3HO sikhs should re-convert to authentic Sikhi or drop the name

[proactive]

6 hours ago, Jacfsing2 said:

3HO as a whole is a lost cause, but individual 3HO Sikhs can be changed towards Gurmat.

We need to be more pragmatic. Unlike the cults in India such as Nirankaris and the followers of the rapist sadh they do not seek to convert Punjabi Sikhs into their organisation and as far as I know they do not say that they are the REAL Sikhs and we are all fakes as some cults do. Unlike these cults they also do not harbour any animosity towards us. They are following a version of Sikhi which suits them or which they have been taught.  I look at it this way, because we have failed to do parchar of Sikhi in the west and have spent what resources we have to giving out 'free food' and attempting to become the 4th emergency service we cannot expect white people to take to Sikhi on their own.  Due to our failure, what little Sikh influence there has been it has been by Yogi Bhajan and the 3HO. Just by the very fact that we see Goray in Bana normalises out identity in the west, we lose our otherness in the eyes of the ordinary white person when white people also wear the Bana. This isn't ideal but until we have organisations working to preach Sikhi to the west then we need to accept that having 3HO Sikhs is better than no 3H0 Sikhs. The more 3HO Sikhs there are then the better it is for us because if not them, then their sons and daughters will one day become Sikhs like the rest of us. 

 

 

 

[Guest Ex-Gora]

40 minutes ago, proactive said:

We need to be more pragmatic. Unlike the cults in India such as Nirankaris and the followers of the rapist sadh they do not seek to convert Punjabi Sikhs into their organisation and as far as I know they do not say that they are the REAL Sikhs and we are all fakes as some cults do. Unlike these cults they also do not harbour any animosity towards us. They are following a version of Sikhi which suits them or which they have been taught.  I look at it this way, because we have failed to do parchar of Sikhi in the west and have spent what resources we have to giving out 'free food' and attempting to become the 4th emergency service we cannot expect white people to take to Sikhi on their own.  Due to our failure, what little Sikh influence there has been it has been by Yogi Bhajan and the 3HO. Just by the very fact that we see Goray in Bana normalises out identity in the west, we lose our otherness in the eyes of the ordinary white person when white people also wear the Bana. This isn't ideal but until we have organisations working to preach Sikhi to the west then we need to accept that having 3HO Sikhs is better than no 3H0 Sikhs. The more 3HO Sikhs there are then the better it is for us because if not them, then their sons and daughters will one day become Sikhs like the rest of us. 

 

 

 

I agree with most of what you say. At some point in history, the majority of Christians were from Judea, i.e., one ethnic group. Then later on there was a time when Arians, Gnostics, and other sects were predominant in various areas over what we call mainstream Christianity today. The point isn't to say a given religion should necessarily strive to be either homogeneous or heterogeneous ethnically. Neither that Chalcedonian (mainstream) Christianity is better than its extinct rivals. The point is that without parcharaks in the west people won't know about authentic Sikhi.

[Guest Ex-Gora]

Quote

Yogi bahaha even told the 3ho that they have no ties, no responsibility to the Paanth. That it's just brown politics and not to get involved. To ignore the genocide and attack on Harminder Sahib. 

In who's best interest is it that Sikhs don't help each other? Certainly it isn't in Sikhi's interest.

I would guess this has to do with cult dynamics. Isolated followers won't be exposed to alternative points of view. Thus a self-perpetuating in-group culture is established.

[dallysingh101]

35 minutes ago, Guest Ex-Gora said:

I would guess this has to do with cult dynamics. Isolated followers won't be exposed to alternative points of view. Thus a self-perpetuating in-group culture is established.

I would have thought in this day and age, where everyone uses the Interweb to do research, they'd be hard pressed not to encounter alterative points of views? 

[GurjantGnostic]

2 hours ago, Guest Ex-Gora said:

I agree with most of what you say. At some point in history, the majority of Christians were from Judea, i.e., one ethnic group. Then later on there was a time when Arians, Gnostics, and other sects were predominant in various areas over what we call mainstream Christianity today. The point isn't to say a given religion should necessarily strive to be either homogeneous or heterogeneous ethnically. Neither that Chalcedonian (mainstream) Christianity is better than its extinct rivals. The point is that without parcharaks in the west people won't know about authentic Sikhi.

Gnostics predate christianity. 

 

[GurjantGnostic]

2 hours ago, Guest Ex-Gora said:

I agree with most of what you say. At some point in history, the majority of Christians were from Judea, i.e., one ethnic group. Then later on there was a time when Arians, Gnostics, and other sects were predominant in various areas over what we call mainstream Christianity today. The point isn't to say a given religion should necessarily strive to be either homogeneous or heterogeneous ethnically. Neither that Chalcedonian (mainstream) Christianity is better than its extinct rivals. The point is that without parcharaks in the west people won't know about authentic Sikhi.

Real Sikhi is online these days. Many accusations have been launched at 3ho. They're just cultists bro. 

[GurjantGnostic]

And being descended from irish I know full well what groups are capable of. How protestantism is a weapon. 

[GurjantGnostic]

Here's a huge hole in ex-logic. Why am I not in 3ho?

[GurjantGnostic]

Here's another one how can I know this and type it into Google and someone be in 3ho and not know?

 

[Jacfsing2]

3 hours ago, proactive said:

We need to be more pragmatic. Unlike the cults in India such as Nirankaris and the followers of the rapist sadh they do not seek to convert Punjabi Sikhs into their organisation and as far as I know they do not say that they are the REAL Sikhs and we are all fakes as some cults do. Unlike these cults they also do not harbour any animosity towards us. They are following a version of Sikhi which suits them or which they have been taught.  I look at it this way, because we have failed to do parchar of Sikhi in the west and have spent what resources we have to giving out 'free food' and attempting to become the 4th emergency service we cannot expect white people to take to Sikhi on their own.  Due to our failure, what little Sikh influence there has been it has been by Yogi Bhajan and the 3HO. Just by the very fact that we see Goray in Bana normalises out identity in the west, we lose our otherness in the eyes of the ordinary white person when white people also wear the Bana. This isn't ideal but until we have organisations working to preach Sikhi to the west then we need to accept that having 3HO Sikhs is better than no 3H0 Sikhs. The more 3HO Sikhs there are then the better it is for us because if not them, then their sons and daughters will one day become Sikhs like the rest of us.

Here’s the thing, Basics Of Sikhi has been the main group to invite new people towards Sikhi as well as bringing lost people towards Sikhi in the West, not 3HO. 3HO brand usually goes more towards a very Sannatan view towards Sikhi along with elements of Christianity that’s it’s hardly recognizable as Sikhi even amongst some of our most Sannatan Sikhs.