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Were Sikhs Getting Khalistan In 1947?


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Gurfateh Ji,

the above link provided and whatever written is totally wrong.

i have read the book "Saachi Sakhi" written by Sardar Kapoor singh and it is clearly mentioned in the Book by Bhai Sahib Ji that Sikhs were getting their own country in 1947 starting from borders of Delhi till Nankana Sahib along with a 150 Kilometers belt carved from Present Rajasthan and Gujrat so that the country has access to Sea to make it independent.

But sadly because of the small thinking of Master Tara Singh and Dalbir Singh, the entire nation suffered.

Britain wanted Sikhs to have their own country but our leaders of the time were not that far sighted and Sided with Jawaharlal Nehru and what did the Nation got, nothing.

It is very important to note that why Dalbir singh sided with India and refused own country for Sikhs is because he had personal interests, he had his industries and factories in present day west bangal which he didnt want to lose and i dont want to think but thought comes to my mind because of what Master Tara Singh did is that Master Tara Singh was son of a Brahmin and was a convert to Sikhism.

The Damage he has done to Sikh Nation is not reparable.

i would request the author to read Sachi Sakhi again, i did and i literally cried that how Master Tara Singh and Dalbir Singh destroyed Sikh nation.

Gurfatehji

Daas

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Britain wanted Sikhs to have their own country but our leaders of the time were not that far sighted and Sided with Jawaharlal Nehru and what did the Nation got, nothing.

Its nonsense....British never offered a free state to the Sikhs. There is no record of this.

But as Kapur Singh wrote in his Saachi Saakhi, Muslim League gave a verbal offer to the Sikhs to have a sub nation within Pakistan. And this was never acceptable to the Sikhs, given the history the Sikhs had with Muslim rulers.

Dr. Kirpal Singh, an acclaimed Sikh historian and Head of History Department, Punjab University, who has done thorough research on the Partition of Punjab and has also written a thesis on this subject, also says that there was no such offer to Sikhs. He also says that Muslim League offered a sub state to the Sikhs within Pakistan. That would mean the whole of Punjab would go under Pakistan. The Sikh leaders asked if they have a choice and possibility to come out of this in 10 years if things dont work fine. The Muslim League said, No. The Sikhs asked if they can be given anything in writing on this, and the League didnt agree on this either.

According to him it was wise deicision by the Sikh leadership that they didnt accept Mulsim League's offer of a sub-state.

Rest is history...

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the above link provided and whatever written is totally wrong.

i have read the book "Saachi Sakhi" written by Sardar Kapoor singh and it is clearly mentioned in the Book by Bhai Sahib Ji that Sikhs were getting their own country in 1947 starting from borders of Delhi till Nankana Sahib along with a 150 Kilometers belt carved from Present Rajasthan and Gujrat so that the country has access to Sea to make it independent.

What was the population of sikhs In that area? may be 13% What about rest of 87% Hindu/Muslims would they had accepted sikh rule?even khan abdul gaffar khan demanded pakhtoonistan insteat of Pakistan but he was also forced to join Pakistan.So there was no option to sikhs as The sole criteria set by Britishers was majority.

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i have read the book "Saachi Sakhi" written by Sardar Kapoor singh and it is clearly mentioned in the Book by Bhai Sahib Ji that Sikhs were getting their own country in 1947 starting from borders of Delhi till Nankana Sahib along with a 150 Kilometers belt carved from Present Rajasthan and Gujrat so that the country has access to Sea to make it independent.

NO this is not true.

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British did offer a separate country to the Sikhs and also offered to assist Sikhs run it. I have read thesis and other books of Dr. Kirpal Singh. His sole objective is to convince Sikhs that they made a good choice by siding with India and they belong to India because they were never offered anything by the British. He played a puppet role for his Indian masters. This way he not only undermined the distinct recognition Sikhs had but also rejected the fact that Sikhs deserve their own country. His books were written when Punjabi Sooba agitation was going on premise of which was that Hindu leaders were going back on their words and Sikhs had made a huge mistake by refusing offers of the British. His work is not unbiased. Master Tara Singh and Baldev Singh greatly regretted their mistakes at the end of their lives. They openly claimed that they should’ve taken the British offer. Dr. Kirpal Singh also states that the records of meetings held between Indian leaders and the British are kept secret for 50 years so he did not have access to them at all. Baldev Singh going to England is the clear cut proof that Sikhs were recognized as a separate party. Dr. Kirpal Singh never thinks about the fact that no government would give any option to its state to cede from the union. Does Indian government agree to this proposal today? No. Would USA let Texas cocede? No. Then there is no point in expecting Jinnah to let Sikhs have their own sub-state (which he put in writing) in Pakistan and also give the option to leave whenever they want. It makes no sense. Punjab was exception to the rule of division by majority since Sikhs were living there and the British were willing to get them together in one area where they would make a majority and carve out that area for them but stupid “Sikh” leaders could not get their minds straight about their future plan. Dr. Kapoor Singh is more reliable than Dr. Kirpal Singh since he was an eye witness and had first hand account.

I have at least three books written prior to 1947 on a separate Sikh country and word Khalistan is clearly mentioned in them. Regardless, Sikhs deserve to rule and deserve a separate country be it Sikhistan, Khalsa Raj, Azad Punjab, Republic of Punjab or Khalistan.

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Well there is no proof whatsoever that Sikhs were offered an independent State/Country by the British. And because Sikhs were not in majority both in East and West Punjab this kind of offer wouldnt have been acceptable to either Congress or Muslim League.

Kapur Singh is the eyewitness to what actually happened and hence on Pg 98 of Saachi Sakhi he writes that Jinnah offered a Sub-nation status to the Sikhs within Pakistan, an offer which Sikh leadership rightly denied. So this theory of an offer of a Sub-nation comes from Kapur Singh's own writing.

Still this doesnt deny the fact that Sikhs deserve to have an autonomous state....

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I have at least three books written prior to 1947 on a separate Sikh country and word Khalistan is clearly mentioned in them. Regardless, Sikhs deserve to rule and deserve a separate country be it Sikhistan, Khalsa Raj, Azad Punjab, Republic of Punjab or Khalistan.

Bro, can you give us the titles and authors of these books?

Well there is no proof whatsoever that Sikhs were offered an independent State/Country by the British. And because Sikhs were not in majority both in East and West Punjab this kind of offer wouldnt have been acceptable to either Congress or Muslim League.

Kapur Singh is the eyewitness to what actually happened and hence on Pg 98 of Saachi Sakhi he writes that Jinnah offered a Sub-nation status to the Sikhs within Pakistan, an offer which Sikh leadership rightly denied. So this theory of an offer of a Sub-nation comes from Kapur Singh's own writing.

Still this doesnt deny the fact that Sikhs deserve to have an autonomous state....

The Sikhs were offered an independent state, they were offered to choice to submit a plan for such a state, exactly the same as the Muslim League were allowed to do so.

The British said they would look at any plan on its pros and cons. However as the Sikhs were in a minority everywhere, it was very difficult to do, but not impossible. This plan I beleive was started but was thwarted by nehru. But what is definite is that there was at no time, the denial of a Sikh state from the British either.

My comment was earlier deleated for some reason - I state fact again Tara Singh wa sa co founder of the VHP Vishwa Hindu Parishad - He was an agent from the start

There is proof in a book called Tara Singhs betrayal of the Sikh Nation,I read it at school - and this is in England

Bro, this talk is nonsense. Tara Singh was a political imbecile, but very passionate about Sikh Nation. This talk about him being an agent is just rubbish, just to justify that our leaders were just not up to the standard that nehru, gandhi and jinnah were, so its easier to to call him an agent.

Master Tara Singh FYI was the first person in "free" india to be arrested and charged with treason, and he was never trusted by any indian regime as long as he lived.

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Well there is no proof whatsoever that Sikhs were offered an independent State/Country by the British. And because Sikhs were not in majority both in East and West Punjab this kind of offer wouldnt have been acceptable to either Congress or Muslim League.

Easy to say no proof exists because it requires no effort on your part but explain to me why Kapoor Singh is lying and why Baldev Singh was called to England and then sent message from Churchill to extend his stay two more days after Nehru had left? Jinnah offered a sub-state and Nehru and Gandhi’s statements were in response to that. The only difference was that Jinnah was offering more and in writing whereas Congress was not. If majority rule was applied to Punjab (initially) just like other states then why were these leaders doing their best to win over the Sikhs? Sikhs had some power in Punjab and whichever side they picked could get more area. Sikhs could stand strong on their grounds about a separate country but they did not. They had no plan and no knowledge about running a country. Sikhs had done so much for the British and British wanted to reward them with their own state (no matter how small). Baldev Singh admitted his mistakes after he was kicked out of his position after Nehru’s death. So did Tara Singh. Dr. Kirpal Singh himself admits that not all documents are available and many are kept in safe for at least 50 years. Tara Singh acted on emotions. His knowledge was meager compared to Jinnah, Nehru and Gandhi.

Kapur Singh is the eyewitness to what actually happened and hence on Pg 98 of Saachi Sakhi he writes that Jinnah offered a Sub-nation status to the Sikhs within Pakistan, an offer which Sikh leadership rightly denied. So this theory of an offer of a Sub-nation comes from Kapur Singh's own writing.

Nonetheless, the story is true otherwise why would Nehru and Gandhi offer the same to Sikhs?

I will get the names of the books soon.

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So its clear that this so called offer of an independent state made to the Sikhs is based on speculations.

There is no denial that Sikhs were powerful. There were three main sides (political parties) representing India in any kind of negotiations with the British - Congress, Akali Dal and Muslim League.

As you rightly pointed out, this was the reason both Congress and Muslim league were luring the Sikhs.

It was the general mistrust the Sikhs had with the Muslims which was also influenced by the history they had with the Muslim rulers that they didnt accept their proposal but in turn demanded the partition of Punjab. Even Kapur Singh accepts that decision as fair.

So the answer to the above question, "Were Sikhs Getting Khalistan in 1947?" is NO

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So its clear that this so called offer of an independent state made to the Sikhs is based on speculations.

How is it clear?

There is no denial that Sikhs were powerful. There were three main sides (political parties) representing India in any kind of negotiations with the British - Congress, Akali Dal and Muslim League.

You are contradicting yourself here. If Sikhs were never offered any political sovereignty then why was Akali Dal included in the meetings? Why was it involved in negotiation? There would’ve been two parties only unless you believe Akali Dal and Congress both were representing the Indian side which is not true. If the British had made up their mind to partition Punjab based on majority then involving Akali Dal makes no sense. What were Sikhs beings offered then? It is clear that involvement of the Akali Dal alone proves Sikhs had a say in the matters of Punjab. If Sikhs had demanded a separate country and put their plan correctly they would’ve got it. As Kapoor Singh says the British conveyed this message secretly not officially. British could not give a country if the Sikhs never demanded it. Dr. Kirpal Singh states that the British instigated the Muslims to cause riots but is there any evidence of it in British official records? No. Kapoor Singh was involved in the politics. Hence he knows the inside of it. Again, why is Kapoor Singh lying and why did Tara Singh and Baldev Singh regret their decision afterwards?

As you rightly pointed out, this was the reason both Congress and Muslim league were luring the Sikhs.

But why? Both had no reasons if Sikhs had no power and no say in the matters (according to you). Congress appealing to Sikhs to trust them is proof enough that Sikhs had political recognition and could carve out their country. If the majority rule was the only option then there was no reason for Congress and the League to lure the Sikhs because Punjab was going to be divided according to majority population and Sikhs were not majority on either side.

It was the general mistrust the Sikhs had with the Muslims which was also influenced by the history they had with the Muslim rulers that they didnt accept their proposal but in turn demanded the partition of Punjab. Even Kapur Singh accepts that decision as fair.

He may have accepted decision to side with India rather than Pakistan as fair but the decision itself was not fair to the Sikhs and he never agreed to it.

Sant Sipahi simply wants to wash off Tara Singh’s stains of betrayal and turn their first editor to a “great leader”.

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Please calm down and read me correctly.

What Sikhs could or should have done is a different matter altogether and this is not the discussion of the above question. Sikh leadership could have demanded a separate state. If the Sikh leadership was not smart enough then its our bad luck...Kapur Singh was also in the same team.

But the question is were they getting Khalistan. Not even Kapur Singh accepts that to be true.

Sikhs were powerful and main party because the fate of Punjab was in their hands. If they decided to go with Pakistan, Punjab would remain undivided. Whereas going with India meant Punjab had to be divided as the Muslims wouldnt agree to an undivided Punjab from going to India.

There is no point in repeating things here. I have made my point quite clear. So if you cant read my contentions, then please dont misquote me.

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I am calm. I do not know which part of my post made you think otherwise.

Kapoor Singh was never selected as the leader of the Sikhs otherwise he would have raised the demand for a Sikh country. He tried to convince the Akali leaders but they did not listen to him. I do not think there was anyone in the Sikh community who could outsmart him. He clearly states that the British sent messages (through him) to the Akali leaders that if they raise their demand for a separate country, the British would accept it and this will get them all the area they want to be undivided but if they wish to side with one party then Punjab will have to be divided based on population. British could not force Khalistan on the Sikhs. British wanted Sikhs to raise this demand so it would look like it came from the Sikhs. This is clear enough for me that the British did not ignore the Sikhs and their right to rule. British wanted Sikhs to have a separate country and the opportunity was given but they refused and instead sided with Congress. Dr. Kirpal Singh completely ignores this side of the events. It is foolish to think British had already carved it out and was giving it to the Sikhs. Rather the opportunity was given and British was willing to listen to Sikhs more than Hindus and Muslims in this matter. Alas, it was not meant for Khalsa to have a country given to them. Surely, one day we will have it.

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We get an inkling from ‘Bullet for Bullet’ that the Govt .had authorised the police to move around in what it is called the 'civil dress' in the parlance of forces in uniform. Writes Ribeiro;   “It was commonly said in Punjab that the police were in charge of the rural area of during the daytime. At night the terrorists took over since the policemen were themselves reluctant to face the ' terrorists' bullets rn the dark. A solution to this piquant situation was found after much deliberation and thought. The policemen were permitted to patrol at night in plain clothes.”   Punjabis knew  that they never came across any police in plain clothes during night. All check posts were otherwise manned by uniformed  police men. The only conclusion  that can be drawn is that  the 'kale kachhe  brigade' was the policemen in plain clothes.   RIBEIRO WAS NOT IN FAVOUR OF BLACK THUNDER.   Golden Temple, Amirtsar, April 29, 1986-H.S.Bhanwar of daily Ajit gives a graphic account how the declaration of Khalistan was made from Golden Temple precincts. The 'Panthic Panj Memberi Committee' enters the precincts; wearing pants, shirts and their beard tied up. They change their dress to white cholas, round kesri turbans; to look like Bhindranwale, untie their beards to let them flow. Then a declaration believed to have been vetted in  Buta Singh's office is distributed to press reporters. The statement said that the Khalistan has come into being. Delhi is to be the capital of Khalistan where Hindus have the same rights as the Sikhs. After the declaration the committee members change to their original dress and mix up with the crowd and disappear. The Government had earlier tried to get this declaration made by Baba Joginder Singh father of Sant Bhindrawale and latter by Gurdev Singh Kaonke the Akal Takhat head priest on their refusal this 'committee' was imported from USA. The declaration was important as the government wanted to send police in the Golden Temple through the Akali Govt and justify their own Operation Blue star. It was after this declaration the operation Black Thunder -I was carried out as a result of which the position of S.S.Barnala diluted and he ultimately saw his dismissal. Now see what Ribeiro writes about the incidence;   “On April 29 I was camping at Gurdaspur. ln the middle of night I received a message from headquarters that that Arun Singh, Arjun Singh, and Barnala were on their way to Amritsar by special Plane. Accordingly, my wife and I got into our car and drove down to Amritsar, reaching the airport at about 2 am [night] on 30 April. I met the Chief Minister, Arun Singh and Arjun Singh [who had reached].The Chief Minister told me that he had decided to flush out the terrorist from the temple and that I should carry out the operation next night. Arun Singh added that NSG contingent was being flown into Amritsar during the day. I pointed out to them that terrorists had already left the temple after making announcement of Khalistan. l was told that the government was aware of the development but a message had to be delivered to the separatists which was only possible if flushing operation were undertaken. At midnight the operation was launched. Except for the shooting  of man named Gurdev Singh everything went according to plan. Main criticism of this action was that that the police has not been successful in nabbing the wanted terrorists... ....Giani Puran Singh... had helped the Police to persuade Jathedar Gurdev Singh, the terrorist nominee to surrender.”   Black Thunder episode reveals how the  government plays with the Sikh institutions and how the power hungry Sikh politicians (like Barnala) fall a pray to the government. Unfortunately there have been several Barnalas .   ON POLITICAL SOLUTION   “The Jat Sikh farmer felt some sneaking sympathy for the 'boys' as they were called, because they were their co-religionists, belonging to the same community and because in their estimation they were sacrificing everything including their lives, for their cause. Sacrifice is a concept that is very dear to the Sikh psyche. The Sikh masses have been told that the  government was unjust to them...”   “Even though I said that no political solution, other than that of conceding a separate state, would please the terrorists . I must emphasize that the government was duty -bound to provide inputs that would have coaxed the Sikh masses to join the 'fight against the terrorists.. . ... .The terrorists though in a minority, had guns in their hands. They could shoot innocent people and create terror among Hindus and Sikhs who opposed them. They could target Sikh politicians and send them to hibernation. The only person who could meet them on equal terms were the policemen because they were armed. Hence any talk of political solution which could satisfy them was out of question...The message that they wanted to give to the Akali politicians was that they should not accept any compromise that excluded Khalistan....All talk of political solutions, was therefore academic. The Rajiv -Longowal accord was a very reasonable document. That it was not implemented is sad commentary on the politicians at the Centre as well as Punjab and Haryana.”   Ribeiro tells us how the police employed criminals to infiltrate into the ranks of the militants:-   CATS AND DOGS OF POLICE.   “ln normal day-to-day policing the police use informers to identify and locate criminals. The informers are from the underworld. Law-abiding citizens would never tell who the thieves and robbers are, lt was very  disconcerting when even thinking journalists criticise the police enthusiasm for infiltering the terrorist ranks. How else would the police get information about them...This was not easy.. infiltrating of terrorist groups had to be planned very carefully. The terrorists, would liquidate any traitor to their cause. Only most intrepid of men would volunteer for such jobs for the lure of money or other rewards. People with criminal pasts were approached and a few of them agreed to form groups and confront the real militants in their: dens. It was known terrorists used to visit Golden Temple quite frequently. lf they are identified it will not be difficult to nab them...the problem was the police did not know the identity of the boys"   “Though this brings us quite good results in the beginning, it could not be ,sustained because the people we employed were susceptible to inducements. The police did give them financial and logistical support but their demands grew to an extent where it was impossible to satisfy them within our sources. Besides they were very greedy people , with a criminal tendency, who began to prey on law abiding rich citizens on the assumption that the police were indebted to them and so would do nothing to stop them.”  “IF YOU DON'T ARREST ME PEOPLE WILL SAY I AM A  TRAITOR?”   Ribeiro tells us that at times Akalis were arrested as precautionary measure and this , would cause embarrassment to such leaders ,who were not pro-Khalistan, as they stood exposed.  “When the main leaders were being arrested, Balwant Singh former finance minister was excluded because we felt that he was not really a religious personality, just a businessman politician. Balwant Singh was so upset at not being arrested that he phoned Ray and begged him to have him also locked   conveyed this request to me. Subsequently Balwant was also escorted to prison. They were accorded special treatment so that they did not have to experience the rigours of prison life.”    CATS “There was another undercover operation planned Amritsar SSP lzhar Alam and his companions which was nicknamed 'cats'....whenever some terrorist was caught efforts were made by the police to win them over and they would be induced into our anti-terrorist operations. They were kept at police expense in safe houses and compensated handsomely with money and other incentives. They identified wanted terrorists for us from cars with tinted glasses.”   THE CAT BOOMERANGS “One such criminal was a former smuggler who had close contacts with some leading terrorist groups... was recommended to me by Gur lqbal Singh Bhullar an IPS officer... The smuggler had once been a constable and had been dismissed from service. Gur lqbal came to me with a request to reinstate him in the police because he could locate maximum number of dreaded terrorists also Gobind Ram Bhatti, and lzhar Alam pressed me to agree.”   “Gur lqbal took charge of him at Patiala. He [smuggler] succeeded in rounding up a few known terrorists.[now] Sital Das was appointed SSP of Patiala. He called on me to tell that the ex-smuggler had located some very notorious terrorists at Chandigarh. He wanted permission to use force if necessary.”   “One afternoon l was at lunch at our home in Chandigarh when there was a commotion in the compound. I went out  to investigate and was told that some terrorists [smuggler and his accomplices] had been arrested. The car abandoned in front of the house adjoining mine was the one in which they were travelling.”   “Soon afterwards some body else came to inform me that the persons who had been caught had shot two others on the main road.”   “I myself phoned SSP Patiala and told him what has happened He motored down immediately to Chandigarh and sorted out the matter with the local [Chandigarh] police.”[telling them the smuggler/killer was a police cat.]   [later] “The ex-smuggler had committed a decoity. The SSP Patiala and other police officers were trying to Put restriction  on his movements. They were also asking him to surrender his weapons which he was very reluctant to do. These 'demands were making him desperate and he was now talking of killing the officers.”  “I phoned the SSP to alert him; the ex- smuggler managed to do his worst.' He entered the office of SSP to confront him .The SP was also sitting in the office of SSP at that time. The smuggler shot both these officers at point blank range. On hearing the shots an inspector sitting in the adjoining room came in and shot dead the smuggler on the spot.”   SNATCHING CARS  “Police began to requisition cars of ordinary citizens for the purpose of anti- terrorist operations. lzhar Alam at Amritsar and Sumedh Saini at Ludhiana were the worst offenders in this respect. Frequently people travelling by car were ordered by the police to get down and hand over the keys and I received numerous complaints. One of them was from the Army commander of Western command whose son-in-law was victim. I pulled up these officers. I forbade them to requisition cars in this manner. ln stead I requisitioned a dozen cars from secret funds and placed them at the disposal of these two young officers.”    http://www.punjabmonitor.com/2013/07/ribeiro-on-kps-gill.html
    • Right. Why would they? They live in hindustan. 
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