask why we demand Khalistan!

Link to post
Share on other sites

I know i only gave one example, that of Maharajah Ranjit Singh, but with respect he did represent the Sikh Empire/Confederacy of Lahore and their is a wealth of historical artefacts on him and his life. On other Sikhs of the era circa 1849 not that much is known unless you go by the biased accounts of Cunningham and McAufcliffe, both of whom spun Sikh history to suit their own ulterior motive; i.e. to preserve the British Raj Acien regime.

My own thinking is that at the time (1799 - 1849) to be termed a SIkh would be a pretty loose coda, a mix full of Sufi and Hindu influeneces. Remember the Rohit Marydarna wasn'nt codified until the 1920s and Jatt acceptance of the code was patchy to say thew least.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Every single person in mom/dad's grandparents were all amritdhari and they were far more liberal type of common farmers.. So my guess is that majority of the pop. were Amritdhari before and after Ranjit Singh's Raj. The decline started in early 70's

i've posed this question about how many Amritdhari's there were back in the day to both my grandmother and my mum and this is what i got from both:

My grandmother (84 years old) states that she had never seen or even heard of that a woman could be Amritdhari and that its only the 1970's that she even saw an Amritdhari bibi...she states that in her younger years she had only ever seen 2 or 3 Amritdhari even after marriage but what she did know whas that those 2 or 3 were pakke singhs...they'd NEVER wear a pajami...even if it was freezing cold...and that everyone respected them big time. She said she had never heard any parchar at all and had not even heard of Sri Darbar Sahib!!!

My mum (52 yrs old) states that up until marriage she had not even been told a sakhi about any of the Guroo's...she knew not what Vaisakhi was but was constantly narrated tales of the Hindu Gods and that her entire pind had sharda in the mandir and not the Gurdwara..she says no parchar was ever done in the Gurdwara, only sangrand nu matta tekna..other than that all parchaar was done at the mandir. She states that from what she can recall that this was that case for all the villages that her cousins villages from too. She says anything she knows about Gurmat was when she came to UK and that Sikhi on a mainstream level only happened after 1975+ and that before while everyone one was proud to be 'sardar' but looking back they could quite easily be refferred to as being Hindu.

The above is not my opinion..its just what i've been told

This sounds quite similar to my own family experience; my mother (47 yrs old of the Brar Gothra) had little knowledge of Sikhism bar the basic fundamentals (that of beliving in the GGS and the Gurus); she hadn't even herad of the Sau Sakhis and the Zafarnama etc; and she lived in the Punjab til she was eighteen. As a child we would visit Hindu Madirs and have pictures of San Sorshi Mata at our house., alongside the Guru Nanak and Guru Gobind.

It it only within the last five years that i've noticed the ultimate aim of amrit dari Sikhs to become Armit Chakria.

Please do not personally critice me or my family this is just MY subjective observation.

Link to post
Share on other sites

There might be chances of religious geographical differences, such as Amritsar, gurdaspur were more religious than other regions during 19th cent. Border area, known as Guru ki nagri because of so many historical gurdwaras and this keeps people in constant touch with their faith.

Some examples are that during 40's/50's.. all students of Khalsa College (amritsar) were 99% keshadhari and majority of them were amritdhari. There were so many small khalsa school to spread the prachar. This was the result of the Singh Sabha Movement started in early 1900's to bring back lost sikhs since 1830's.

Another example is that its because of religious views that sikhs started to oppose british goverment who were taking advantage of punjabis. Ouru Guru Sahib jees told us clearly not to live like a slave and always protect innocent and thats our freedom fighters did. So many did shaheedian for morchay and its not easy to be part of jatha to give up ur life for the rightous without being religious.

There may few part of our community who may stayed from religious life maybe their area might had less prachar because of lack of transportation to go to religious places (Punjab at that time was HUGE). As of whole picture i think our community was pretty much deeply religious (amritdhari) as compared to today..

Link to post
Share on other sites

unfortunately this aspect is almost entirely HISstory.

It was common to provide Amrit to many of the masses without them realizing its purpose. I know elders now who are actually quite strict with their practice, and always have been, but never understood it fully until now.

Also, stupidstitions and illogical thinking is ingrained in previous generations, don't know why however.

For the most part, hisstory will remain exactly that.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Just to balance the family stories out.....my family is the complete opposite. Everyone was amritdhari. It was uncommon to find anyone who had not taken Amrit and most of the children had taken Amrit too. This is all from what my nana ji told me. He would have been in his 90's or 100's.

He was from Pakistan Punjab (dunno if this makes a difference) but anyways he knew about the Guru's etc when he was young. His family used to tell Sakhi's at bedtime. And no girl was married into the family unless they had taken Amrit.

But I also remember him sayin there was a lot more integration back in the days. People were happier to visit Hindu Mandirs, Muslims were happy to come Gurdwara etc. He was quite hurt by the fact that the youth of today were hating pakistan when Pakistan as he said was India anyway.... Back in the day it wasn't like tht....everyone just got along and enjoyed the experience...but anyways i agree with S1ngh the impression i got was that people were more religious then and there were more amritdharis....I do believe there ha been a decline esp if you look at the youth of Punjab today.

Link to post
Share on other sites

The first Sikh in our dynasty (Royal dynasty from Orissa who settled in the Doaba in the 10th century and also ruled the Doaba), was a contempary of Akali Baba Phula Singh. The Gurus did most parchar in the Majha area, but not in Doaba. Thats why that Sikhs in Doaba form just 45% of the population, while in Majha they make 61% of the Population. But Akali Phula Singhji who were Doabi themself, did parchar of Sikhi in the area, the first Sikh to do so, and had results. IN that process, the great grandfather of my great grandfather, who was born in the beginning of the 19th century (anytime between 1800 and 1820), took amrit from the hands of Akali Phula Singh ji. From there all were amritdhari in the family. Till my grandfather, who was born in the 1930s, all were amritdhari. Howhever my dad tells me that his grandfather (my great grandfather) was amritdhari and wore gatra, but his grandmother didn't wear gatra... So this says something about Amrit and women in the olden times.

Sikhi was considered same as Hinduism in many areas of Punjab, where Sikhs were in the minority and Hindus were the majority. That explains why still many traditional Sardar homes have Hindu deities pics alongside that of our Gurus. That also explains why Sikhs (atleast in my area, as I witnesses last year in india) go to the mandir and consider Hindu deities as equals to our Gurus.

Sikhi wasnt the same it is now.

Some estimates by me (Bhul Chuk Maaf)

1469 - 1708 - REAL SIKHI

1708 - 1849 - 99% Fake SIKHI

1849 - 1947 - 50% Fake SIKHI

1947 - 1978 - 35% Fake SIKHI

1978 - 1995 - 20% Fake SIKHI

1995 - 2008 - 10-15% Fake SIKHI

Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
  • advertisement_alt
  • advertisement_alt
  • advertisement_alt


×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

Terms of Use