~~ Individual cultish perception and the khalsa panth ~~

[DalbirSingh]

examples of cult followers

[N30S1NGH]

got to be careful calling out bhindrwaleism you might get death threats primarily due to muhammadenism's influence, isherism is a just an extension of nandsinghism they are nandsinghism followers in spirit and randhirsinghism has the spirit of christianity.

Reject all the jathas as come as individual sikhs.

Don't worry bro i m not against any sant or bhai sahib just reiterating cautions (as mentioned in sri dasam granth ) to idolized followers of these saints to rise above and smell the real coffee, focus on message than messengers. Guru Maharaj gave us blessing to be one with flow of divine than being confined divine in to their fav sant or bhai sahib. If Guru maharaj can set the record straight to millions of hindus around that time to rise above from sargun idiolization of their avtars and rise above from confining vahiguroo to their tribe,tunnel, group, mindset, mahapursh what makes us think guru maharaj would have made any exception to idolized followers of nandsinghism, bhindranwaleism, randhirsinghism, rarasahibism, harkhowalism, bhajanism, dodraism etc etc. I try to state truth and try be candid, and frank as much as possible hope may be we can all transcendent and recognize essence of sikhi beautifully mentioned in sri guru granth sahib ji, sri dasam granth jaap sahib, sri akaal ustat, gyan parbodh. I haven't got any serious death threats yet when i do i will forgive them anyway but if threats directs toward family then will take legal action, go to media, speak to elders/group leaders to reintegrate them back into Gurmat and not aurenzeb sikhi.!!

[Singh559]

examples of cult followers

In before someone claims puratan maryada to justify havan lol. They spelt Sri Guru Gobind Singh ji wrong in first pic (just pointing it out because I noticed it ).

By the way, the first pic seems to be modern day brahman influenced nirmalays, not the original NIrmalay that were rehitvaan panj kakaar wale Khalsa with a specific focus on scholarly activity.

[N30S1NGH]

Yes real nirgun havan is in mind using panj samagri sat santokh dya dharam gyan to destroy panj chor in fire of bhramgyan.. Above is more of sargun version of hom which should be discouraged in the main stream panth as hom along with arti these ritual is at border line of becoming of karam kaand. The whole sikh journey is from sargun to nirgun not sargun to sargun or confined in sargun.

[Singh559]

Yes real nirgun havan is using panj samagri sat santokh dya dharam gyan to destroy panj chor in fire off bhramgyan.. Above is more of sargun version of hom which should be discouraged in the main stream panth as hom along with arti these ritual is at border line of becoming of karam kaand. The whole sikh journey is from sargun to nirgun not sargun to sargun or confined in sargun.

Who defined havan to be a 'sargun' ritual? What other rituals are you talking about in the Sikh journey?

Pointless rituals like havan are pointless because I can say dancing like Michael Jackson is my sargun ritual using panj samagri sat santokh dya dharam gyan to destroy panj chor in fire off bramgyan.

The sweat from doing the Michael Jackson dance is the sargun form of me doing that. Why is using a bic lighter and causing global warming a sargun form and not mine? Racism@!@

[N30S1NGH]

Well its historical fact havan was performed in the past by puratan singhs, check the ethas bro...check with 13mirch he went through ethas and all the other neat stuff..i m not good at history.!!

Found something on it from sarbloh granth:

http://www.sikhawareness.com/index.php/topic/15173-sri-sarbloh-granth/?hl=havan

Another link:

http://www.sikhawareness.com/index.php/topic/14336-did-baba-deep-singh-ji-do-havan/

[Singh559]

The most super duper puratan ithias I need to know is when the pandit went to Dhan Guru Gobind Singh Ji saying he was going to do havan to pargat the devi chandi to get rid of all the Mughals, but a sacrifice of a great Mahapurakh needed to be made like that of Dhan Guru Tegh Bahadur Sahib! Guru Gobind Singh Ji new the trickery of this thug wanna be (much like the people now a days who try to play off havan as some sargun tradition) and said who is a bigger mahapurakh than you Pandit Ji? The Sikhs and Guru Sahib knew that the Pandit intended for Guru Sahib to give himself up because he knows if the cause is for Sat the Guru Sahib would give up their life in an instant, but he also knew that the ritual is pointless AND that the pandit was mischievous.

After Guru Sahib said there is no bigger mahapurakh than you Pandit Ji (hehe), the pandit started to piss himself and said I need until tomorrow. At night he tried to escape and Nihang Singhs caught him and brought him to Guru Sahib where a fire was running. Dhan Guru Gobind Singh Sahib pulled out his Tulvar/Sri Sahib from his miyaan and said this is the only Chandi I worship!

Sat Sri Akaaaaaaluh!!!!!!!!

(sorry for added masala to this ithihaas - please refer to original ithihaas for the more original version lol)

[Singh559]

Svaiyeh wraps it up amazingly! Jin Prem Kiyo Tin Hi Prabh Payo

Vaheguru Ji Ka Khalsa, Vaheguru Ji Ki Fateh

Gurbar Akaaluh Akaal Hi Akaaaal

Jab Lag Khalsa Rahe Niyara. Tab Lag Tej Deeyoh Main Sara. Jab Ehe Gaiyeh Bipran Ki Reet. Main Na Karoun Ihn Ki Parteet.

ਬਾਸ ਕੀਓ ਬਿਖਿਆਨ ਸੋ ਬੈਠ ਕੈ ਐਸੇ ਹੀ ਐਸੇ ਸੁ ਬੈਸ ਬਿਤਾਇਓ ॥
बास कीओ बिखिआन सो बैठ कै ऐसे ही ऐसे सु बैस बिताइओ ॥
He spends his life in such performing evil actions and wastes his life in such pursuits.

ਸਾਚੁ ਕਹੋਂ ਸੁਨ ਲੇਹੁ ਸਭੈ ਜਿਨ ਪ੍ਰੇਮ ਕੀਓ ਤਿਨ ਹੀ ਪ੍ਰਭ ਪਾਇਓ ॥੯॥੨੯॥
साचु कहों सुन लेहु सभै जिन प्रेम कीओ तिन ही प्रभ पाइओ ॥९॥२९॥
I speak Truth, all should turn their ears towards it: he, who is absorbed in True Love, he would realize the Lord. 9.29.

ਕਾਹੂ ਲੈ ਪਾਹਨ ਪੂਜ ਧਰਯੋ ਸਿਰ ਕਾਹੂ ਲੈ ਲਿੰਗ ਗਰੇ ਲਟਕਾਇਓ ॥
काहू लै पाहन पूज धरयो सिर काहू लै लिंग गरे लटकाइओ ॥
Someone worshipped stone and placed it on his head. Someone hung the phallus (lingam) from his neck.

ਕਾਹੂ ਲਖਿਓ ਹਰਿ ਅਵਾਚੀ ਦਿਸਾ ਮਹਿ ਕਾਹੂ ਪਛਾਹ ਕੋ ਸੀਸੁ ਨਿਵਾਇਓ ॥
काहू लखिओ हरि अवाची दिसा महि काहू पछाह को सीसु निवाइओ ॥
Someone visualized God in the South and someone bowed his head towards the West.

ਕੋਉ ਬੁਤਾਨ ਕੋ ਪੂਜਤ ਹੈ ਪਸੁ ਕੋਉ ਮ੍ਰਿਤਾਨ ਕੋ ਪੂਜਨ ਧਾਇਓ ॥
कोउ बुतान को पूजत है पसु कोउ म्रितान को पूजन धाइओ ॥
Some fool worships the idols and someone goes to worship the dead.

ਕੂਰ ਕ੍ਰਿਆ ਉਰਿਝਓ ਸਭ ਹੀ ਜਗ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਭਗਵਾਨ ਕੋ ਭੇਦੁ ਨ ਪਾਇਓ ॥੧੦॥੩੦॥
कूर क्रिआ उरिझओ सभ ही जग स्री भगवान को भेदु न पाइओ ॥१०॥३०॥
The whole world is entangled in false rituals and has not known the secret of Lord-God

[N30S1NGH]

That's great sakhi you may want tell those sargun upasakhs including taksali who lights jots and have Pani, coconuts during akhands patts so they can rise above from it.. I am more attracted aligned towards gyan layer of sikhi which is highest ritual of all put together.

[Singh559]

Guru Sahib didn't say those who live and perform rituals find Vaheguru. This is basic elementary school stuff. Ask any first grader/kindergartener (or even preschooler) what the meaning of that is and what Savaiyeh's message is and they will reaffirm that it means not to perform rituals as such.

Twisting Gurbani to promote Sanatan agenda is horrible.

That's great sakhi you may want tell those sargun upasakhs including taksali who lights jots and Pani during akhands patts so they can rise above from it.. I am more attracted towards gyan layer of sikhi which is highest ritual of all put together.

I'm not AKJ, Taksali or Nihang. Although I love them all lol. Wasn't there a book by Sant Baba Gurbachan Singh Ji Bhindranwale who did khandan of doing jot and thaal pooja?

I can probably copy paste katha by Sant Ji of the respective Gurbani and he will reaffirm the correct interpretation, but I don't think that's necessary.