Sikhs /Sikhi in UK vs USA

[californiasardar1 201]

On 2/18/2021 at 12:17 AM, Premi5 said:

@GurjantGnostic

@californiasardar

what do you think are the main differences in the way Sikhs are viewed in your country vs UK?

over here, most of the older generations know something about Sikhs  - not everyone for sure, some think we are Hindus or confuse us with Muslims (!) or Arabs(!)

The USA has little connected empirical history with Sikhs and Sikh populations have been generally more spread out.

Also, you have significant white convert population.

Outside of educated types, do you think most Americans don’t know about Sikhs and if so, do they think when they we a turban it is a Muslim? 
 

serious question, as I know Sikhs have experienced significant hate crimes and murders in the US

 

There is a massive difference between the Sikh experience in the UK vs the US. The UK is a much better place to be a Sikh.

The biggest difference-maker is population density.

According to the 2011 census, there were (at the time) about 432,000 Sikhs in the UK. Accounting for some population growth and uncounted people (such as illegal immigrants), there are probably at least 500,000 Sikhs in the UK today. Now take into consideration that the UK has a population of about 67 million crammed into a relatively small island. And also consider that most of the Sikhs live in certain parts of the UK that have relatively large Sikh populations (e.g. West London, Birmingham area, etc.).

There are not official figures on Sikhs in the US, but based on data about people from and Indian background and Punjab-speaking background, 250,000 is probably a very conservative upper bound on the US Sikh population. And then consider that the US is a massive country and has a population of about 330 million.

As a consequence, Sikhs are much less visible and much less powerful (as a community) in the US than they are in the UK. In the UK, I feel like most people have an awareness of who Sikhs are. When I have been in the UK, it is a bit of a relief to not feel like I have to constantly point out that I'm not an Arab or a Muslim. In the US, nobody had a clue what a Sikh was when I was growing up. It is getting a bit better now, but it's still not great.

 

Anyway, aside from how Sikhs are viewed by the general population, I think the population density of Sikhs is most important for the Sikh community itself. It makes for a greater support system for more religiously inclined Sikhs. Further, the critical mass enables people who don't come from religious families to nevertheless gain exposure to Sikhi and get into it as they grow older. That's probably why examples of monay who become Singhs are much more frequent in the UK than in the US.

 

 

[Premi5 389]

On 2/25/2021 at 6:31 AM, californiasardar1 said:

 

There is a massive difference between the Sikh experience in the UK vs the US. The UK is a much better place to be a Sikh.

The biggest difference-maker is population density.

According to the 2011 census, there were (at the time) about 432,000 Sikhs in the UK. Accounting for some population growth and uncounted people (such as illegal immigrants), there are probably at least 500,000 Sikhs in the UK today. Now take into consideration that the UK has a population of about 67 million crammed into a relatively small island. And also consider that most of the Sikhs live in certain parts of the UK that have relatively large Sikh populations (e.g. West London, Birmingham area, etc.).

There are not official figures on Sikhs in the US, but based on data about people from and Indian background and Punjab-speaking background, 250,000 is probably a very conservative upper bound on the US Sikh population. And then consider that the US is a massive country and has a population of about 330 million.

As a consequence, Sikhs are much less visible and much less powerful (as a community) in the US than they are in the UK. In the UK, I feel like most people have an awareness of who Sikhs are. When I have been in the UK, it is a bit of a relief to not feel like I have to constantly point out that I'm not an Arab or a Muslim. In the US, nobody had a clue what a Sikh was when I was growing up. It is getting a bit better now, but it's still not great.

 

Anyway, aside from how Sikhs are viewed by the general population, I think the population density of Sikhs is most important for the Sikh community itself. It makes for a greater support system for more religiously inclined Sikhs. Further, the critical mass enables people who don't come from religious families to nevertheless gain exposure to Sikhi and get into it as they grow older. That's probably why examples of monay who become Singhs are much more frequent in the UK than in the US.

 

 

In California, which groups of people seem to be best aware of Sikhs  - WASP types or non whites (including Mexicans) or is it just based on whether they live near Sikhs?

[GurjantGnostic 1,103]

14 minutes ago, Premi5 said:

In California, which groups of people seem to be best aware of Sikhs  - WASP types or non whites (including Mexicans) or is it just based on whether they live near Sikhs?

Muslims probably win that one. Lol. 

[Premi5 389]

1 hour ago, GurjantGnostic said:

Muslims probably win that one. Lol. 

Any idea if most Americans (who are aware of Sikhi) think of the white Sikhs when they think of Sikhs first rather than punjabis ?

[GurjantGnostic 1,103]

15 minutes ago, Premi5 said:

Any idea if most Americans (who are aware of Sikhi) think of the white Sikhs when they think of Sikhs first rather than punjabis ?

I think Punjabi. 

[californiasardar1 201]

17 hours ago, Premi5 said:

Any idea if most Americans (who are aware of Sikhi) think of the white Sikhs when they think of Sikhs first rather than punjabis ?

 

No (unless they live near the White Sikh headquarters in New Mexico).

 

While Sikhs are a tiny minority compared to Punjabi Sikhs. Most of the white Sikhs are people who were hippies in the 60s and 70s when eastern spirituality was a big thing and they somehow came into contact with "yogi" Harbhajan Singh or other white Sikhs. As far as I am aware, white Sikhs are not really passing Sikhi on successfully to their children/grandchildren. Once that old generation is gone, white Sikhs will probably have an even more negligible presence.

[californiasardar1 201]

19 hours ago, Premi5 said:

In California, which groups of people seem to be best aware of Sikhs  - WASP types or non whites (including Mexicans) or is it just based on whether they live near Sikhs?

 

 

Probably people who live in areas with relatively large numbers of Sikhs (near a major gurdwara, for instance).

But in general, I'd say educated whites are the most likely to have an awareness of Sikhs.

[GurjantGnostic 1,103]

On 3/6/2021 at 9:13 PM, californiasardar1 said:

 

 

Probably people who live in areas with relatively large numbers of Sikhs (near a major gurdwara, for instance).

But in general, I'd say educated whites are the most likely to have an awareness of Sikhs.

Probably and likely are strange words for a californian to use when speaking about their direct experience in the us aren't they?

[californiasardar1 201]

3 hours ago, GurjantGnostic said:

Probably and likely are strange words for a californian to use when speaking about their direct experience in the us aren't they?

I don't understand what you are trying to say

[GurjantGnostic 1,103]

52 minutes ago, californiasardar1 said:

I don't understand what you are trying to say

Just razzin ya bro. 

[ChardikalaUK 198]

Ideally we wouldn't have to run off to these countries.

[dallysingh101 1,981]

On 2/20/2021 at 9:40 PM, GurjantGnostic said:

I get that feeling. I feel like it's because Sikhs face more ignorance and threat here. 

Sikhs faced serious threats and intimidation here in the UK only a few decades ago (70s/80s) too. 

[Ranjeet01 2,097]

Pre-911 what was the status of Sikhs in the US?

[ChardikalaUK 198]

I've been to Los Angeles and New York. A lot of people in New York are aware of Sikhs.

[Premi5 389]

I think as Jews are generally successful / well educated in the US, a lot of them would have an idea about Sikhs