Should The Amrit Process And Kirpans Be Vetted And Licenced?

[cool water]

I was watching the sikh channel today and noted an interesting discussion they was having regarding the lack of quality of amritdharis who lack sehaj and act like thugs, rudeboys than gursikhs.

Also issue of kirpan came up, giving a scenario of if you was an enemy of sikhs and wanted to give sikhs bad publicity worldwide you'd dress up as a amritdhari sikh and use the kirpan in a wrong manor.

So someone suggested kirpans could be licensed which I personally think is a brilliant idea and there could have a vetting process for amrit so that no rogue unstable people who are without any gyan and lack of saint-soldier qualities is allowed to become a Khalsa. Sikhs who get their kirpans need to value and respect them so they cant be used in an inappropriate manor.

[Cisco_Singh]

It's a great idea, if your going to carry a kirpan you should also be trained in its usage it's a shastar not a symbol as modern amritdharees have made it, this is a very big beadbi of shastar.

Only those who meet the standard and have worked towards living a life of rehit , and have proven themselves to the panj pyarey should be put forward for amrit.

Allowing any unknown person attend a amrit sanchaar where nothing about their lifestyle or character is known is a bad idea.

Amrit is open to all but at least work towards this goal going from zero to amritdhari is very hard.sant sipahi lifestyle is heavily neglected hand in hand with your nitnem you must carry out physical training and lead a lifestyle. I see so many out of shape amritdharees it's embarrassing. The Gurus fauj does not have pot bellys and blunt kirpans. Fix up, shape up

[nameuser]

dont even start this new jhamela veerjee license is not a right it is a grant the governments who so ever the gov may be might say it is a priviledge but it isnt and if u license it then there will be new issue of how much what size, how many kirpans can one bear

ask your self are these the kirpans that guru sahib ji gave us

this might be a new way take away of what is left of our kirpans today

this is what guru sahib ji gave us

Teero, Tufango, Bado Raam Jango, Dhamakhdhaar Aniaar, Kamand Kodaa, Panj Shaster Parvaan.

A spear, rifle, pistol, bow and arrow and a golaa; these five weapons are accepted.

we take aggya from guru ji not governments

please dont even think of licenses and if we do, we ourselves will be responsible of pogroms like november 1984 as the sikhs in delhi requested police help and the police asked them to surrender the kirpans and the police would protect them so the sikhs then did expecting that the police might protect them

cons and only cons of having a license for kirpans

bearing license definetly you wont be allowed the keep more than one kirpan

the govts will have a perfect account of how many sikhs will have how much hand to hand combat weaponry if thats not damascus.

in india if one is a fire arm licensed holder one has to submit the weapon in case of elections so if the kirpans were licensed the police will come to ur residence and will collect ur weapon (kirpan) during election period

a particular size will definetly be introduced as the licenses are made under acts and laws if not introduced initially definetly will be introduced later

by guru sahib jis hukam we are allowed to keep rifles and pistols without license as sikhs during akali satguru sahib sri guru hargobind sahib jis time werent allowed to keep talwar ghod (turang) werent allowed to tie dastar but guru sahib ji gave us the sukh to bear all of them

and

look at us today we cant bear rifiles and pistols without a license and there are laws as to what kind of pistol or rifile license one will be granted one wont be given a license to machine gun or automatics be it anywhere in the world

that is what license will give us

[Jonny101]

Sikhs don't need a worldly government to issue us a worldly licences to carry a kirpan since we have been given a divine licence by none other than Guru Gobind Singh Jee. Allowing a government is issue us licences would set a dangerous precedent. If one government does it, then tomorrow maybe all the governments of the world(including GOI) will also restrict Sikhs from carrying kirpans without their so called permission. During Islamic rule in India, the Muslims had restricted non Muslims from carrying weapons. Only Rajputs were allowed since they served in the Mughal army. But Guru Gobind Singh jee changed all that when He gave hukam to Khalsa to carry Shastars and gave Darshan to that Khalsa who presented himself wearing no less than 5 Shastars.

[Cisco_Singh]

Licencing and vetting by governments is definitively not the way to go. But internal vetting and the quality control by Gurdwaras and panj pyarey is a good idea. Those wanting to take amrit should be assessed and if they are found not quite ready yet they should be helped and support should be made available I.e:maybe a 6 month plan or similar to help them learn rehit and adopt the lifestyle to bring them up to level and make sure they are fully comfortable and understand the gravity of the decision.

[AJ111]

How will it be practical for anyone to vet and licence the select few from millions of Sikhs ? Since we all live in mixed secular societies, the only right for Sikhs should be to carry a blunt and small mock kirpan that cannot hurt anyone. We are not living in medieval times.

A relative of mine (non-Sikh) was involved in a traffic incident with a kirpan wielding Sikh in a rage. He managed to escape alive from that incident but why should he have had to face such danger. It is grossly unfair that a section of the population should be allowed to carry dangerous weapons.

[cool water]

No one is suggesting governments be allowed to vet who can and cannot wear the kirpan. This is an internal sikh religious matter and only Sikhs have the right to decide on how to go about this.

The dangers of allowing just any random rahul, tom or davinder get hold of kirpan via amrit ceremony by wearing dastaar and keeping kesh without the right gyan and respect of siri sahib is pretty obvious. If the kirpan is misused they can do alot of damage to the Sikh identity and our rights to wear this important and valued article of faith.

Therefore in my view it is important the amrit ceremony is made to a very high standard before kirpans are dished out so that only those with sound judgement and mind are given this honour.

There are some scummy brahminwad hindustanis and ravidassia extremists out there (even covert members of this forum) who want the kirpan banned for their own racist religious and political agenda's. Therefore we should not give any reason for the enemies of Sikhi to use any excuse against our rights and religious freedoms.

[Jonny101]

How will it be practical for anyone to vet and licence the select few from millions of Sikhs ? Since we all live in mixed secular societies, the only right for Sikhs should be to carry a blunt and small mock kirpan that cannot hurt anyone. We are not living in medieval times.

A relative of mine (non-Sikh) was involved in a traffic incident with a kirpan wielding Sikh in a rage. He managed to escape alive from that incident but why should he have had to face such danger. It is grossly unfair that a section of the population should be allowed to carry dangerous weapons.

Most Kirpans are blunt. So it's very likely that your relative who was taking Panga with a Singh, would not get hurt by the Sikh even if he used his Kirpan. Of all the incidents where Kirpan has been used, I have rarely if ever seen a case where a person was killed. The common kitchen knife is more dangerous than the kirpan. Should kitchen knives be banned too? Secondly, Sikhi is a timeless way of life. We don't care if it is mid evil times or modern times. The rehit Guru Gobind Singh Jee gave us is relevant today as it was over 300 years ago. Less Sikhs would have been killed in 1984 had they used Kirpans in self defence when people attacked and killed Sikhs in the streets of Delhi.

[POODNA]

Pathetic idea

[garch]

No