bowing to sants

[Pheena]

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

actually, bhenji, sants are also here forever

bani says sants never die

bhula chuka maf

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

vwihgurU jI kw Kwlsw!

vwihgurU jI kI &iqh!!

True, sants are here forever.

BUT NO-ONE can tell who's a sant, and whos not. Seriously, as someone mentioned in a different post, there were no "sants" in Gurujee's time... even those Gurmukhs who had written in the Guru Granth Sahib were not called Sant. Now, suddenly, we have a million of 'em?

vwihgurU jI kw Kwlsw!

vwihgurU jI kI &iqh!!

No ONe???? that is an exageration ji. yes it is difficult to know the fake from the real, but regardless if you honesly go to an indivi

dual regarded as a saint and you go with open heart, wide open to receive whatever is given, you will know whether this person is a fake or a real.

I will post an article out of a book which explains this in detail.

[V]

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

actually, bhenji, sants are also here forever

bani says sants never die

bhula chuka maf

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

vwihgurU jI kw Kwlsw!

vwihgurU jI kI &iqh!!

True, sants are here forever.

BUT NO-ONE can tell who's a sant, and whos not. Seriously, as someone mentioned in a different post, there were no "sants" in Gurujee's time... even those Gurmukhs who had written in the Guru Granth Sahib were not called Sant. Now, suddenly, we have a million of 'em?

vwihgurU jI kw Kwlsw!

vwihgurU jI kI &i

qh!!

No ONe???? that is an exageration ji. yes it is difficult to know the fake from the real, but regardless if you honesly go to an individual regarded as a saint and you go with open heart, wide open to receive whatever is given, you will know whether this person is a fake or a real.

I will post an article out of a book which explains this in detail.

Bhramgyani ki gat BHRAHMGYANI JANE!

bhull chukk maaf

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

[Pheena]

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

actually, bhenji, sants are also here forever

bani says sants never die

bhula chuka maf

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

vwihgurU jI kw Kwlsw!

vwihgurU jI kI &iqh!!

True, sants are here forever.

BUT NO-ONE can tell who's a sant, and whos not. Seriously, as someone mentioned in a different post, there were no "sants" in Gurujee's time... even those Gurmukhs who had wri

tten in the Guru Granth Sahib were not called Sant. Now, suddenly, we have a million of 'em?

vwihgurU jI kw Kwlsw!

vwihgurU jI kI &iqh!!

No ONe???? that is an exageration ji. yes it is difficult to know the fake from the real, but regardless if you honesly go to an individual regarded as a saint and you go with open heart, wide open to receive whatever is given, you will know whether this person is a fake or a real.

I will post an article out of a book which explains this in detail.

Bhramgyani ki gat BHRAHMGYANI JANE!

bhull chukk maaf

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

yes that line did cross my mind. but you have to understand the predicament that it places us in. For Example: How do u know that Sant Giani Maskeen Singh ji is not True saint, you don't , you have accepted him because his teachings and his way of interpetation has touched your heart and change has occured within you becuase of Sant ji. That much at our stage we can define, Truely we dont know who anyone is. One who has found god inside can see god outside. Those on the Path of seeking him may get a glimpse of him, that is all i am trying to say is that you can get a glimpse whether one is a true saint or not. I will post the paragraph when i get home so u can better understand what i am trying to say.

[ms514]

Sat Sri Akal:

Sangat Ji, I think this should be left to the personal preference of the person. If a person wants to matha tek a Sant (with the Hukamnama of the Akal Thakat in mind), fine. If they wish to lovingly call out Fateh to them, fine. Guru Sahib will guide a Sikh to the correct behavior.

[simmal tree]

vwihgurU jI kw Kwlsw!

vwihgurU jI kI &iqh!!

I just wanted to clarify something

the man commonly referred to by our youth as "Maskeen Singh Jee" or "Sant Maskeen Jee"

his name is actually Sant Singh - that's his real name from birth

People sometimes call him "Maskeen" jee

Maskeen means poor person or begger - he called himself this nickname because he didn't want anybody to give him unwarranted praise.

His full name is

Giani Sant Singh Jee "Maskeen"

If you consider him as a Sant, that's great - I am not saying he's not - Just wanted to clarify that his name is Sant Singh

:wub:

Some people are saying Akal Takhat said this and that about sants. If the Sarbat Khalsa gave that hukamnama from the Akal Takhat, then we should follow it for sure. Nobody but the Sarbat Khalsa has the right to give hukams like that.

And as far as the whole topic is concerned - please read Gurbani. Gurbani has the full answer.

____________________________________________________

sathasa(n)gath kaisee jaaneeai ||

How is the Society of the Saints to be known?

jithhai eaeko naam vakhaaneeai ||

There, the Name of the One Lord is chanted.

eaeko naam hukam hai naanak sathigur dheeaa bujhaae jeeo ||5||

The One Name i

s the Lord's Command; O Nanak, the True Guru has given me this understanding. ||5||

_______________________________

in guru granth sahib jee it is written

"santhai charan hamaaro maathhaa.. nain daras dhan dhoor parau"

my forehead is at the feet of the santh, my eyes behold the beautiful vision of the dust of their feet

it also says

"mayraa moond saadh pagaa hayt rulsee ray"

my face rolls in the feet of the saadh sangat

it also says

"kar saadhu anjulee pun vadaa hai || kar dandaut pun vadaa hai"

bow before the saint, it is a pious act. lie flat in submission before the saint, it is a pious act.

it also says

"ham santan kee rayn pyaaray ham santan kee sharnaa"

i am the dust of the saint's feet, i am in the shelter of the saints

it also says

"saajnaa sant aao mayray" so as to mean that the saints are the true friends, and they can be people, which is also proven in the gurbani thuk "santaa(n) naal vair kamaavdae dushtaa naal moh pyaar"

sants are people, sevadaars of akaal purakh

yes - guru jee is the ultimate sant, brahmgyani, bhagat - it says so in gurbani too -- " naanak sa(n)th sa(n)th har eaeko jap har har naam soha(n)dhee ||

O Nanak, the One Lord is the Saint of Saints. Chanting the Name of the Lord, Har, Har, the soul-bride is bountiful and beautiful."

it is important to remember that the light of God can come into a person by Guru's grace and that physical body is not the saint - the soul and the actions of the soul are the saint - the physical human body is just the "chola" or clothing that the saint wears in this world..

a sant has certain qualities

in sukhmani sahib it gives the qualities of "aparas," and "brahmgyani," and "bhagauti" and these are all different qualities of drops in one ocean - "gahar gambheeraa gunee gaheeraa"

bhagat kabeer jee was a sant - as the post above says

for a more detailed definition of what a sant is, there is a shabad in gurbani that perfectly describes it "sant rehat sunho mayray bhaaee || ouaa(n) kee mehimaa kathhan na jaaee ||"

even guru nanak dev jee was so humble, in gauri purbi mahala 5, it is written " naanak dhaas eihai sukh maagai mo ko kar sa(n)than kee dhhoorae ||4||5||"

slave naanak begs for that bliss - make me the dust of the saadh sangat's feet

And it becomes clear in the following thuk that in Gurbani when they talk about Saints they are not ONLY talking about Guru jee. In fact when the Saints come together, it is called Saadh Sangat and being in their company is the real way to reach Guru jee:

sa(n)th sabhaa gur paaeeai mukath padhaarathh dhhaen ||1|| rehaao ||

In the Society of the Saints, the Guru is found. He is the Treasure of Liberation, the Source of all good fortune.

those of you who are worried about offending guru jee by serving a saint

please read from gurbani -

sa(n)th charan gur saevaa laagae thinee param padh paaeae raam ||

Those who are dedicated to the feet of the Saints, and to serving the Guru, obtain the supreme status, O Lord.

and also the following pankiti:

kabeer saevaa ko dhue bhalae eaek sa(n)th eik raam ||

Kabeer, it is good to perform selfless service for two - the Saints and the Lord.

________________________________________________

vaaho vaaho baanee sach hai

please forgive my mistakes

this post was edited 5000 times by khalsapreet in order to try to make himself look smarter... ahaha.....

vwihgurU jI kw Kwlsw!

vwihgurU jI kI &iqh!!

[kaur_khalistani_lioness]

Sat Sri Akal:

Sangat Ji, I think this should be left to the personal preference of the person. If a person wants to matha tek a Sant (with the Hukamnama of the Akal Thakat in mind), fine. If they wish to lovingly call out Fateh to them, fine. Guru Sahib will guide a Sikh to the correct behavior.

waheguru ji kakhalsa waheguru jiki fatehh..

umm wasn't this question asked here so we can talk about it and come to an understanding. i think when we leave the topics like these on individual(s) ..thats when we start seeing difference in panth. one jatha sayin : u souldnt and other jathaa sayin its ok u can if u want to...and so on..

on this form we can put forth our views and find out if wha we think is right or wrong according to rehat and Gur sahib..

i dont knwo if im making anysense..but all im saying is..we should talk about this. i think we have talked about this issue before...

so i would say plz continue onthis topic

bhul chuk muaff karni..

[kaur_khalistani_lioness]

waheguru ji ka khalsa waheguru jiki fatehh

and i would suggest that we read khalsapreet's post again!

[Pheena]

thanks Khalsapreet for the correction.

One question for everyone is that what does a Saint not have that the Guru Granth Sahib has, that has made some of you create a distinction between the 2. The sant is a Sant not because of his clothes but of his Giaan and his Personal experience. The Guru is Giaan, so what is the difference again? Just because that giaan is walking talking in a physical forum, its not right?

One more thing, NO true Saint will every say he is a Saint. That is a major give away to pseudo-saints. A true Saint will claim to be of no one.

Waheguru.

[Jaspaul Singh]

thanks Khalsapreet for the correction.

One question for everyone is that what does a Saint not have that the Guru Granth Sahib has, that has made some of you create a distinction between the 2.  The sant is a Sant not because of his clothes but of his Giaan and his Personal experience.    The Guru is Giaan, so what is the difference again?  Just because that giaan is walking talking in a physical forum, its not right? 

One more thing, NO true Saint will every say he is a Saint.  That is a major give away to pseudo-saints.  A true Saint will claim to be of no one. 

Waheguru.

In my views...

Guru Granth Sahib ji is the perfect one. WHy. Jio has the perfect form of all what waheguru ji is. A Sant gets his or her gyaan from Guru Granth Sahib, making Guru Granth Sahib the more supreme one, cuz all da knowledge comes from guru ji. So which one would u rather follow, the original source, or one who has become a sant after learning from the source.

Another thing, would the 'sant' know all of the knowledge of waheguru ji. Guru Granth Sahib ji is perfect and knows all the characterristics, secrets, sources of waheguru ji.

That is da difference in my opinion.

bhul chuk maph! (Just came out of a midterm, if i said anything wrong forgive me... :e: )

[simmal tree]

if you want to know what's the difference between the GURU, and a human being with a human body but the soul of a saint..

there is only one difference

and you'll find it in gurbani :wub:

bhulaN andar sabh ko

abhul guru kartar

everybody has at least one fault, or has made one mistake, but the Guru and God are free of faults from all time, and forever in the future.

but don't hold a fault against a saint - sometimes we don't understand their mistake, but it's actually Guru jee causing them to make the mistake

jae baahrho(n) bhul chuk boldae

bhee khaRay har bhaaNay

The Saints, even if from outside they say accidentally something wrong or make a mistake - their heart and soul is still following God's Command with full devotion, and God still loves them and is pleased with them.

love the Sikhs - the Sikhs lead you to the Saints...

serve the Saints - the Saints lead you to the Guru...

follow the Guru - the Guru leads you to the Creator...

please forgive my mistakes

vwihgurU jI kw Kwlsw!

vwihgurU jI kI &iqh!!