Akj Amrit Sanchaar?

[Heera Singh]

Actually there is a technique given to Amritdharees in how to jap naam, this can only be gotten from Panj Payaray.  This is what Naam Drir is.  No one else can tell you this.  I will not go into detail about this so please don't ask.

VJKK

VJKF

85910[/snapback]

there isn't only ONE way to naam jap... tha's a pretty bold statement.. thats kinda like sayin those who haven't taken amrit from the panj pyaray at an AKJ samagam/raensabhaee do not know the proper technique in doing simran? .. tha's not very logical...

everybody has a diff way of doin simran..some people prefer saas girhaas... some people prefer very slow.. some very fast... some loud.. some soft... simran is simran... as long as we're DOING IT that's what counts..

anywayz.. gettin back to the point..

i think akjforever veerji did answer ur question that they DO practice Naam Drir...

[japmans]

i personally like my naam jap medium-rare with some salt, topped with whipped cream (Eggless of course)

[Singh47]

this is an interesting topic...cuz i've always thought it to be funny that NONE of the purataan sampardhas or jathebandis give naam drirh in the fashion that is given by panj piyaraay associated with the AKJ...

85913[/snapback]

Which "Puraatan" sampradhas are you talking about? Other then the Nihangs, Udasis I doubt anyone else has a truthful claim of being 'puraatan'. Most of the sampradhas which claim to be 'puraatan' are in fact quite modern. Even the real puraatan ones like Nihangs and Udasis keep many anti-Gurmat practices. For example, the Nihangs getting high on drugs(Bhang, and in many cases even Pheem and Sharab), not to mention the way they anoint Nishan Sahibs with the blood of sacrificial animals. The Udasis who are also Puraatan, do anti Gurmat stuff like worshiping Krishan, Shiva, and even Moorti Puja of Hindu dieties. Gurmat is strictly against idol worship of any kind.

So are these the "Puraatan" sampradhas we should be looking up to? I doubt it. If they dont do Naam Drirh, doesnt mean that Naam Drirh is wrong.

[japmans]

For example, the Nihangs getting high on drugs(Bhang, and in many cases even Pheem and Sharab), not to mention the way they anoint Nishan Sahibs with the blood of sacrificial animals. The Udasis who are also Puraatan, do anti Gurmat stuff like worshiping Krishan, Shiva, and even Moorti Puja of Hindu dieties. Gurmat is strictly against idol worship of any kind.

ladies and gentlemen, if you wanna learn how to avoid a topic, please refer to this post that i have quoted

[khalsa mero roop]

Singh learning naam drih helps you do simran all day long, it's amazing.

[Khalsa Fauji]

Gurfateh!!

I've been to so many Akhand Kirtani Jatha Rehnsabhai's and Kirtan Darbars across the UK. I go to enjoy Baani, and i love the whole Sikhitothemax translation projections, i remember before that how Amrit Kirtans werent treated with the right amount of respect at many programs. I also believe its important that we understand what we read so thanks for the sewa coventry lot :TH:

Anyway what i've noticed when the jatha gets into the simran "vibe" is that it seriously can become a frenzy with members of the sangat shaking their bodies and i've seen all sorts. I made a recording of Bhai Jasbir Singh Ji at smethwick once in 2000 and it was amazing i think Bhai Jasbir Singh Ji is superb, but when the simran gets going, it gets to a point where the word Waheguru becomes distorted, and alot of the times the word is pronounced without the bihaari in effect making it Wahguru.

I've heard that a number of Mahapurukhs, have all said that Waheguru should be pronouced in the way its written and also not as though you are shouting it.

Also in this forum i've noticed when the issue of dancing arises people use Tukhs from bani saying how moving the body is wrong and you will not achieve anything from it.

"nachan kudhan man kaa chaao ||

They dance and jump around on the urgings of their minds."

But again i hope im not misinterpretating Bani. (apologies if i am)

I've also noticed that the majority of kirtania don't actually do the whole Saas Girhaas, naan dhrirr, is there any reason for this?

The interpreatation of Saas Girhaas i know is that simran should be done with every breath all day long, as i have known Bhai Amolak Singh Ji to do.

Anyway i mean not to offend anyone and apologies if i have.

Bhul Chuk Maaf

Gurfateh!!

[Guest Akaal108]

Naam Dridh concept that AKJ use is been taken from "Namdharis" and even Namdhari's got it from somewhere....

techniques existed since satyug time..

no one can have monoply over naam dridh....

Naam Dridh became gupt when "Namdharis" start using it... before it was never kept gupt....I reckon AKJ got the whole naam dridh gupt thinge from Namdhari.

[Guest JSS]

Singh47...

I think it's a pretty dumb thing to say that Nihungs get high on drugs...i'd like to ask you how many nihungs you konw that do drugs for recreation...i'm sure there are some that abuse the maryada..but that's a far cry from saying tha Nihungs get high on drugs....

you forgot the other sampardas including sevapanthi, and nirmalas....nirmalas...which are INDEED purataan sampardas....just look into bhai vir singh ji or prof puran singh j's writings...

so anyhow...i must give you props on a clever way of trying to avoid answerin my questions....where did this naam drirh technique arise???...if you say it was totally gurmat from the times of the guru sahib...then it must be written somewhere or practiced by singhs in sampardas of that era...

you have to understand that i'm not attacking naam drirh...just interested in knowing the origins and wanting to see some evidence....your attempts to not answer my question directly would lead others to think that there might not be any evidence.....so why not prove everyone wrong?....

[Singh47]

Singh47...

I think it's a pretty dumb thing to say that Nihungs get high on drugs...i'd like to ask you how many nihungs you konw that do drugs for recreation...i'm sure there are some that abuse the maryada..but that's a far cry from saying tha Nihungs get high on drugs....

It seems you dont go out much, especially to India. I have seen Nihangs in India abusing drugs by getting high on Pheem, DhoDhay and Bhang. I have even seen Nihangs who drink Desi Sharab, one of whom was from my Pend. It seems like western SIkhs have a very romanticized view of the Nihangs as knights in shining armour. Well, sorry to burst your bubble, but that is literally a far cry from reality. I've even had Nihangs coming up to me and asking(more like begging) me for money. In India, the reality is that most people who become Nihangs are young men who dont have any Jameen/Jaidaat or any source of income because they dont wanna work, so they become Nihangs expecting people to automatically give them money. In other words, most of them become beggars.

you forgot the other sampardas including sevapanthi, and nirmalas....nirmalas...which are INDEED purataan sampardas....just look into bhai vir singh ji or prof puran singh j's writings...

so anyhow...i must give you props on a clever way of trying to avoid answerin my questions....where did this naam drirh technique arise???...if you say it was totally gurmat from the times of the guru sahib...then it must be written somewhere or practiced by singhs in sampardas of that era...

you have to understand that i'm not attacking naam drirh...just interested in knowing the origins and wanting to see some evidence....your attempts to not answer my question directly would lead others to think that there might not be any evidence.....so why not prove everyone wrong?....

JSS, my post was NOT intended to prove/disprove Naamdrir being puraatan. I replied to your claim that non of the socalled "puraatan" Sampradahs do Naam Drir, to which I replied that not everything those so called "puraatan" Samradahs do is necessarily in accordance to Gurmat.

As for the origins of the Nirmalas, well I highly doubt that they are from the times of Dasam Pasha. To begin with, the earliest mention to the Nirmalas is from sources dating to the late 18th century(many,many decades after Dasam Pita left his worldly body). Furthermore, according to the Nirmalas, they were created when Dasam Pita sent five Jat Sikhs to Banaras to learn Sanskrit. Also, why would Dasam Pasha send five "Jats" to Banaras? does this mean that Dasam Pasha acknowledged a Sikhs caste even after they took Amrit? and why would Dasam Pasha send them to Banaras to learn Sanskrit, when the most learned of Pandits in India were the Kashmiri Pandits, who were considered the cream of Brahman society.

Same thing with the Seva Panthis. I highly doubt Dasam Pasha would have started a Panth like the seva Panthis who wear Topis(hats) and dont even wear Kasharas. It is simply a matter of one using God given logic to make sense out of things.

[Singh132]

The technique to meditate on naam, preserved in amrit sinchaars organized by AKJ has many historical references.

Sant Teja Singh MA (successor of Sant Attar Singh) has written an article on this topic. In it, he tells, "In Sau Sakhi its says that Guru Gobind Singh Ji Maharaj tells Mata Jeeto Ji that the tip of the tounge (jeeb di teesy), with force (jor naal), should touch the roof of the mouth (taloo naal), and at all times keep saying Vahiguru Vahiguru."

Also, he describes how Bhai Mani Singh in Bhagat Ratnavali, in the sakhi of Sheehan and Gajjan, he writes that Guru Nanak Dev instructed them, "when our breath goes in we should say 'Vahi' and when our breath goes out we should say 'guru'"

You can check this in Sant Teja Singh's biography of Sant Attar Singh on page 305.

Also, in Prem Sumaarag Granth, an older rehitnama it gives the insturction: "oupar saas naabh tay "vaah" say layvai, ar talay kaa saas "guru" say chhoDay. Vahiguru daa jap karai."

Now to be clear, only Panj Pyaaray can teach this in hazoori of Satguru Granth Sahib and there are things involved that you can't read and understand. You cannot read about naam and think that you "know" the method. It is taught by the Panj Pyaaray and involves more than what is written.

Also, Shaheed ji, no one believes the dasam duaar is between your eyes, so why focus there? Only radha swamis have made this place a popular point to focus on. Anyways, how can you focus on something you are not aware of ?

But beyond that, all I can say is, if you don't know where to focus when japping naam or don't know what naam is, then it would be beneficial to go to the punj pyaaray and get this gift.